:facepalm:

Well, can't say I didn't try.
Spinefarm makes some good points on occasion but clinging to these generalizing beliefs is just as bad as the other side's own generalizations which I(and he as well, i'm guessing) loathe to no end.

The diff is one thing Pirate is not a bad word... but extremist/lowlife and thief are ;) That's why I put him with the rest of the bunch ;)

Yeah.. it really would be better if you could debate without namecalling wouldn't it.

Extremist isn't a bad word if used correctly. You are acting a bit too extreme(and closeminded in some ways), dude....just saying. :\

Also he didn't DIRECTLY call you a lowlife......he used it in a hypothetical sentence. He also did the same with the word thief, by using it in a turn of phrase, to ask a question.

>.<

"being the same lowlife you are, doesn't it ? "
Maybe I have to recheck my english,but this looks like pointed to my end of the conversation. Anyways everybody can have a POV. And if I recall correctly there is freedom of speech. For me pirates are not bad people. But hypocrats and puritans are funny people ;)
Nice :)

The way he wrote it(coming from a native English speaker such as myself) I can assure you it wasn't directed at you. ;)

And c'mon, if you want to be listened to and taken seriously you have to know when to joke and when not to.......and calling people names over and over again & spouting generalizations about the other side isn't helping win people to your side or causing them to rethink their ways of thinking about things. (Heck it's the same tactics alot of antis use[some did it in this thread towards you and me, and others who pirate] and I find it just as shitty a tactic when they do it.)

"Being unscrupulous is better than having remorse" - this, in a nutshell, is what spinefarm is arguing for (among other things).
He's struggling to prove that, at the very least, everyone HERE is a pirate (and it's a black-and-white thing: a single illegal download in your lifetime and you ARE one, according to him). Once he ascertains that, he believes that suddenly NO ONE here has the right to prove that piracy (in any shape or form) is evil. Why ? Because that would make them hypocrites and - as he nonsensically implies - what hypocrites say is worthless. Once we reach THIS point, suddenly - he's not a bad person since everyone else is the same.
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If you find all of the above mind-boggling - congratulations.

Also - and these things (generalized) apply to all discussion - keep the "goal-posts" in mind, GR. You've attempted to prove to this guy that "everyone is a pirate" is false, using a very wide definition of piracy (note - once it gets too wide, it ceases to be useful ! Use common sense to only use words in a sense which makes a given conversation meaningful). Bear in mind that even if literally every person on the planet was a pirate, it doesn't make piracy more or less wrong than it was before (please don't go down the postmodern subjectivist route - it leads to a dead end). Think about the next level - even if THIS is right and you can agree with him - what's the next step of the reasoning ? What does IT hinge on ? Sure - you can try to find the "highest" level and attempt to disprove it (as I often catch myself doing) but it's a lot more convincing to (if possible):
* disprove highest-level statement being factually or logically true.
* disprove the reasoning leading from the highest-level premises one level down
* keep disproving statements (factual and conditional) though "Suppose that you were right to say that X (even though I've already argued for it being wrong) - this still doesn't mean that Y because (...)".
* point out hidden assumptions and all other bs you can find. If you truly want to be thorough - go through every step to dismantle a fallacious argument.

I don't have the stamina for this, especially since this only works as long you are dealing with a smart, logical and reasonable individual who wants to listen. So - though you may be biased in a way I might disagree with - if you want to carry on this conversation, I wish you the best of luck and - once again, though more overtly this time - I'd like to compliment your mental fortitude. Using all one's intellectual prowess to force an agenda is one thing but to spot something, go "that's not right :|" and selflessly argue against falsehood only in the name of truth... that's a pursuit I find noble and worthy of praise :). glhf

People are just angry that someone downloaded a game and they pay for it. That is the whole issue :) I have my POV and I will not change it for someone to like me or hate me :)
And this coming from a guy living in a country famous for pirating stuff from the internet :) And yes 1 mp3 downloaded make you a pirate or there is a difference between stealing 1 car or 10 cars.
Start reading now - I never stated piracy is something right. But stating that pirates are lowlife,extremist....stuff like than don't make you look smarter...neither wrighting long posts ;)

Both sides(Some members of both, anyways.) seem to employ such black/white reasoning on many occasions.

That's part of why I aim to try to educate and inform where I can, on BOTH sides. If we MUST be on opposing sides and argue i'd hope we all can at least do it as factually as possible, without resorting to too many generalizations & other lower forms of "debate".
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Thanks...the compliment is appreciated. :)

Some might be, but I don't think all are. I think more are just frustrated at how you choose to tackle the debate on this in this thread. Repetitive and generalizing come to mind as key terms when discussing some(not all, mind you) of your posts here.

And you don't have to change if you don't want to, but trying different tactics might help if you're truly trying to convince people of what you're trying to say.
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Again, he wasn't calling you those things directly, and he writes long posts because he likes to write...like I sometimes do. ;)

Rager I don't have a problem with people have an opinion. I have a problem with people coming here stating pirates are some type of bad people.
Piracy in general is not good for the guys making games/music/movies/software . And to be honest not directly to them...it hurts the publishers. Still I think piracy helps popularity of the product then hurting it(Not including AAA games/movies)

The whole thread started on a wrong foot. I know verry well the site from OP's post. And to be honest I do like it. A lot of the games there I've never played in my life and if this is my chance to play them Hell yeah I will pirate them.
About the GOG version of the games on that site. With download numbers so low I do think they help more than hurting GOG sales.

I also don't like it with people saying(as if they know it to be fact) that ALL pirates are as bad as those who do it to be jerks......but if some want to think i'm bad for pirating then that's their belief & not mine so i'm ok with it. If they make some logical fallacy or state something that's untrue factually then I try to correct them, though.

Still, if you want to state your point then fine....just be sure to state it in a way that benefits you the most(write it civilly and without too many mistakes or logical fallacies like stating "everyone is pirate/etc"). You are free to write it any way you want, however, should you be willing to accept the consequences(Like not being taken as seriously, etc).




I know one possible reason: Addiction. Some just love to collect things...be it stamps/books/games/etc...even if they don't play them. I suffer this too to some extent.

No you are not offending me. The only games I've pirated recently are some SNES/PSX titles. And I don't pirate them just for the pirating. I play different games depending on my mood ...

Actually I didn't pirate a PC game for more than an year...

Some would consider us all as bad, or that all who pirate also sell copies/etc. It's those I take offense to, not people who just dislike that I and others pirate.
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What if there were no distributors(not ones who do to sell copies they've pirated, I mean.....or those doping so on a massive scale)? How would people be able to pirate then? Just quick questions.
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I will still pirate everything I can before tomorrow, out of spite....heck i'd pirate your home and car if I could...unless they're shite.(I kid, I kid.)

This stated a big part of my point ...