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General discussion (archive)Release: Lords of Midnight(201 posts)(201 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted August 13, 2013
The return of an 8-bit legend!

The Lords of Midnight, a unique classic mash-up of RPG, strategy, and interactive fiction, faithfully recreated for modern systems, is now available on GOG.com for only $5.99

The land of Midnight is in danger. The name of the villain menacing the realm is whispered in every homestead with fear and fascination: Doom... dark, Doomdark, Doomdark! Only the Lords of Midnight, the valiant knight protectors of the folk, can stand up to the accursed Whitchking. It will be no easy task, though. The lords will ride the four winds, looking for allies, recruiting their armies, and bringing light to wherever the shadow of Doomdark falls. Forging their legend with their every step, they would become the champions the land needs. Should they fail, all will be lost. Don't let them fail.

The Lords of Midnight was originally released in 1984. What you see here, is a revamped version of the exact same game, retaining its gameplay and graphical style, just adding some more intuitive interface and high resolution graphics. At its core, however, this is the exact same game that enthralled the imagination of many gamers almost three decades ago. The turn based game mixes elements of an adventure with a robust, well-written storyline, an epic wargame in which you manage and command large armies, and a role-playing game with much focus on exploration of the game's incredibly detailed landscape. Your main quest--defeating the evil Witchking Doomdark--is no easy task, and completing the game in any of the possible ways will prove a challenge. Let one of the oldest, yet greatest stories ever told in a computer game unfold before you!

See how deep, addicting, and fun computer games already were 30 years ago. Get The Lords of Midnight today, for only $5.99 on GOG.com!
Posted August 14, 2013
This topic is full of whiny, spoiled nerds.
Posted August 14, 2013
Thanks GOG and the devs of this remake.

The graphics are indeed quite beautiful apart from the truly grating colours.
At least it's not CGA. The variation in game play sounds intriguing. Wishlisted for now while I go back to play another classic, Betrayal at Krondor.
How does this game play through Wine on Linux?
Post edited August 14, 2013 by jorlin
Posted August 14, 2013
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G-Doc: The original game was only officially released on ZX Spectrum (and it's variations), and ported to Amstrad and Commodore 64.
http://www.icemark.com/
And ported for free here for pc. Since 14 years for Windows (older for DOS).
So I feel giving $6 is really being a fan of LoM (I am, not so, even I had play it on my Amstrad CPC 6128)
Post edited August 14, 2013 by ERISS
Posted August 14, 2013
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FraterPerdurabo: Yeah, they are definitely losing the interest of people such as myself who come here to buy classics and ease-to-play. Let's look at Amnesia and Penumbra, the two latest "old" releases. I bought all of those during the Steam sale years ago and actually played a bit of Amnesia a while ago. I don't think that GOG had to make a great effort (and by that I mean probably none) to make those work on newer rigs, because I don't think that Steam had to do anything there and my game worked just fine right off the bat.

So let's see: higher prices, worse and less frequent sales, generic catalog additions from the near-past, new games which will be available at a fraction of a cost on Steam in the near future. Not good enough. For me as a customer, if GOG wants to compete with Steam or other digital distributors, it must up its ante by releasing way more games way more frequently to build up a catalog which can in size and variety compete with those of other digital distributors. I can understand their motivation though - now that it has built up a reasonable reputation it is probably far more profitable for GOG to churn out newer titles because of the price difference. I can also understand how it claims to be "championing" the DRM-free movement (which is to be lauded), but I am not going to repurchase a game on GOG that I already have on an alternative digital distribution platform just to get it DRM-free (unless it is one of my absolute favourites).

Replacing two GOGs a week with two indie games a week is not good enough.
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tapeworm00: I don't agree with you, but what I want to bring up is that you have to remember the process that GOG goes through when it comes to releasing games: chasing the IP owners, putting some order in the history of every game, and reaching a DRM-free agreement to release. This kind of work is relatively easy when it comes to new and recent games, but if you go back even 15 years ago or so the process is not as streamlined, since IPs are often lost in some no-longer existing company limbo, or the people who made the game don't care anymore, have changed professions, countries...

The DRM-free principle is what makes GOG what it is, and you also have to think that most people either do not care about it or they fully support it as a form of copyright. They've been fighting an uphill battle ever since the beginning, and I believe this is why GOG had to shift its strategy and change its name. In the surveys they made at the time, the majority of us voted that yes, GOG should go on even if it was to sell new games - what we love about it is the concept and the service, not just the games they provide. After all, look at how long they took to release System Shock 2, a game that people had asked for for years! The games exist, but that doesn't mean that GOG has easy access to them or that the DRM-free policy will be attractive to developers.
The whole rights battle... I won't bother going into it, but rest assured that GOG will experience the same difficulties when releasing many modern day games as it will when releasing many of the older games. In the end, it all comes down to opportunity costs. And when you can charge $40 per title as opposed to $9.99 per title the maths becomes tediously simple. The fact of the matter is that GOG is starting to lose a part of its consumer base, namely the people who came here for the good old games. Unlike some other users here, I do not view this as some kind of digital battleground. Rather, I will spend my money where I see the value and unfortunately GOG has less and less to offer me in that regard.
Posted August 14, 2013
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JMich: Sigh.
Let's go over the numbers again.
So far in 2013 GOG has released 101 games. Of those, 26 were pre-2k ones and 39 were 10+ years old on GOG release date. Lords of Midnight is listed as a 2013 release, thus not part of the classics. If you want to include it, increase the counts by 1.
In 2012 GOG released 160 games. Of those 47 were pre-2k ones and 62 were 10+ years old.
In 2011 GOG released 85 games. Of those 48 were pre-2k ones and 57 were 10+ years old.
In 2010 GOG released 79 games. Of those 35 were pre-2k ones and 36 were 10+ years old.
In 2009 GOG released 114 games. Of those 47 were pre-2k ones and 42 were 10+ years old.
In 2008 GOG released 65 games. Of those 29 were pre-2k ones and 23 were 10+ years old.

If GOG follows last year's release frequency, we are looking at ~60 more games. Lowest percentage of pre-2k games released was in 2012 with a 29%, or almost 1 in 3 games being a pre-2k one. So we can look forward to ~20 more pre-2k games.
For reference, highest percentage of classics was 56% in 2011, mostly due to EA being signed up, since 19 out of 48 pre-2k are EA titles.

So feel free to complain that GOG isn't releasing old titles, but do post your numbers. Yes, GOG hasn't released a pre-2k title for more than a month (Dracula Trilogy, GOG date July 9th 2013, original date October 1st 1999) while for 10+ years we are still a month without one (The Settlers 4, GOG date July 18th 2013, original date February 15th 2001).

Feel free to point out any errors in my data, and feel free to use said data for your own analysis/hypothesis. Personally, I don't see any reason to predict gloom, though predicting Doom would make me happy. And I guess I should make a thread next January with the statistics of GOG's releases.
Thank you very much for compiling all that information about GOG's releases. That must have been a ton of work.

I think "pre-2k" and "10+ years" are somewhat arbitrary points of reference. If you (equally arbitrarily) define a classic as a 5+ year old game, then the fraction of classic releases declined from 91% in 2011 to 53% in 2013. I'm not saying that this is a more valid definition, but only that the numbers can change a lot depending your perspective. I can certainly see how one can get the impression that GOG's focus has changed radically.

It's interesting to look at the average and median ages of releases by year. Clearly, the average age is much lower now than it used to be:

2008: average 8.7 yr, median 8.4 yr
2009: average 8.7 yr, median 7.5 yr
2010: average 9.5 yr, median 9.2 yr
2011: average 12.6 yr, median 12.3 yr
2012: average 7.9 yr, median 7.6 yr
2013: average 7.6 yr, median 6.3 yr

I used your data to plot histograms of the games' age at the time of release by year so you can get a visual impression of the age distribution. It's clear that GOG is still releasing many classic games, but the relative frequency of new vs. old game releases has increased substantially since 2012. Maybe this helps explain why many people have the impression that GOG has been neglecting classic games in favor of new and indie games for the last year or so.

The question is, what happens when you simply remove the new releases from the last couple of years? Do you get similar numbers to 2008-2011? Prior to 2012 there were virtually no releases newer than 3 years. If we remove all games newer than 3 years from the 2012 and 2013 releases we get 62 games in 2013 so far (est. ~90 by the end of the year) with an average age of 12.7 years, and 114 games in 2012 with an average age of 11.5 years. We seem to be getting fewer classics this year than in 2012, but probably around the same number as in 2010 and 2011.

Comparing this to the numbers above I would conclude that we are getting pretty much the same absolute number of classics as in previous years (with about the same average age), while the relative number of classic releases has declined rather sharply since 2012. Is that reason enough to be unhappy with GOG? You decide!
Attachments:
histogram.jpg (160 Kb)
Post edited August 15, 2013 by spindown
Posted August 14, 2013
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tapeworm00: I don't agree with you, but what I want to bring up is that you have to remember the process that GOG goes through when it comes to releasing games: chasing the IP owners, putting some order in the history of every game, and reaching a DRM-free agreement to release. This kind of work is relatively easy when it comes to new and recent games, but if you go back even 15 years ago or so the process is not as streamlined, since IPs are often lost in some no-longer existing company limbo, or the people who made the game don't care anymore, have changed professions, countries...

The DRM-free principle is what makes GOG what it is, and you also have to think that most people either do not care about it or they fully support it as a form of copyright. They've been fighting an uphill battle ever since the beginning, and I believe this is why GOG had to shift its strategy and change its name. In the surveys they made at the time, the majority of us voted that yes, GOG should go on even if it was to sell new games - what we love about it is the concept and the service, not just the games they provide. After all, look at how long they took to release System Shock 2, a game that people had asked for for years! The games exist, but that doesn't mean that GOG has easy access to them or that the DRM-free policy will be attractive to developers.
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FraterPerdurabo: The whole rights battle... I won't bother going into it, but rest assured that GOG will experience the same difficulties when releasing many modern day games as it will when releasing many of the older games. In the end, it all comes down to opportunity costs. And when you can charge $40 per title as opposed to $9.99 per title the maths becomes tediously simple. The fact of the matter is that GOG is starting to lose a part of its consumer base, namely the people who came here for the good old games. Unlike some other users here, I do not view this as some kind of digital battleground. Rather, I will spend my money where I see the value and unfortunately GOG has less and less to offer me in that regard.
I'll just say this (again):

We haven't forgotten our roots.

Thanks :D
Posted August 14, 2013
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JudasIscariot:
Sounds like a hint.
Posted August 14, 2013
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JudasIscariot:
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ShadowWulfe: Sounds like a hint.
No hint, just telling it like it is.
Posted August 14, 2013
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Fever_Discordia: I think there was a version of Kikstart 2 that was C128 only but they did another Kikstart 2 for normal C64 later on, don't know how different they were
I think the C128 had some compatibility issues with a small number of games too didn't it?
*gets wildly Off Topic*
Well, I finished the DOS port just now. Final on assault consisted around 20 lords with around 30000 troops against Doomdarks ~10000. Citadel of Ushgarak fell after 2 days of battle on day 90 of the conflict and Midnight belongs to the Free. Unfortunately Morkin was slain during his attempt to destroy the Ice Crown in the Battle of Ogrim. He took 20 Doomguards with him to the grave. Of 32 (I believe) lords in game, I managed to recruit 29. 2 died before I was able to get to them (dragonlord and and Fey located in Village of Cor). One was unaccounted for in the end, assumed dead.

It was quite fun ~8 hours straight but I really hope for everyone's sake that the remake has made some much needed improvements to controls (entirely keyboard driven interface is a pain, especially choosing lords) and interface (game needs minimap to track where lords are, they have been and what was found in each locations. It was quite tedious to try to remember who was going where and where the heck were they each turn). I don't think I'll try the Doomdark's Revenge DOS port as it was confusing to play even back in the day but anyone interested can get them free from http://www.icemark.com/. If you do, do toggle keypad true compass directions on for your sanity's sake.

As for C128 games, I'm sure there's some but none of them ever ended in to the stores I frequented back in the day. Not surprising mine was only C128 in my class, among my friends or the neighbourhood that I knew of (plenty of C64's though). I don't remember having any incompatibility issues either. Most problems were with damn casette player(s). Not missing those things most definately :-p.
Posted August 15, 2013
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Cronjob: . With almost 550 games on my GOG account,
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Romanul: Makes you wonder how bad are those 40 some games that you haven't bought. :)
Many of them are games that are not cheap and I have no interest in playing immediately or that are not cheap and I already own on Steam (where I have 1,240 and 743 pieces of DLC -- ugh) or Desura (where I have 100+), anyway. If they went down to $2.99, I'd probably jump on them just to "have them". :)

At a buck or two, I'd buy just about any full game on either service, just to . . . well, screw it -- because I have OCD and no impulse control or something, I guess! :D
Posted August 15, 2013
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Romanul: Makes you wonder how bad are those 40 some games that you haven't bought. :)
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Cronjob: Many of them are games that are not cheap and I have no interest in playing immediately or that are not cheap and I already own on Steam (where I have 1,240 and 743 pieces of DLC -- ugh) or Desura (where I have 100+), anyway. If they went down to $2.99, I'd probably jump on them just to "have them". :)

At a buck or two, I'd buy just about any full game on either service, just to . . . well, screw it -- because I have OCD and no impulse control or something, I guess! :D
I get it, you're a collector. :)
Posted August 15, 2013
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FraterPerdurabo: The whole rights battle... I won't bother going into it, but rest assured that GOG will experience the same difficulties when releasing many modern day games as it will when releasing many of the older games. In the end, it all comes down to opportunity costs. And when you can charge $40 per title as opposed to $9.99 per title the maths becomes tediously simple. The fact of the matter is that GOG is starting to lose a part of its consumer base, namely the people who came here for the good old games. Unlike some other users here, I do not view this as some kind of digital battleground. Rather, I will spend my money where I see the value and unfortunately GOG has less and less to offer me in that regard.
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JudasIscariot: I'll just say this (again):

We haven't forgotten our roots.

Thanks :D
That's good enough for me. :)
Posted August 15, 2013
I be watching for the release later today. Classic or new I am happy that GoG has more games to release. New games will one day be old, be referred to as a classic by future generations. Even Good new Games will be welcomed
Posted August 15, 2013
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JudasIscariot: I'll just say this (again):

We haven't forgotten our roots.

Thanks :D
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tapeworm00: That's good enough for me. :)
Me too.

Although........I never doubted it :)
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JMich: Sigh.
Let's go over the numbers again.
So far in 2013 GOG has released 101 games. Of those, 26 were pre-2k ones and 39 were 10+ years old on GOG release date. Lords of Midnight is listed as a 2013 release, thus not part of the classics. If you want to include it, increase the counts by 1.
In 2012 GOG released 160 games. Of those 47 were pre-2k ones and 62 were 10+ years old.
In 2011 GOG released 85 games. Of those 48 were pre-2k ones and 57 were 10+ years old.
In 2010 GOG released 79 games. Of those 35 were pre-2k ones and 36 were 10+ years old.
In 2009 GOG released 114 games. Of those 47 were pre-2k ones and 42 were 10+ years old.
In 2008 GOG released 65 games. Of those 29 were pre-2k ones and 23 were 10+ years old.

If GOG follows last year's release frequency, we are looking at ~60 more games. Lowest percentage of pre-2k games released was in 2012 with a 29%, or almost 1 in 3 games being a pre-2k one. So we can look forward to ~20 more pre-2k games.
For reference, highest percentage of classics was 56% in 2011, mostly due to EA being signed up, since 19 out of 48 pre-2k are EA titles.

So feel free to complain that GOG isn't releasing old titles, but do post your numbers. Yes, GOG hasn't released a pre-2k title for more than a month (Dracula Trilogy, GOG date July 9th 2013, original date October 1st 1999) while for 10+ years we are still a month without one (The Settlers 4, GOG date July 18th 2013, original date February 15th 2001).

Feel free to point out any errors in my data, and feel free to use said data for your own analysis/hypothesis. Personally, I don't see any reason to predict gloom, though predicting Doom would make me happy. And I guess I should make a thread next January with the statistics of GOG's releases.
Thanks JM, I've seen you post these numbers before and they tell the truth about GOG and not what some twits "think" is the truth.

And I agree with you on Doom :) Would love to see that on GOG eventually - the first FPS I ever played and still my favorite. Although.......never ever ever buy the movie. I did and it's awwwwwwful. :)
Post edited August 15, 2013 by Bloodygoodgames
Posted August 15, 2013
One of my first games and still one of my favourites. I still have the manual for the original spectrum version of this. I love the new graphics, they look like they took the old pixelated originals, smoothed them out and added in details but kept the art style, That's also the reason for the colour palette, but I'm glad they kept that too. already own the Android version of this but will probably cave and buy it again on GOG. Looking forward to Doomdark's Revenge and hope they get to making the Eye of the Moon this time around as a real end to the trilogy (don't talk to me about Citadel).
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General discussion (archive)Release: Lords of Midnight(201 posts)(201 posts)
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