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General discussionCaptain Sapphire THE MOVIE (gog mafia #57) (1080 posts)(1080 posts)
(1080 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted April 01, 2019
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Microfishd: BTW @mod. Do the votes reset to zero for everyone after the night phase?
yes, the new 'Day' starts fresh
Posted April 01, 2019
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JoeSapphire: yes, the new 'Day' starts fresh
good to know, thanks!
Posted April 01, 2019
@microfishd I didn't vote for no unmasking, I voted for Trent. Korotan voted for no unmasking, probably because he's new

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supplementscene: If Fran isn't posting, he/she should probably be subbed out rather than being lynched imo
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dedoporno: If they didn't post at all I would have agreed with that. But they did. They came and took part in the game which technically reset their late timer and even the mod acknowledged it counts as good enough for continuing the game. So, from technical perspective Fran is fine and that's the issue. Fran wasted 5 days and took part just enough to not get kicked out / modkilled / whatever just before the deadline hit (back then it wasn't publicly clear what sort of extension we'll get) with literally 2 lines of text that doesn't have anything to do with solving the actual game. If that wasn't the case I would probably have preferred to go with someone else and leave Fran for tomorrow but this happens to be the most anti-town play we actually have on our hands - it's basically "I want to play after all but I won't try and help the town".

With that being the case I, personally, would go with the scummiest target even though there isn't that much contextual interactions to analyze Tomorrow. To be honest, most of the alternatives are being voted off based on hunches and off-feelings anyway.

With that being said, I'm not deadlocked on Fran. I can be persuaded to vote for Scene or SPF but I repeat that it would be mostly to secure a lynch and it's based on nothing concrete.


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supplementscene: Dedoporno and HSL are 4th and 5th votes on Fran.
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dedoporno: I see that you have realized this isn't true in your later post.

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supplementscene: Is writing Shoot Player X instead of Vote Player X really the big deal he makes it out to be?
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dedoporno: I don't know about HSL but I, personally, am quite annoyed by and don't like it one bit. I haven't taken the time read the complete role list with whatever possible powers and modifiers there are so I assume that one of these can actually be doing what it says or something different than actually placing a vote and I don't like that potentially being hidden behind incorrect voting phrases.

If you are voting someone just vote them (ideally bolded). Maybe consider it common courtesy to your fellow players?

I see you already agreed to the above about voting, thank you for that.
I suppose this makes sense, if we can't get a sub Fran will have to be lynched. I haven't played Mafia in a while, do we need 7 votes to confirm the lynch or can the lynch happen without a clear majority?

I won't hammer anyway as Hyper wanted to post today, but I would like to get into Day 2 and go as everyone grouping on the lurker doesn't tell us a whole lot about 'them'. Although I do expect 1 or 2 Mafia members to be on Fran's wagon as it makes a great annonymous vote. Not the best start for town unless Fran is on the Mafia team.

@joesapphire hopefully you can get the night phase quickly coordinated so we get back to playing ASAP
Posted April 01, 2019
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supplementscene: I haven't played Mafia in a while, do we need 7 votes to confirm the lynch or can the lynch happen without a clear majority?
Yes. Currently six votes are on lynching Fran, only one required to get the majority.
Posted April 01, 2019
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Microfishd: How does a modkill differ from a lynch?
A modkill isn't supported by players like a lynch is. It's the decision of the mod. So we don't have the votes that we have on a lynch wagon and we don't have the arguments that accompany those votes. Which means, we have less to analyze. Also, sometimes modkills don't generate flips while lynches usually do (flip=the reveal of role and alignment of the dead player). I don't know whether that's the case in this game. But the point is, we gain more info from a lynch than we gain from a modkill. Not much more in the case of Fran, but still somewhat more. A modkill should only be the last resort.

@mod: would a modkill generate a flip in this game?
Posted April 01, 2019
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Korotan: I guess you are no Roleplayer. Because IC and OC are common shortcuts their for In Character as when you write as role like me Koro Koro Tank or Out Character when you write as the player behind it.
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ZFR: OK. Please be aware that this is not a roleplay game though. You should play as the player, the characters Zephyr, Koro Koro and the rest are just flavour to make the game a bit interesting to read. You can roleplay if you wish, many auers do, but the objective is to figure out which faction the player, not the character, belongs to.

(Don't mean to sound belligerent, but we got a tough D2 ahead of us if we end up voting Fran)
If this is not a roleplay why did then Saphhire RP and gave each of us a RP character?
Posted April 01, 2019
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Korotan: If this is not a roleplay why did then Saphhire RP and gave each of us a RP character?
Just as flavour. Think of the scenario as backdrop or fluff. It just adds a little color. The real game is taking place in direct conversation. It is a game of deduction. Roleplaying a specific character just gets in the way. As I stated several times: clarity is in the best interest of Town. We are trying to solve a social riddle. Our main weapon is figuring out who is lying - and acting is always a little bit lying too. Or in other words, scum players could abuse roleplaying as excuses. "Naah! I didn't mean that! That's just something my character would say." Also, any kind of confusion is good for scum and bad for town.

One of the core tenets of Mafia is: DON'T LIE AS TOWN. EVER! ... and lynch all liars. Scum players have no choice but to lie and sometimes they get caught. So if town keeps to the tenet of never lying, every liar lynched is automatically scum.

In conclusion: if you are Town (=Hero in this game) and you want your faction to win, better stop the role-playing. It is an unnecessary effort on your part and it acts potentially against Town.
Posted April 01, 2019
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Lifthrasil: @mod: would a modkill generate a flip in this game?
Yes it would.


Four hours to deadline
Posted April 01, 2019
Hopefully Hyper can be on soon so they can say what they wanted to. I will hammer in the next 2-3 hours, I can’t guarantee I’ll be here at the end of day.
Posted April 01, 2019
Sorry @all, I'm still very tired and a bit feverish, so it's taking longer than I thought it would or want it to.


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ZFR: Micro's back on the lyst (lynch-list; I created a neologism hooray, hooray) after trent pointed out how he asked newbie questions that were already answered. [...]
I had to go back and look at how things unfolded timeline-wise, and have to admit that this looks a tad bad, given that Microfishd takes notice of who were helpful to the newbies.


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ZFR: [...] Overall he feels like he's trying to appear more newbie than he is.[...]
I don't know, tone-wise their ISO says it's not an act. Perhaps they're a great performer, but I'd not vote them Today, even with Fran67 out of the picture.


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ZFR: [...] Also see my post 193. There is nothing wrong with going with gut feelings, especially on Day 1, but usually they are backed by something (e.g. by that player's previous games or by comparing them to other players he played against). [...]
Not necessarily. Before factoring in alignment, I think that one's own logic and way of approaching things in general is the leans through which we read/interpret the content and tone of what others post, more so when unfamiliar with the poster. Add the lack of hard facts to base one's assessment/judgment on, and you get one's initial gut feelings.


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ZFR: Yes, that will make lynching super useful.[...]
My very first mafia game was flubbucket's (now) legendary milk game (#25). It was an 18 players Role Madness game setup, with no flips, two lonely Godfathers who each had to build their mafia team by Goons finding either one of them and getting recruited (until then they had no killing power, only the Godfathers did), plus a SK. Town had a Coroner who was the N1 NK, so we never got a single flip all game long. And if this wasn't enough, both Godfathers kept targetting the same player for the first three Nights, until one killed the other.

It still was a fun game, and town managed to win.



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trentonlf: [...] I find Scene a more likely scum candidate now. Scene's last post was 3 Days ago according to the timestamp and he's only had 3 posts in the game. It's so far out of norm for his play and it doesn't feel right.[...]
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trentonlf: [...] You have not been invested in this game, you started late and went 3 days between posts after that. When you did post as I said already it was very blasé. That sounds like a mafia player who’s unsure what to say. Coming in close to deadline and appearing to be more active doesn’t change my opinion of you.
[emphasis added]

Do you think this is a new approach from scum!supplementscene in order not to repeat mistakes from the past?
Since he's not a new player to a number of us, he should know that we keep an eye on him, and that his play this game has attracted as much attention as his previous ones. What do you make of the fact that he doesn't seem (particularly?) concerned about all this?


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trentonlf: [...] The bad part is the Fran wagon will give no real information because their lynch would be based on their lack of participation and not because of anything they've done or said. [...]
[emphasis added]

I assume that you don't see their attitude the way dedoporno and I do, yes? I understand that you're pretty hard locked on supplementscene, but from what we've seen so far, do you expect Fran67 to start playing D2 and onwards? I mean, play for real, engage others and do some game solving?


I'd appreciate a bump.
Posted April 01, 2019
Where is everyone when you need a bump?


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Microfishd: [...] I was referring to Post #34 & 88 as what I see as the "analysis posts" (I may well be using "analysis" wrong). [...]
He's giving his reasons for voting ZFR, which are based on his analysis of the situation that led him to that vote. Even what you call "attacks" on others are based on analysing a situation and/or someone's play. So your use of the term "analysis" isn't wrong, I just don't get why it's reflecting negatively on trentonlf when applying it to why and how he voted ZFR.


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Microfishd: [...] You're flat out wrong. As i already explained, I'd asked the question in post 117. When i did extended research for my post 119, I found some of the terms I asked about in 117. [...]
He's not flat out wrong. trentonlf had provided definitions of the terms RVS and LAMIST as early as in his post #34. A post central to your read of trentonlf. So it is eyebrow raising that you've missed them when you seem to be keeping track of who's been helpful and in what way, especially to someone who feels something's off about you.

I myself had overlooked that you've been narrowing it down to your posts #117 and #119, and admit it doesn't look good since we're talking about trentonlf's post #34 and you did comment about people's helpfulness after it and before your post #117, but based on the tone of your overall play, I'm only making a mental note of this for now.


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Microfishd: [...] I am very glad that the tests "weren't all bad" and hope that you recover health soon. Fevers are no fun. Please get healthy soon! [...]
Thanks. And I now feel bad for neglecting to wish you well on your own injury earlier; I appreciate the effort you're making to stay active in the game despite it, and hope it won't affect your recovery much.


And speaking of health issues affecting people's participation, I can't help but get back to SirPrimalform. Again, I sympathise with his condition, but I wonder if there isn't more to him.

In post #192 he said [emphasis added]:
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SirPrimalform: [...] I hope we can get a deadline extension so that they (and I) can get up to speed.
Then in post #200 [emphasis added]:
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SirPrimalform: [...] As in, "today's posts seem to be mostly about voting mechanics". I'm sorry, I haven't yet gone back and read a lot of what I missed.
That was two days ago according to the forum timestamps, yet in post #215, more than a day later (again according to timestamps at the moment of this writing) [emphasis added]:
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SirPrimalform: Doesn't seem like anything spectacular or game changing has happened since last night's post.[...]
Followed by post #236 made a few hours earlier today:
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SirPrimalform: Will hammer Fran('s mask off) to avoid no-unmasking, but only as a last resort as I don't feel especially qualified to make any real judgements right now. [...]
I get that he wasn't doing so hot for the past week, but looking at this series of posts, it seems a tad too convenient that, besides Fran67 and Korotan (who seems to have gravely misunderstood the nature of the game), he's ending D1 with no record of any sort of meaningful comment, scum-hunting and/or (even tentative) suspect(s) of any sort. Because he's not caught up with the thread in spite multiple references of intention to do so. The only thing we have is a watered down FoS at PookaMustard due to the disclaimer that even that vote would be to avoid No-Lynch.

Going to get some lunch to take my meds, then get to supplementscene.
Posted April 01, 2019
bimp
Posted April 01, 2019
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Lifthrasil: @mod: would a modkill generate a flip in this game?
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JoeSapphire: Yes it would.

Four hours to deadline
You've moved the deadline forward 25 minutes or so, why!?
Posted April 01, 2019
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trentonlf: [...] You have not been invested in this game, you started late and went 3 days between posts after that. When you did post as I said already it was very blasé. That sounds like a mafia player who’s unsure what to say. Coming in close to deadline and appearing to be more active doesn’t change my opinion of you.
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HypersomniacLive: [emphasis added]

Do you think this is a new approach from scum!supplementscene in order not to repeat mistakes from the past?
Since he's not a new player to a number of us, he should know that we keep an eye on him, and that his play this game has attracted as much attention as his previous ones. What do you make of the fact that he doesn't seem (particularly?) concerned about all this?

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trentonlf: [...] The bad part is the Fran wagon will give no real information because their lynch would be based on their lack of participation and not because of anything they've done or said. [...]
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HypersomniacLive: [emphasis added]

I assume that you don't see their attitude the way dedoporno and I do, yes? I understand that you're pretty hard locked on supplementscene, but from what we've seen so far, do you expect Fran67 to start playing D2 and onwards? I mean, play for real, engage others and do some game solving?

I'd appreciate a bump.
I find it interesting with Scene that once I started pointing out that he was not invested and his posts up to that point had been very blasé that he became a lot more active and started giving analysis. He used the excuse that he needed the day to progress before he could give any real analysis, and that excuse stinks IMO. My guess is he was trying to lay low at the start of the game and realized it was causing him to look bad. I could be wrong, but he feels off this game. I also had to laugh when he said “It’s been awhile since I played mafia, it takes 7 to lynch right?” Maybe he doesn’t know how to do math anymore to figure out what a majority vote is? Looks like to me that he’s trying to appear “unsure” of things to try and garner some sympathy.

No, I actually agree with you and Dedo about Fran. I just wish we could get more info from their lynch if they are not scum because it’s an easy wagon to be on without looking bad.
Posted April 01, 2019
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SirPrimalform: You've moved the deadline forward 25 minutes or so, why!?
Are you in some sort of a hurry?
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionCaptain Sapphire THE MOVIE (gog mafia #57) (1080 posts)(1080 posts)
(1080 posts)