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Thank you very much!

Anyway I guess I will follow your advice and respec. I wanted to avoid this because I am a bit scared if an external tool would be able to provoque any eventual error on the game...

In reference to the Dex Scion V2: It's indicated that "Final Build: Magus(Eldritch Scion) 19/Monk(Scaled Fist) 1" but in the detailed leveling breakdown there are two monk levels. I gues the detailed level breakdown is the right one, isn't it?

One question, I don't know if I'm doing it right. I regular fights I have the "touch of fatigue" spellin autocast in order to get the free offhand attack for the spellstrike. is that ok?

Again, thank you very much for your work!
Falanders_GOG: Thank you very much!

Anyway I guess I will follow your advice and respec. I wanted to avoid this because I am a bit scared if an external tool would be able to provoque any eventual error on the game...

In reference to the Dex Scion V2: It's indicated that "Final Build: Magus(Eldritch Scion) 19/Monk(Scaled Fist) 1" but in the detailed leveling breakdown there are two monk levels. I gues the detailed level breakdown is the right one, isn't it?

One question, I don't know if I'm doing it right. I regular fights I have the "touch of fatigue" spellin autocast in order to get the free offhand attack for the spellstrike. is that ok?

Again, thank you very much for your work!
missed it while redoing. fixed, thanks.

touch of fatigue does give an extra attack, but incurs -2 penalty on all attacks. this makes it good early and a bit worse the later it goes. that and diminishing chances of actually succeeding in debuffing. by midgame you usually switch to spamming shocking grasps/frigid/vampiric to keep up the dps. just make sure you have 1-2 slots per level in reserve in case you need to cast something, so don't run your spell pool dry.

at late levels it's not even a consideration as Transformation becomes a reality. You can't cast in it, but you have crazy high arcane weapon buffs. So with something like redeemer you have 2d6 fire/1d6 shock/1d6 cold/2d6 bane/2d6 axiomatic/2d6 holy +5 17-20/x3 longsword and +10 to attack buffs at will from arcane accuracy

If you have any questions - don't hesitate to ask. This guide is made for helping people, after all.
Post edited November 18, 2018 by InEffect
True Follower of Urgathoa Jaethal

Str: 16 > 17 @lvl20
Dex: 14
Con: -
Int: 14
Wis: 16 > 20
Cha: 14

Final Build: Inquisitor 3/Cleric(Herald Caller) 17

Main skills: Perception, Lore: Religion, Lore: Nature, Knowledge: Arcana
Suggested secondary skills: -

Detailed leveling breakdown:
Lvl 2: Cleric
Lvl 3: Cleric - Selective Channel
Lvl 4: Cleric
Lvl 5: Cleric - Spell Focus: Necromancy
Lvl 6: Cleric
Lvl 7: Cleric - Outflank
Lvl 8: Cleric
Lvl 9: Cleric - Greater Spell Focus: Necromancy
Lvl 10: Cleric
Lvl 11: Cleric - Exotic Weapon Proficiency: Fauchard*
Lvl 12: Cleric
Lvl 13: Inquisitor - Combat Reflexes
Lvl 14: Inquisitor - Seize the Moment
Lvl 15: Cleric - Improved Critical: Fauchard
Lvl 16: Cleric
Lvl 17: Cleric - Weapon Focus: Fauchard
Lvl 18: Cleric
Lvl 19: Cleric - Combat Expertise**
Lvl 20: Cleric

*Technically, we could’ve used Scythe, but it’s total suffer till you get Righteous Might. I don’t like needless suffering.
**Optional. Can be swapped for whatever you like better. Precise Strike is a good alternative.

Spells by level in order of importance:
Lvl 1: Cure Light Wounds, Divine Favor, Shield of Faith
Lvl 2: Cure Moderate Wounds, Restoration(Lesser), Boneshaker*
Lvl 3: Cure Serious Wounds, Blindness, Resist Energy(Communal), Delay Poison(Communal), Bestow Curse*
Lvl 4: Divine Power, Protection from Energy(Communal), Cure Critical Wounds, Crusader’s Edge
Lvl 5: Righteous Might, Boneshatter, Geniekind, Slay Living*
Lvl 6: Eaglesoul, Heal, Harm, Circle of Death*
Lvl 7: Bestow Grace of the Champion, Greater Restoration
Lvl 8: Death Clutch, Frightful Aspect, Angelic Aspect, Horrid Wilting *
Lvl 9: Heal(Mass), Wail of Banshee*

*Usable Domain Spell, rest should be used for Summoning/Damage. Cause Fear is ok early, but becomes obsolete fast.

Inquisitor Spells: True Strike, Remove Fear

Sample Spellbook:
Lvl 1: Cure Light Wounds x2+, Divine Favor x2+, Shield of Faith x1, Cause Fear(D) x1
Lvl 2: Cure Moderate Wounds x2+, Restoration(Lesser) x2, Boneshaker(D) x1+
Lvl 3: Cure Serious Wounds x2+, Blindness x1, Resist Energy(Communal) x1, Delay Poison(Communal) x1, Bestow Curse(D) x1
Lvl 4: Divine Power x2, Protection from Energy(Communal) x1, Cure Critical Wounds x2, Crusader’s Edge x1, Enervation(D) x1
Lvl 5: Righteous Might x2, Boneshatter x1-2, Geniekind x2, Slay Living(D) x1
Lvl 6: Eaglesoul x2, Heal x1+, Harm x1, Circle of Death(D) x1
Lvl 7: Bestow Grace of the Champion x1+, Greater Restoration x2, Disintegrate(D) x1
Lvl 8: Death Clutch x1, Frightful Aspect x1, Angelic Aspect x1, Horrid Wilting(D) x1
Lvl 9: Heal(Mass)x1+, Wail of Banshee(D) x1

Gear: Longspear before you get decent Fauchard from Master or traders at the Tournament. Medium Armor, +AC items, +Stat Items, Cloak of Sold Souls.

Nice Evil Cleric for your party. Eaglesoul bumps her STR right where it would be if she was investing stats there, has a number of self-buffs and high necromancy DC, especially if you choose undead path for her.

Herald Caller allows you to transform spells into summons, which will come in handy as you don’t always want those inflict wounds spells, as well as all summoning feats with no investments. Urgathoa domains kinda suck, so it’s pretty pointless to get 2nd one.

Healing Potential is so-so. Will probably need a half-caster with you(Jubilost will do). Won’t matter late as you are drowning in gold by then and can just buy heal and mass heal scrolls. Also you can make use of all the pots you usually sell to vendors.

Will need some minor perception boosting item for 35 per to spot dragon lair, otherwise should have enough for everything.
Post edited December 21, 2018 by InEffect
Solving end-game.

Shopping list:
-200 Mass Heal scrolls
-50-100 Resurrection scrolls
-100+ Freedom of Movement Scrolls
-As many rations as you can carry.

You should have enough money for this as it’s not like there is much to spend on late.

Crowd Control:
-Dazzling Display Thug
-Int Alchemist
-Heightened spells from Arcane bloodline Sorc
-Waves of Exhaustion and other no-save spells
-AoE Duration spells like sirocco, cloudkill, etc as they will proc a lot of saves - some are bound to fail
-Tripping Kineticist
-Everything else is a waste of time

-Physical Damage
-Ray Spells with true strike
-Kineticist no-save AoE's and RTA elemental blasts

Good gear to have:

-blind immunity cloaks from master tailor are invaluable for your frontline, unless you are willing to take blindfight that will not be useful anywhere else
-Freedom of Movement items

Preferred party composition:
-2 front-liners with 55+AC
-Buff-bot Cleric. It literally doesn’t matter which one you bring along as long as he can read Mass Heal and FoM Scrolls. Or anyone with A LOT of Use Magic Device. Preferably, both.
-Ray Arcane Trickster/Transmuter for bosses. Not mandatory, but is good to have.
-Do NOT bring a lot of casters with you. Game will punish you for it HARD.

Party RNG:
Your companions that you’ve done the Quests for might still die if they fail their save against FoD. Unless you are willing to just roll with it, you will have to reload till they make it. This is how you know the devs hate you by that point, so any abuse you will do is justified.

General Advice:
Keep track of buffs/debuffs on your party. What really kills you is blindness/paralysis in 90% of cases. Keep your mass heal and freedom of movement scrolls ready.

Pre-buff before every single fight with wild hunt. It is tedious and annoying, but not as annoying as endless loading screens.

Kiting is your friend.
Fight on your terms. Enemies start being spread. If you back off behind the corner instead of charging them, they will clump up nicely. As a bonus, you won’t risk as much fearing them. Look for a second corner to go behind if enemies spread out too thin and use dimension door to bring your party there.

I was hoping they will take some measures to fix bad ports of the wild hunt like not getting immunity to their gaze for 24h after you passed a save and general design of the last stretch, so I delayed this section. At this point I think it is unlikely to happen, so here is how to trivialize the end-game by optimal play.
Post edited January 08, 2019 by InEffect

Role: Tank/Damage Dealer/Control

Race: Aasimar(Musetouched)
Alignment: Lawful-Good

Str: 7
Dex: 19 >24
Con: 16
Int: 10
Wis: 7
Cha: 18

*7/19/16/10/11/16 is also ok if you want to take iron will at 19 and try to fix the saves. Costs you 1 persuade and 1 AC, though.

Final Build: Kineticist 19/Monk(Scaled Fist) 1

Main skills: Mobility 3, Persuasion 20
Suggested secondary skills: Use Magic Device(Spare)

Detailed leveling breakdown:
Lvl 1: Kineticist - Weapon Finesse // Kinetic Blade // Earth
Lvl 2: Monk - Crane Style
Lvl 3: Kineticist - Dodge // Earth > Trip
Lvl 4: Kineticist - Extended Range
Lvl 5: Kineticist - Outflank // Earth > Greater Trip
Lvl 6: Kineticist - Bowling Infusion
Lvl 7: Kineticist - Crane Wing // Elemental Whispers > Lizard*
Lvl 8: Kineticist - Fire
Lvl 9: Kineticist - Fury's Fall // Fire's Fury
Lvl 10: Kineticist - Eruption
Lvl 11: Kineticist - Wings // Fire > Dazzling Display
Lvl 12: Kineticist - Wall
Lvl 13: Kineticist - Crane Riposte // Enduring Earth
Lvl 14: Kineticist - Deadly Earth
Lvl 15: Kineticist - Weapon Focus: Kinetic Blast // Dreadful Carnage
Lvl 16: Kineticist - Water > Water Blast
Lvl 17: Kineticist - Shatter Defenses // Expanded Defense > Shroud of Water
Lvl 18: Kineticist - Cloud
Lvl 19: Kineticist - Toughness** // Water > Blind Fight
Lvl 20: Kineticist - Metakinesis: Empowered // Unraveling Infusion
*For tempo 1AC. In the long run Hare would be better.
**Or Agile Maneuvers

Gear: Monk Robes, Bracers of Armor, AC gear, +Stat gear.

We don't need weapons.

Game plan is as such. We are greedy(what a surprise) and picked earth 1st to save up 1 wild talent. That means we Will fall a bit behind on DPS. Had to be done. Now the good news are kineticist is rather useless till level 5 anyways unless he's tanking ranged approach. So we just sit there with 'gather power low' on and poke enemies to the face. Nothing spectacular yet. In general in this phase of our life we are a lot more concerned with our AC than anything. Lucky for us Shield wands/scrolls are not rare and we do have UMD, You can also trip things manually.

At level 6 we finally get to do what we were meant to: Keep things permanently tripped with bowling infusion.

Level 8 we finally get to fire. Don't get all too happy about composite blasts. Those things will take a lot of gather power to cast unless you want to burn yourself to oblivion. Generally it means we just got a lot better at actually killing things. Now we go through a phase where we mainly poke things with a fiery sword and almost don't use trip.

Level 10 We get eruption and bowling makes a swift comeback. Gather power+bowling+magma eruption is both damage and control - slightly burning yourself for it is not that bad of a price to pay. Fire eruption with low gather is a nice source of ranged damage. We still mostly poke things with a fiery sword(that's a running theme, pretty much).

Level 12 is where game really starts to crumble. Earth or Fire Wall+Bowling depending how much time you have to spare. Everything is controlled for a good long while. Level 13 brings us Enduring earth doubling the duration.

Level 14 Did you think wall is a bit too cheesy? Let me introduce you to Deadly Earth. Pretty much the same total control but in huge AoE.

Level 18 We get Cloud. Pretty much deadly earth but with lower duration and no bowling. But it still stacks on top of Deadly earth for double the damage.

General notes:
You do want Alchemist in your party. At least till you get to water shield.

Out of all our elements water was the easiest to shift to 15. We technically could start with water(cold) for ele blast and tankiness early but we'd run into problems with late fire. The way to deal with it would be to go with the party of 3, maybe 4. Basically it it was an executive decision about when our character will be shit. I chose early levels. We could've started with fire and all would be almost gucci, but unless we took precise shot we'd be stuck wasting half out time gathering and running. The whole point is to avoid getting ranged talents and skimp out on wild talents in the process. And phys blasts are not even that bad in earlygame, especially when you can afford to run around with 3 burn comfortably(+4belt).

Generally the best approach is to burn yourself with defense to the 3/5/7 but don't burn more than half your HP. This Also means that while We pump dex all the way we actually value items with con more so for most of the game. It's just due to how itemization works. Don't forget that overflow will compensate you some of the stats you burned the same rule of Con>Dex Applies there.

Think I forgot to mention that with shatter defenses your melee attacks will almost always all hit. for ungodly single-target damage.
Post edited April 19, 2019 by InEffect
Kineticist Evaluation

-Base class.
One of those cases when every sub sacrifices something too valuable for dubious gains. Simply the best option in most cases. Remember alchemist being OP? Well this is essentially the same. Elemental Blasts attack Touch AC same as alchemists bombs, you get loads of AC and stats for free, while doing hundreds of damage per round going nova. Has no save 150 average damage per round 15-ish round duration AoE that trips everyone it hits(in gigantic circle), that can reliably be casted out of combat for free. Totally balanced.

Burn can and will destroy your HP. You Have to become untouchable. so about 70 AC, all immunities in the world and DR

-Dark Elementalist.

Pretty much a base class with slower gain, but can theoretically go for longer. Also uses int instead of con. Not the best stat for MC. you can settle for 16 int in this form and just never use anything reliant on non-dex DC. Pretty much unaffected by burn(in theory), so that's nice as well. Use it if you are unsure of your ability to deal with burn as it does cut into your stat pool. you pretty much balancing between con an int. 14 con 19 int is less efficient, than 19 con 10 int and MC doesn't exactly need skill-points - you have companions for it.

Would be awesome if burn penalties were not so crippling. Will is already the worst save of a class and no WIS investments will fix it completely. Imo, it is much easier to fix HP, than completely ruined saves. Even 20-ish will that buffed kineticist gets by late-game is not as bad, as burned psycho. Would be a good DC option, but 1st: entangle an whatnot is strictly worse, than trip and 2nd: CON is a casting stat for base class so you can ramp your casting stat, totally negating the burn you'll get, while this one negates about 1/2 burn per 2 Wis.

-Kinetic Knight

If only he had access to Form infusions... With no Deadly Earth access he is garbage, compared to others. Armor is already worse in every way possible and this one sacrifices everything to wear it. Yes, he is better till level 7 give or take, but after he takes a nose-dive and by lvl 15 the power gap is insurmountable. Can be relegated to healing and dazzling usage to keep some semblance of usefulness, but does nothing that base class can't do better. In pnp he at least gets whip for more utility and armor braces +8 and +5 dodge robes are not guaranteed there. And even that wouldn't be so bad, but he also has no empower, so he will always be 50% weaker in melee as well. Avoid him like a plague till they give him whip and/or some crutches to compete with the rest.

Kineticist is all about the tripping. And as it substitutes str with casting stat - dex is the way to go as you get CMB from it with fury's fall. that means kinetic knight is double the trash he seems to be as loads of dex doesn't really sit well with heavy armor. Thing is you need ALL the CMB you can get and even if we consider exactly equal stats and dex 10 trip will be 4 CMB ahead due to +8 belt. if we expect to have 20+ dex the difference is even more staggering, Only thing where bull's rush would be better is against spiders/centipedes, but those are not a huge concern.

Base Class OP, everything else is much worse to varying degrees.
Post edited December 19, 2018 by InEffect
Tieflings Evaluation
Decent race. effectively +2 stats and a useful bonus. Considering the penalty is to mental stats, can be awesome if they are sacrificing CHA on a class, that doesn't care about it. If it had wings(or any other useful racial) it would be an easier sell

Heritages that I see as useful:

Cha dump, +2CMB. Very solid for any utility melee, including druids.

Free Bite attack. Good option for melee STR rangers that go deep enough to profit from Sense vitals or some levels of Vivisectionist. There is a cloak that adds d6 cold on bite attacks. that an extra 6d6 or so damage dice per round for you. Can be abused for bite stacking. Especially for trip builds.

Good option for armor-users, as every AC point counts there. +2 to dazzling display won't hurt em either. Would be a solid option for Kinetic Knights, but those are garbage for now.

For heightened spell controllers that are not arcane bloodline. Between items and racial might even work sometimes. Still bad, compared to more reliable options, but it's something.

Abyssal bloodline Transformation Sorc/Scion sounds decent enough, but it's pure STR heavy armor class. +DEX+INT heritage just doesn't fit in. Maybe some weird D/W EK might make use of it, but I am at a loss.
Post edited May 02, 2019 by InEffect
Man this is one of the best threads i've red across multiple forums and reddit, but I think you made a huge mistake.
I don't know if anyone already pointed it ouy, but your linzi build should be called Meleenzi...
I know it's a terrible pun, but I had to get it our, sorry! :O
Thank you InEffect, seriously, this is all very informative and interesting.
Mik_Hell: Man this is one of the best threads i've red across multiple forums and reddit, but I think you made a huge mistake.
I don't know if anyone already pointed it ouy, but your linzi build should be called Meleenzi...
I know it's a terrible pun, but I had to get it our, sorry! :O
Thank you InEffect, seriously, this is all very informative and interesting.
Meleenzy, huh? not bad. done.
Post edited December 17, 2018 by InEffect
Hahaha you realy did it can't belive my eyes !
Mik_Hell: Hahaha you realy did it can't belive my eyes !
what can I say? I'm a sucker for terrible puns.


Str: 10
Dex: 18
Con: 18 > 22
Int: 10
Wis: 14
Cha: 10

Final Build: Kineticist 19/Alchemist(Vivisectionist) 1

Main skills: Mobility 3, Perception(Max)
Suggested secondary skills: Athletics 5, Stealth(Spare)

Lvl 6: Kineticist - Elemental Whispers > Lizard
Lvl 7: Kineticist - Weapon Focus: Kinetic Blast // Earth
Lvl 8: Kineticist - Earth > Trip
Lvl 9: Kineticist - Fury’s Fall // Bowling Infusion
Lvl 10: Kineticist - Earth > Greater Trip
Lvl 11: Kineticist - Dazzling Display // Wall
Lvl 12: Kineticist - Expanded Defense > Earth
Lvl 13: Kineticist - Persuasive // Deadly Earth
Lvl 14: Kineticist - Enduring Earth
Lvl 15: Kineticist - Shatter Defenses // Fire
Lvl 16: Kineticist - Fire’s Fury
Lvl 17: Kineticist - Blindfight // Cloud
Lvl 18: Kineticist - Fire > Dreadful Carnage
Lvl 19: Kineticist - Skill Focus: Persuasion // Unraveling Infusion // Metakinesis: Empowered
Lvl 20 Alchemist*
Or Thug.

Gear: light armor(censor robes and +8 Bracers late), +AC gear, +Phys stat belt, +AC dagger


Str: 10
Dex: 18
Con: 16
Int: 16 > 20
Wis: 12
Cha: 10

Final Build: Kineticist(Dark Elementalist) 19/Rogue(Thug) 1

Main skills: Trickery(Max), Perception(Max), Persuasion(Max)
Suggested secondary skills: Whatever your party is lacking.

Lvl 6: Kineticist - Fire > Dazzling Display
Lvl 7: Rogue - Weapon Focus: Kinetic Blast
Lvl 8: Kineticist - Earth
Lvl 9: Kineticist - Shatter Defenses // Fire > Dreadful Carnage
Lvl 10: Kineticist - Flash Infusion
Lvl 11: Kineticist - Accomplished Sneak Attacker // Fire's Fury
Lvl 12: Kineticist - Wall
Lvl 13: Kineticist - Deceitful // Enduring Earth
Lvl 14: Kineticist - Grappling Infusion
Lvl 15: Kineticist - Persuasive // Elemental Whispers > Viper
Lvl 16: Kineticist - Air > Electricity
Lvl 17: Kineticist - Blind Fight // Expanded Defense > Enveloping Winds
Lvl 18: Kineticist - Deadly Earth
Lvl 19: Kineticist - Skill Focus: Persuasion // Skill Focus: Perception/Trickery*
Lvl 20 Kineticist - Fragmentation // Metakinesis: Empowered
*Depending on what you need.

Gear: Some utility weapon, +Stat gear, Some armor with useful enchant

Kalikke is arguably better at fighting and has less scuffed of a build, combined with a better class too. Nonetheless, after some fiddling I managed to make Kanerah usable while keeping her as a nice skill monkey to help you fill the gaps.
Kanerah could've taken a monk dip instead, but I don't really see any reason for it as she will never reach anything approximating good AC.

Truth to be told both of the sisters are a bit scuffed. Kalikke is stuck with phys blast till lvl 15(But at least she has torrent) and Kanerah has loads of feats wasted. With this brand new approach they fill the gaps and stay useful all game. You will use mostly Kanerah till Kalikke reaches Deadly Earth(swapping to her if you need some heals in a pinch). Should be pretty comfortable.

A word of warning: their quest location is pretty hard. you do need some decent AC/damage on MC so it doesn't turn into suffer.
Post edited June 19, 2019 by InEffect
Proper Nok-Nok

Str: 8
Dex: 23 > 26
Con: 12
Int: 12
Wis: 9 > 10 @ lvl20
Cha: 8

Final Build: Rogue(Knife Master)12/Alchemist(Vivisectionist) 4/Slayer 3/Stalwart 1

Main skills: Trickery (max), Mobility*, Stealth*, Perception (max)
Suggested secondary skills: Lore: Nature(max).

*Split evenly between mobility and stealth. You do not need as much of those as you can get.

Detailed leveling breakdown:
Lvl 8: Rogue - CT>Outflank
Lvl 9: Rogue - Improved Two-Weapon Fighting
Lvl 10: Rogue - Opportunist
Lvl 11: Alchemist - Combat Reflexes
Lvl 12: Alchemist - Feral Mutagen
Lvl 13: Alchemist - Improved Critical: Kukri
Lvl 14: Rogue
Lvl 15: Rogue - Greater TWF // Double Debilitation
Lvl 16: Slayer
Lvl 17: Alchemist - Accomplished Sneak Attacker // Crippling Strike
Lvl 18: Slayer - Menacing > Dazzling
Lvl 19: Slayer - Shatter Defenses
Lvl 20: Stalwart

Gear. Kukris, censor robes, bracers, whatever else that would add AC/AB.

Shield and reduce person from alchemist. That’s it.

Better with slayer. Actually gets 10d8 sneak and AB doesn’t totally suck(at least so long as you toss improved invis on him)
Post edited March 26, 2020 by InEffect
Great build, except the rogue doesn't have the BAB to take Shield Master at 13.
Hello InEffect, it was really interesting to read your builds, a lot of new for me, thanks for your work.
Some notes: as I know 20 level is unreachable atm, so the last stats point and several last levels are mostly in theory. And also playing with min STR (7 or 5) is too annoying in the early game.
I plan to start a new company with 4 chars instead of 6. Valerie is the only tank, so she is on, Linzy is a good buffer and I like her by RP, Octavia or Jubi as the main DD. So my MC has to be off tank\healer. I have seen your hospitalier build, he is pretty nice, but I want to try Dex build. So my questions are:

1. I want to try Dex based off tank\some damage\some heal with something like this - 1 aldory\1 trad monk \the rest for ecclezi. What do you think, is it playable? I have to sacrifice half of heal by dumping not only STR\INT but CHA also to max the WIS\DEX and the rest to CON, but I afraid if he can tank with a limited AC and weak HP?
2. The traditional way for Valerie is pretty straightforward but it's too boring for me. What do you think about building her as a Kinetic Knight? Is it possible don't lose too much tanki and add some damage dealing?
3. Octavia. I want to go with her as Arcane Archer\ Arcane Trickster. What do you think can it increase her DPS in charge of wizard's utility? I am afraid that AT BAB progression is too slow and I can get nothing instead of the best high-level wizard spells.
Post edited February 04, 2019 by flancer