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Fairfox: Hated Fade to Black.
Glad to see I am not alone after all. I usually have seen just praise for that game, but I recall total boredom playing it. And I think I am pretty good at enduring even boring games. Come to think of it, I did finish it, but god damn it...

I don't recall exactly what was wrong with it, just... so... bored... I still have the CD somewhere, maybe I need to retry it to remember. Or maybe not. :)

Then again, I don't recall really enjoying Flashback either, which I guess this game is a sequel to. "Another World" though, I loved it. I guess the reason why I wanted to like Flashback and Fade to Black as I thought they are some kind of spiritual successors to Another World, or something.
Post edited September 15, 2015 by timppu
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dtgreene: Also, the game has the same setting problem of FF6; the game does not feel like a Final Fantasy game *at all*. Where are my white and black mages?
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TentacleMayor: What, you wanted them to stick with the same old tropes for decades? I'm glad they took the series in a new direction, 6-8 are the series highlights and 9 is a fine reboot. After that began the decline.
Actually, I just think that, after having creating a wonderful entry in the series (FF5), that they should have refined the formula instead of throwing it away.

Also, one other issue with Final Fantasy 6-8 (but not 9) is that you don't have specific roles for characters. In 6 you do have the two characters with healing magic early on, but that distinction goes out the window once you get Espers. In 7 and 8, you don't even have that. 5's system, however, encourages characters to fill defined roles, because there aren't enough ability slots to get someone who can do everything.

One other random note: Anyone else bothered that the strongest buyable healing item in Final Fantasy 6 is so weak lategame that it might as well not exist at that point?
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mobutu: World of Warcraft
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MarioFanaticXV: And on that same note, I'd like to add:

Star Wars: The Old Republic

Seriously, why? The second game did so much in redeeming the first, and then... Bioware threw a tantrum and completely destroyed any hope the series had at a decent story.

On other unrelated notes, I'd like to add:

The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess
Final Fantasy VII, VIII, X, X-2, and XIII
Golden Sun: Dark Dawn
Mega Man X6... and X7 was so bad that even when compared to X6, it was still an unworthy successor
Golden Sun. :(
One that popped immediately in my head,when i saw the title
Alundra 2-An ok game by it's own,cute,fun....but it's no Alundra,by ANY stretch of the imagination.
Also,Unlimited saGa.Seriously,what the hell?
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dtgreene: One other random note: Anyone else bothered that the strongest buyable healing item in Final Fantasy 6 is so weak lategame that it might as well not exist at that point?
I think it makes sense, because otherwise it would make game super easy if it wasn't easy enough already. FF already gives you tons of consumables, should all of them be X-Potions and Elixirs? :)
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dtgreene: One other random note: Anyone else bothered that the strongest buyable healing item in Final Fantasy 6 is so weak lategame that it might as well not exist at that point?
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Sarisio: I think it makes sense, because otherwise it would make game super easy if it wasn't easy enough already. FF already gives you tons of consumables, should all of them be X-Potions and Elixirs? :)
The problem, really, is that Final Fantasy 6 is lacking a money sink. The closest I can think of is Holy/Pearl Rods, and even with their ability to ignore defense, I believe Ultima is still stronger. As a result, by the end of the game, you end up with tons of money and *nothing* to do with it.

Final Fantasies 3-5 didn't have this problem. 3 has shurikens which are expensive and likely the most powerful general purpose attack in the game. 4 and 5 have buyable elixirs, plus in 5 high potions are still relevant late game (they heal 500 without the ability that doubles their strength, unlike in 6 where they heal only 250 (against a higher HP pool) with no way to double their strength). The later remakes of 2 (GBA and onward) also have a money sink: you can actually carry as many Elixirs as you can afford.

Back to Final Fantasy 6, what's the point of the X-Ether? It's not buyable and there are only 3 in the game. Compare that to the more powerful Elixir (still not buyable, but can at least be stolen by a normal enemy that is the only enemy in a specific area), and the X-Ether might as well not exist.

I'm not saying that all consumables should be X-Potions and Elixirs, but rather that I should be able to get consumables that aren't entirely useless, plus I would like something to spend my money on end-game.

(Also, FF5 has the Mix command that lets you do interesting things with otherwise useless consumables, and the GBA version added Combine as another option. FF6 lacks Mix (yet it kept the more boring Throw) so it doesn't have that option.)

On another note, I would say that Ultima 7 is a disappointing sequel. Ultima 6 has probably the best combat in the Ultima series (even if it is underused in that game). Ultima 7, however, took the leap into real time combat and did so poorly. (I also note that people who have played Ultima 8 and 9 consider *those* games disappointing as well.)
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Fairfox: Hated Fade to Black.
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timppu: Glad to see I am not alone after all. I usually have seen just praise for that game, but I recall total boredom playing it. And I think I am pretty good at enduring even boring games. Come to think of it, I did finish it, but god damn it...

I don't recall exactly what was wrong with it, just... so... bored... I still have the CD somewhere, maybe I need to retry it to remember. Or maybe not. :)

Then again, I don't recall really enjoying Flashback either, which I guess this game is a sequel to. "Another World" though, I loved it. I guess the reason why I wanted to like Flashback and Fade to Black as I thought they are some kind of spiritual successors to Another World, or something.
I think Fade to Black was pretty good to be honest, sure it was a departure from 2D cinematic platformer but what it lacked in style it offered more in gameplay and has fun puzzles, IMO it's one of the better early 3D 3PP games.
Though Another World and Flashback perhaps have achieved classic status, their gameplay is limited and while I like the style of these games, Another World for example offers only slightly more control over your character than Dragon's Lair, now compare that with Fade to Black.
Post edited September 15, 2015 by Strijkbout
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dtgreene: The problem, really, is that Final Fantasy 6 is lacking a money sink. The closest I can think of is Holy/Pearl Rods, and even with their ability to ignore defense, I believe Ultima is still stronger. As a result, by the end of the game, you end up with tons of money and *nothing* to do with it.
It happens in all Final Fantasies and in many RPGs in general. Eventually Gil/Gold/HL/whatever becomes useless, sometimes it is useless right from the start, as you always have more than you need. Final Fantasy VIII was especially ridiculous in this regard, as you could make Gil from thin air, just converting various items into each other.

I found Agarest to be quite interesting in this regard (if to ignore 1st Agarest's Vessel of Life trick, which eventually outlasts its usefulness due to inflation). What you see on attached screenshot is price just for crafting skill and not the actual price (need to buy/get/craft 4 listed ingredients somewhere). There are a lot of gold sinks (and EP/TP sinks, Agarest has 3 types of currencies). You are actually quite encouraged to spend it all to craft, instead of hoarding it in case you will find some interesting stuff in shops. Like in Elminage, it is you who supply shops with all the gear, and you can use starter gear only for so long. Unlike Elminage, most of your gear (and even skills) has to be crafted, so you always in need of more Gold/EP/TP.
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Yeah, Mass Effect 2 was a shock at first and made me rant quite a bit about this and that, but I ended up enjoying it all the same, despite its flaws.

I never really got into Escape from Monkey Island though. The changes from MI2 to Curse required some accustoming and the story wasn't the greatest, but it was still enjoyable, but EfMI was a bit too much with the 3D puppet graphics, tank controls and unoriginal, fourth wall breaking jokes. There are definitely worse games, but as a sequel to the legendary SoMI and MI2, and good CoMI I feel it's quite the insult. (Then again, I never managed to play for longer than an hour, whenever I gave it another try.)
Post edited September 16, 2015 by Leroux
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mobutu: World of Warcraft
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MarioFanaticXV: Star Wars: The Old Republic

Seriously, why? The second game did so much in redeeming the first, and then... Bioware threw a tantrum and completely destroyed any hope the series had at a decent story.
Is it worth getting for someone who is a Star Wars freak?
Might & Magic IX. I hear M&M X is even worse
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Roxolani: Call of Juarez: The Cartel
Dude I thought that game was awesome, but the things that I liked about the game are probably the same as what others don't like about it. I have an odd taste in shooters, I've come to accept this.

You are absolutely right though ! both of the previous games were better than the Cartel.

I assume you have played the previous ones. Not many have. They feel rather underrated in my opinion.
I wish we had more Western-based shooters. We only have the Juarez series and the GUN game.
There's a big lack of Western-based games in general, which is a great shame because its such a fantastic setting.
DmC: Devil May Cry is my most disappointing sequel.

No lock on which makes combat unnecessarily awkward, and in turn messes up the inputs for previously simple moves. Color coded enemies that are immune to damage from the wrong color weapons, ruining the point of a DMC game which is to get stylish combo's through a variety of weapons and moves. Boring ass weapons that are no fun to use. And the cherry on top, a completely unlikable cast of one-note cliche characters.


Second biggest disappointment, Bioshock Infinite.

The new setting is very plain looking compared to Rapture. The gameplay mechanics are steamlined to near-Call of Duty status (two weapons at a time, only four "perks"). And the story is not only filled with plot holes but the big twist at the end is very basic. M. Night Shyamalan could have done better.
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mobutu: World of Warcraft
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MarioFanaticXV: And on that same note, I'd like to add:

Star Wars: The Old Republic

Seriously, why? The second game did so much in redeeming the first, and then... Bioware threw a tantrum and completely destroyed any hope the series had at a decent story.

On other unrelated notes, I'd like to add:

The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess
Final Fantasy VII, VIII, X, X-2, and XIII
Golden Sun: Dark Dawn
Mega Man X6... and X7 was so bad that even when compared to X6, it was still an unworthy successor
1. Twilight Princess had the best dungeons in the entire series by far. They were all huge and diverse.

2. The Final Fantasy games you listed were the games that has a mostly sci fi background. So you prefer FF games that takes place in a fantasy setting aswell? I notice you did not put 9, 12, not even the MMOs 11 and 14. I love FF games that takes place in Medieval Fantasy.

3. I bought that game just to add another RPG to my handheld games. My memory with the first Golden Sun game is fuzzy so I don't know whats wrong with Dark Dawn.

4. How bad is Megaman X6 exactly? And I grew up playing X5 a LOT. I loved that X could use a Saber.
Post edited September 15, 2015 by Elmofongo
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hedwards: I'd say Doom3, SC2, D3, Quake 3 and WoW are all worth considering. SC2 in particular was so bad that it made me realize that the original wasn't really that good. I just thought it was good because the genre hadn't yet peaked.

And not bad, and not technically a sequel, but ridiculously hard would be that second episode of Wolf 3D, you finish the first one on that second to hardest difficulty and then struggle to get through that first level on the easiest setting.
what what what? Quake 3 is still the best TDM of all time-is it a bad sequel just because it dropped a singleplayer campaign to you?