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makaikishi: I don't get it, VtmB was a political game to begin with. There were also characters who were lesbian / gay as well. It puzzles me that this generation's more sensitive to these issues of "diversity" yet they're no different from the "Nazis" that they so despise when they attack people who have different opinions.

I never bought games again from companies that insult their audience ever since this bullshit "progressiveness" started to infect the Western world.
I'm right there with you till you use the word 'progressive' strangely. What does it mean in your country?
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makaikishi: I don't get it, VtmB was a political game to begin with. There were also characters who were lesbian / gay as well. It puzzles me that this generation's more sensitive to these issues of "diversity" yet they're no different from the "Nazis" that they so despise when they attack people who have different opinions.

I never bought games again from companies that insult their audience ever since this bullshit "progressiveness" started to infect the Western world.
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alcaray: I'm right there with you till you use the word 'progressive' strangely. What does it mean in your country?
FYI, the word was "progressiveness" (in qotes btw), not 'progressive'. Yes, ther IS a difference.
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alcaray: I'm right there with you till you use the word 'progressive' strangely. What does it mean in your country?
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LootHunter: FYI, the word was "progressiveness" (in qotes btw), not 'progressive'. Yes, ther IS a difference.
All right, then what does "progressiveness" mean in your country. In mine it just means the quality of being progressive. Also in my country the word has political overtones. But those overtones seem to put it in agreement with the rest of your post.

Political definitions in different countries slide and are sometimes even reversed (compare what the word 'conservative' means in USA, Germany, and Russia for an interesting afternoon, for example). That's why I asked.
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LootHunter: FYI, the word was "progressiveness" (in qotes btw), not 'progressive'. Yes, ther IS a difference.
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alcaray: All right, then what does "progressiveness" mean in your country. In mine it just means the quality of being progressive.
No. In your country "progressiveness" means pretending of being progressive by attacking traditional values and making up accusations about how modern society oppresses various "marginalized groups". At least that's what general consensus in my country is.

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alcaray: Political definitions in different countries slide and are sometimes even reversed (compare what the word 'conservative' means in USA, Germany, and Russia for an interesting afternoon, for example). That's why I asked.
Yeah, I know. In Russia 'conservatives' are communists, who want to return to the glory of USSR. Though even them consider marxists (that are 'progressives' in US and Europe) crazy.
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LootHunter: FYI, the word was "progressiveness" (in qotes btw), not 'progressive'. Yes, ther IS a difference.
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alcaray: All right, then what does "progressiveness" mean in your country. In mine it just means the quality of being progressive. Also in my country the word has political overtones. But those overtones seem to put it in agreement with the rest of your post.

Political definitions in different countries slide and are sometimes even reversed (compare what the word 'conservative' means in USA, Germany, and Russia for an interesting afternoon, for example). That's why I asked.
--- and that is exactly why the terms should never be used - there is no concenus even within a single country on what it actually means. Originally , in France, where the terms originated, right wing meant monarchist and left wing jacobin. They actually set to the left and right within the Estates General. I tend to assign (and that's just me) leftists as socialists and rightists as capitalists.
In the USA, the progressive movement was constituted with mainly socialists and had a loose definition - with Teddy Roosevelt and Woodrow Wilson being called progressives. The term fell into disuse after WW II due to the progressives having favored the nazis prior to the war and FDR's use of the socialist candidates platform as his "new deal" winning over factory workers to a new, modified form of capitalism. Only fairly recently has it come back into use.
Post edited September 18, 2019 by lordhoff
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LootHunter: No. In your country "progressiveness" means pretending of being progressive by attacking traditional values and making up accusations about how modern society oppresses various "marginalized groups". At least that's what general consensus in my country is.
I agree. Taking a look at the political and social climate of the US, "progressiveness" now means blaming all males while pandering to the "man / straight-gender haters" in order to advance the agenda of "social justice." It also means that LGBT parents can now change the gender of their children without their consent. And let's not forget that being morbidly obese is the new "sexy" while the same whales body-shame those people who are fit.

Yeah, my country sucks balls as well but at least we didn't make a shaving commercial telling men that they're the main problem of society.
Post edited September 17, 2019 by makaikishi
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LootHunter: No. In your country "progressiveness" means pretending of being progressive by attacking traditional values and making up accusations about how modern society oppresses various "marginalized groups". At least that's what general consensus in my country is.
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makaikishi: I agree. Taking a look at the political and social climate of the US, "progressiveness" now means blaming all males while pandering to the "man / straight-gender haters" in order to advance the agenda of "social justice." It also means that LGBT parents can now change the gender of their children without their consent. And let's not forget that being morbidly obese is the new "sexy" while the same whales body-shame those people who are fit.

Yeah, my country sucks balls as well but at least we didn't make a shaving commercial telling men that they're the main problem of society.
Re: USA comments: very similar to how things were in Rome prior to it's civilization collapse and the dark ages. As an American, it's very disturbing to me how far we have left common sense and reason behind and rely almost entirely on emotional responses.
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lordhoff: Re: USA comments: very similar to how things were in Rome prior to it's civilization collapse and the dark ages. As an American, it's very disturbing to me how far we have left common sense and reason behind and rely almost entirely on emotional responses.
It's sad that history repeats itself, I blame the ones who've always taught their children that they are always a "winner" no matter how shitty they are in life. As a result, they become entitled to anything that they want in general and have no particular drive to improve themselves because they feel that they know everything "since it's on the internet." Just take a look at their online comments - I feel my brain cells are dying every time I read about how woman feel empowered by making men feel worthless in life. No wonder MGTOW was formed.

Even colleges, F'KING COLLEGES, are using gender studies to promote their totalitarian society that they believe will benefit the whole country. Brainwashing young people to follow one train of thought and oppose all those who have different opinions. I don't see "progressiveness" here, it's just people going back to the 1930's and then eventually into the stone age.
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Wow, look at all the reactionary gameboys. It's almost like you are..

...being offended!
Post edited December 23, 2019 by lace_gardenia
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lace_gardenia: Wow, look at all the reactionary gameboys. It's almost like you are..

...being offended!
Wow, look at all progressive gameboys! It's almost like you are..

...being afraid no one bows to your agenda!
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lace_gardenia: Wow, look at all the reactionary gameboys. It's almost like you are..

...being offended!
Not at all offended; just sad at the state of things in my country as it sinks to new lows.
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If that is the case, what are you even worried about?

(I'lll gladly take the title of "progressive gamegirl" though)
Post edited December 23, 2019 by lace_gardenia
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Yeah, trump has really lowered the bar, hasn't he?
Post edited December 23, 2019 by lace_gardenia
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lace_gardenia: If that is the case, what are you even worried about?

(ill gladly take the title of "progressive gamegirl" though. thanks :)
I'm worried of being forced to play games I do not like.

(You welcome to the title, wish you all the best with it - and no, no sarcasm here.)
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lordhoff: Not at all offended; just sad at the state of things in my country as it sinks to new lows.
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lace_gardenia: Yeah, trump has really lowered the bar, hasn't he?
No, the real decline was during the GHW Bush/Clinton years but really went down hill during the disasterous Obama presidency. Trump is a result of that, voted in hoping for change but when someone who is not Republican or Democrat wins a national election, both parties are against him and any change is blocked. That's why I did not support him in the primaries. If nothing else, he has surely shaken up the status quo.
Post edited September 29, 2019 by lordhoff