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LeonardoCornejo: Well, you got some points there. Therefore I must sum it up in a civil way. The game is overpriced, most people (I don't assume you do) just praise it because there are non straight characters in the story, the story is rather generic and full with political stuff.
Therefore is not that good, and the price is too high. And considering those are Hatred's main weaknesses it makes me feel rather frustrated to think Hatred got rejected when other games which belong to th same tier in respect of quality and excessive price got released.
Now, as long as depression quest stays away from GOG I think there will be some balance in the world.
I don't agree. I did not really care that much about the story as such as all, though it was good in its own way. I liked Gone Home for daring to do something new with the medium, and as an experiment in implicit narrative it is really well made and very good.
Post edited May 30, 2015 by amok
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LeonardoCornejo: Well, you got some points there. Therefore I must sum it up in a civil way. The game is overpriced, most people (I don't assume you do) just praise it because there are non straight characters in the story, the story is rather generic and full with political stuff.
Therefore is not that good, and the price is too high. And considering those are Hatred's main weaknesses it makes me feel rather frustrated to think Hatred got rejected when other games which belong to th same tier in respect of quality and excessive price got released.
Now, as long as depression quest stays away from GOG I think there will be some balance in the world.
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amok: I don't agree. I did not really care that much about the story as such as all, though it was good in its own way. I liked Gone Home for daring to do something new with the medium, and as an experiment in implicit narrative it is really well made and very good.
Well, you like it, that does not make it good. I like Ricardo Arjona's songs and I admit they suck.
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amok: I don't agree. I did not really care that much about the story as such as all, though it was good in its own way. I liked Gone Home for daring to do something new with the medium, and as an experiment in implicit narrative it is really well made and very good.
Yes, that's what I wanted to say and then got carried away with story discussion. I liked how the game presented the story more than anything else, the storyline itself, while well-written and nicely delivered, wasn't that great all by itself. Individually, none of the game's mechanics and ways of presentation were innovative, when put together tho, they made a nice, coherent and very different whole. It was a good experience-game-thing.

And my other point I wanted to make in the first place was that Hatred doesn't do any of that - it's not even unique in its own way, as any GTA clone will offer you just about the same experience. I guess I'll wait until actually playing it when it's very discounted to make this a final statement tho.
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amok: I don't agree. I did not really care that much about the story as such as all, though it was good in its own way. I liked Gone Home for daring to do something new with the medium, and as an experiment in implicit narrative it is really well made and very good.
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LeonardoCornejo: Well, you like it, that does not make it good. I like Ricardo Arjona's songs and I admit they suck.
oh, It makes the narrative structure very good indeed. For what it is, it is a very good (non-)game, and a highly successful experiment. You may not like it, but it does not change this.
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amok: I don't agree. I did not really care that much about the story as such as all, though it was good in its own way. I liked Gone Home for daring to do something new with the medium, and as an experiment in implicit narrative it is really well made and very good.
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Fenixp: Yes, that's what I wanted to say and then got carried away with story discussion. I liked how the game presented the story more than anything else, the storyline itself, while well-written and nicely delivered, wasn't that great all by itself. Individually, none of the game's mechanics and ways of presentation were innovative, when put together tho, they made a nice, coherent and very different whole. It was a good experience-game-thing.

And my other point I wanted to make in the first place was that Hatred doesn't do any of that - it's not even unique in its own way, as any GTA clone will offer you just about the same experience. I guess I'll wait until actually playing it when it's very discounted to make this a final statement tho.
after seeing some game-play videos of Hatred, the only feeling I have of it so far is "grey"....

at least GTA left a feeling of "fun" (except GTA IV, which was boring, and I have not tried V yet).
Post edited May 30, 2015 by amok
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LeonardoCornejo: Well, you like it, that does not make it good. I like Ricardo Arjona's songs and I admit they suck.
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amok: oh, It makes the narrative structure very good indeed. For what it is, it is a very good (non-)game, and a highly successful experiment. You may not like it, but it does not change this.
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Fenixp: Yes, that's what I wanted to say and then got carried away with story discussion. I liked how the game presented the story more than anything else, the storyline itself, while well-written and nicely delivered, wasn't that great all by itself. Individually, none of the game's mechanics and ways of presentation were innovative, when put together tho, they made a nice, coherent and very different whole. It was a good experience-game-thing.

And my other point I wanted to make in the first place was that Hatred doesn't do any of that - it's not even unique in its own way, as any GTA clone will offer you just about the same experience. I guess I'll wait until actually playing it when it's very discounted to make this a final statement tho.
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amok: after seeing some game-play videos of Hatred, the only feeling I have of it so far is "grey"....

at least GTA left a feeling of "fun" (except GTA IV, which was boring, and I have not tried V yet).
Ranting about personal likes and dislikes is a waste of time and energy. One I often take part in. However, that does not change the fact that it is overpriced and not exactly everyone's favorite. Just like Hatred.
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LeonardoCornejo: Ranting about personal likes and dislikes is a waste of time and energy. One I often take part in. However, that does not change the fact that it is overpriced and not exactly everyone's favorite. Just like Hatred.
I did not think it was overpriced at all. I am quite pleased with what I payed for it. But yes, it is not everyone's cup of tea, but that does not make it neither over-priced nor bad, it makes it niche. And yes, Hatred is also most probably a niche game.

But I also do think that as a niche game, Gone Home works better as it is experimental and, I think, furthers the medium. Hatred, on the other hand, as far as I can see, do not bring anything new to the table, except some controversy (which is mostly created around the game, not by the game) .
Post edited May 31, 2015 by amok
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LeonardoCornejo: Ranting about personal likes and dislikes is a waste of time and energy. One I often take part in. However, that does not change the fact that it is overpriced and not exactly everyone's favorite. Just like Hatred.
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amok: I did not think it was overpriced at all. I am quite pleased with what I payed for it. But yes, it is not everyone's cup of tea, but that does not make it neither over-priced nor bad, it makes it niche. And yes, Hatred is also most probably a niche game.

But I also do think that as a niche game, Gone Home works better as it is experimental and, I think, furthers the medium. Hatred, on the other hand, as far as I can see, do not bring anything new to the table, except some controversy (which is mostly created around the game, not by the game) .
True, but my point was that refusing to release hatred seems to be an unwise decission since games which could be considered similar in different ways, from being niche, to being very violent, have been released.
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amok: I did not think it was overpriced at all. I am quite pleased with what I payed for it. But yes, it is not everyone's cup of tea, but that does not make it neither over-priced nor bad, it makes it niche. And yes, Hatred is also most probably a niche game.

But I also do think that as a niche game, Gone Home works better as it is experimental and, I think, furthers the medium. Hatred, on the other hand, as far as I can see, do not bring anything new to the table, except some controversy (which is mostly created around the game, not by the game) .
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LeonardoCornejo: True, but my point was that refusing to release hatred seems to be an unwise decission since games which could be considered similar in different ways, from being niche, to being very violent, have been released.
or, maybe that just the gOg reviewers playing the game found Hatred to be very mediocre, repetitive and glitchy? Which really have no impact on any of this at all? gOg, after all, do refuse games every day - why should they treat Hatred different than any of the other 1000's of games they refuse to sell?

edit - as a footnote - you could say that within it's niche Gone Home can be said to be an exceptional game, Hatred may be mediocre in its niche...
Post edited May 31, 2015 by amok
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amok: edit - as a footnote - you could say that within it's niche Gone Home can be said to be an exceptional game, Hatred may be mediocre in its niche...
To be fair, you seem to be the one using the word "mediocre". The reviews and playthroughs I've read and seen seem to imply it isn't groundbreaking, but works as well as any other twin-stick shooter.
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amok: edit - as a footnote - you could say that within it's niche Gone Home can be said to be an exceptional game, Hatred may be mediocre in its niche...
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RWarehall: To be fair, you seem to be the one using the word "mediocre". The reviews and playthroughs I've read and seen seem to imply it isn't groundbreaking, but works as well as any other twin-stick shooter.
I have also seen words such as "lukewarm", "tedious", "not bringing anything new to the genre", "repetitive" etc. and so far the only reviews on Metacritic is 55 and 65. We need to wait a bit more for aggregated critic scores (though off course this is only an indication), but so far this all points to mediocre to me. Maybe it will change with patches? I don't know, but that is the feeling I get from play-hroughs and reviews.
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amok: I don't agree. I did not really care that much about the story as such as all, though it was good in its own way. I liked Gone Home for daring to do something new with the medium, and as an experiment in implicit narrative it is really well made and very good.
That's actually my biggest gripe on this game. You can argue until you are blue in the face about the story, tech and visuals, different tastes and expectations and stuff, but the subject of innovation is rather more objectively defined. So what the fuck did this game dared to do new? Where the devs took a chance, tried to innovate? They played it as safe as it gets. It's the care-bear of game development.
Why do people conjure up praise out of thin air? Why you try to present the game as groundbreaking high art?
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amok: I don't agree. I did not really care that much about the story as such as all, though it was good in its own way. I liked Gone Home for daring to do something new with the medium, and as an experiment in implicit narrative it is really well made and very good.
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AndyBuzz: That's actually my biggest gripe on this game. You can argue until you are blue in the face about the story, tech and visuals, different tastes and expectations and stuff, but the subject of innovation is rather more objectively defined. So what the fuck did this game dared to do new? Where the devs took a chance, tried to innovate? They played it as safe as it gets. It's the care-bear of game development.
Why do people conjure up praise out of thin air? Why you try to present the game as groundbreaking high art?
or just make a good game? so far non reviewers I know have actually called it a good game. Good engine, yes, good physics and the environmental destruction is very well implemented, but is there actually a good game in there?

sorry, I misunderstood. You meant Gone Home. They experimented with narrative structures. Most of the narratives in Gone Home is told implicitly, as opposed to explicitly as in most games. You could argue that video games as a medium is the only medium very implicit narrative can drive the narrative completely, still most do it explicitly. There are in fact several narratives in Gone Home, not just the main on, but they are implicitly told, and quite a lot of the main narrative also. You can say that the narrative in itself is quite 'care-bear", but the delivery was experimental.

As an experiment in explicit narrative it worked very well, and I have seen several developers taking note of it and discussing ways of implementing more implicit narratives in games, which I think is a good way forward. This is a game which already have had an impact on game development on future games.
Post edited May 31, 2015 by amok
Oh, nevermind...
Post edited May 31, 2015 by Dalswyn
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Licurg: The pre-order is already available on Desura, anyone know if it's coming here ?
Why has this post got such a low rating?
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Licurg: The pre-order is already available on Desura, anyone know if it's coming here ?
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Magmarock: Why has this post got such a low rating?
Because internet arguments.