Seriously? That's what you took from what I've been saying for the past couple of hours? I'm not trying to protect him, quite the contrary. I think he's anti-town and a danger to us, and that he's got a plan in motion, so we should think the situation through.

You don't think it's odd he's pushing this hard for the hammer? That he makes absolutely no effort to save himself? That he teases with a role but refuses to claim even at L-1? That he's provoking us to hammer, like right now?
Why would a townie act like that?

And you can't see a reason for this behaviour if he's town? Good, that's a start. I'm asking you, and everyone else, to examine his behaviour on the basis that he's not town - isn't that what you think of him anyway? You were the first one to vote on him.

OFFICIAL VOTE COUNT


JMich 3 - (trentonlf, yogsloth, Ixamyakxim)
HijacK 1 - (JMich)
Ixamyakxim 7 - (adaliabooks, dedoporno, cristigale, Sage103082, ddickinson, Lifthrasil, Robbeasy)


Not Voting - All others




With 14 Players Alive it will take 8 to secure a lynch.

You see scum, no need to be coy this is going really well!

A few people I feared were townie didn't drop the hammer on me. I would ask that at least one show their true scum colors and drop off of me, however. As right now any stray vote could push me over :( If you still feel the need, use whatever pretext suits you.

Remember the name of the game. It's Terror at Tres Leches, not cower in the corner and pretend to be town at Tres Leches. After we clear out a few townies we can go at each other but for now I could use a hand.

Woot?

No idea. It's is just that it's customary to claim at L-2 or L-1, unless one can give a very good reason not to. And actions taken during previous nights (or days, if any) are usually helpful for the rest of the town down the road.

BBB's Gambit or truly a Jester? Or something else entirely?

The posts from the last several hours have been nothing if not interesting. Based on Ixamyakxim’s last post, we are to believe his ploy was to draw out the townies from the anti-town factions. Rally the anti-town factions to rise up against town. I could argue the faulty logic in that but it seems like he is simply trolling now. Why? I’m not sure.

He could be trying to protect JMich, he could be a Jester, he might be Vengeful and dying (no pun intended) to use it. I would expect a true diversionary tactic to be more subtle than this. Whatever his motive, anything he claims should be seen as possibly suspect. Unless there is some obvious reason why lynching him would hurt town, I do not see why we would back down. We have plenty of time to discuss this.

If he is trying to protect JMich, does it matter if JMich survives another day? As long as we continue to lynch anti-town, we are doing what we need to win.

It is based only on a hunch. I do not have any special knowledge. My speculations start with the simplest (to verify) explanations:
1. All kills by town (lynch or night) are no flip
2. Only kills of town are flipped

Our three dead players (I’m not counting Crew) seem to support both of these options. I believe Robb is PGO (unsure if he is town) and have nothing to contradict RWarehall’s SK claim. Robb needs to be town for #1 to work. #2 can work regardless of his alignment. However, I would lean towards #1.

I assume the game was designed with the intent of having optimal balance between town and anti-town. Option #2 seems like the flips are still balanced in town’s favor. We would know when an anti-town is killed, we just would not know their role. I’m not sure how this helps balance the scales. #1 seems more plausible with multiple anti-town factions (the flavor supports multiple, just not sure how many). No-flip on a kill by town is not only detrimental to us, it is also detrimental to anti-town. When a kill is not one of their own faction, the faction is uncertain whether the kill was someone from another faction or town (without other info from night actions). With RWarehall gone, we could be down to one faction or still have more than one. Originally, I thought option #1 swings the balance too far against town, but I failed to consider how it impacted multiple anti-town factions.

If #1 is true, we never get a flip on lynch. If #2 is true, we only get a flip when we lynch town.

Having said all that, it may not be that simple. I don’t remember who suggested this, but a more complex possibility is flip based on the hammer. It might also be something I’m overlooking.

Look. At worst he is vengeful scum and one of us will die to take him down. If that's what you're all worried about I will unvote, let someone else vote and hammer him myself and take what ever comes my way.

Judging by his last post I think he's trying to draw out the other scum team for his buddies benefit.

I do wonder if the reason we haven't got a hammer yet is because scum are worried if they hammer we will get a flip (as JMich suggested before).

The fact is I think we can all agree at this point he is anti town, and whatever 'plan' he has we need to lynch him. It's as simple as that. He may not be (a movie star! No wait that's not it..) a self confessed SK but I don't see any more reason for keeping him alive than we had for keeping RWarehall alive.

This suggestion might actually have been a warning to fellow scum. Rephrasing it, JMich was basically saying: don't hammer if you are scum, you might cause a flip.

I agree. Even if he's vengeful, a one-for-one trade is usually good for town. So let's lynch him now and JMich tomorrow (if nothing drastic happens at night that casts doubt on JMich's scummyness).

One thing that got me thinking was the combination of Ix's post and his plea to fellow scum [url=http://www.gog.com/forum/general/gog_mafia_25_terror_at_tres_leches/post1712]1712. Combined these two make it look as though Ix assumes (or knows) that Sage is fellow-scum and that's why he is surprised that he is 'on' him. But of course it may be that this is exactly the impression that Ix was going for ... something to think about.

But my main question right now is: where the hell are HijacK and CSPVG? Are they both afraid of hammering and hide? CSPVG is on my watchlist anyhow and somehow this renewed lurking fits, but HijacK's absence looks bad too!

Hm, development?! Did lx just claim scum?



Anyway, I see one possible scenario where all this actually makes some sense (even though it tampers with my views on JMich). Lovers. From opposing factions. One goes, the other goes as well. Lx seemed like he was trying to protect JMich when he was the trendy thing. He would, in order to save his own skin. But when attention shifted and votes started to rain down on Lx he suddenly lost all interest in trying to survive and even pretty much tried to rally the scum in an all out war. This looks like nothing else than a suicide mission. If the theory is correct and both lx and JMich are lovers this would only makes sense if they are of opposing factions. Lx's fate is pretty much sealed, why not take down and enemy in the process as well? The decision to keep his role secret also works in favor of this theory. What bothers me is that JMich haven't said anything about it even though he had the chance. He chose to distance himself from this by guessing Jester or some more complex plan.

Another very possible thing is that JMich is anti-town (not mafia, but not town, too). Lx did say all townies should be killed first and the survivors will handle things between them afterwards...

JMich, this seems like the second (in my experience) time where you will most likely end up as collateral damage. Last time you said you didn't have the chance to say anything. Now you did, but didn't do it. Am I wrong or was that on purpose?



@cristigale, thank you for answering my question.

I just checked. It's been 3 days since CSPVG posted. But HijacK's last post was 10 pages and 10 days ago! (if I didn't overlook anything)


@flubb: can we haz prod on these two? And if HijacK can't participate any longer because RL happened (which would be unfortunate, but which is a valid assuption after 10 days of absence), could he get a replacement?

HijacK already received a soft prod not long ago, maybe a harder one in the form of an email-triggering PM should be the next step.

Yeah, this definitely crossed my mind. But it just seems odd that we've got a few people hovering around not willing to put a hammer on... (I don't count HijacK or CSPVG in that as they seem to be AWOL rather than reluctant to vote)

I thought the thing with Sage might just be a misdirect (I know I tried to do something similar as scum last game when I knew I was going down and throw some suspicion on CSPVG and others), but it's certainly worth looking at.

It does look like it.

I think it's possible we have lovers here, but I think the vengeful idea still stands, one for one trade is still a town win so I don't think it should hold us back here.

I'm wondering if all the posturing has any accuracy to it, as Ix seems convinced we have not just more than 1 scum team, but a lot of scum. But this could just be being said to put us off.

I can handle that.

I finally heard from Hijack on Steam. He has been busy with school and will be posting later today.

A question I have is if people think they are lovers why hasn't JMich spoken up? If they are lovers would not JMich be removed from the game too if a lynch of Ix happens. JMich's response to Ix's behavior does not seem to be one who is concerned about being removed from the game from being a lover.

Is Ix trying to protect JMich? I don't think he is. I think this odd behavior is coming from whatever Ix's role is.

Well, this exact thing happened in the school game and JMich was removed as collateral for failing to speak up. If I remember correctly things moved too fast and he didn't have the chance that time, but now he did. That's why I asked him about it.



My vacation is now over and I'll be getting back to work tomorrow. I will actually have some interviews and hopefully recruit some people tomorrow, so I don't think I'll be able to stay late and participate in case something goes up. Just something to keep in mind if things go crazy and I'm not around.