Lin545: It would be seriously cool for Spanish natives to describe the situation. It looks like the society is "classically" split between those supporting riot police and those against it.

T.Hodd: Seriously, this isn't what I expect to see on the news in the 21st century. I'm not sure if they understand what 'democracy' is because this isn't.

Edit: Wait, they're attacking firefighters! What is this!? Why are they so determined to stop this vote that they'll commit atrocities against their own people?

"It is frightening. We are living in a world where human rights are being ignored.

[i]What is happening at the moment is a mini revolution – the Catalans
want a referendum and right now we are waiting for Guardias to arrive as that is what has been happening elsewhere. Old people have been attacked ... We are doing what we want to do which is just vote.[/i]

[i]It has not been violent where we are but what we are hearing and
seeing [is worrying]. Last night, I was outside the square eating sausages we cooked on the BBQ and talking about what tomorrow means and now we are talking about what Monday means and Tuesday. It is frightening. We are living in a world where human rights are being ignored. I think Catalonia deserves to be listened to.[/i]

If the rest of the world does not put its arms up and prevent the Spanish government from attacking peaceful demonstrators, then that is worrying.

I have got children with me at the moment. They know what is going on and they can feel this tension – it’s just not nice. You bring children up to be peaceful and seeing the establishment carry old ladies off. It would be great if everything news-wise shows what is really happenings."

Fiona Williamson, 44, from Barcelona

Siegor: This is appalling. The news at lunch time showed civilians bloodied and an image of a 20 something woman being tackled by 4 officers in riot gear. I don't think anything warrants this kind of violent attitude.

T.Hodd: I wouldn't be at all surprised if the UN take (some form of) action against this. It's disgusting. I thought humanity had got over this.

Caesar.: I will bite. The "referendum" has ben ruled illegal by every single court up to the Constitutional Court, but the regional government has decided to hold it anyway after repeated warnings from judges that it was illegal. So the police are doing their job, and according to the videos I've seen on TV (on different news channels), with the exact proportioned means you would expect in this situation.

Siegor: Let's hope so. If the referendum is indeed ilegal then why have the police use force and rubber bullets instead of simply not accepting it?

Caesar.: I will bite. The "referendum" has ben ruled illegal by every single court up to the Constitutional Court, but the regional government has decided to hold it anyway after repeated warnings from judges that it was illegal. So the police are doing their job, and according to the videos I've seen on TV (on different news channels), with the exact proportioned means you would expect in this situation.

That article tells only one side of the story: the side from the nationalistists' propaganda, which would make "1984" proud. They will call any kind of police intervention "excessive force against peaceful protestors". I would like to encourage everybody interested in these news to look for both sides, not just one.

T.Hodd: ....
Exactly, just like the 'referendum' in Ukraine. The police didn't go and attack all of the pro-russians, but the results were ignored(sort of).

Lin545: I am not sure. you understand yourself what this word means... Do a little research about who and how it was introduced into the language. =)

Lin545: They don't look like nationalists to me.. Nationalist is someone, who has country ideology literally above everything. Just voting or expressing preference to different flag, does not make one nationalist. But those who commit violence to "protect dignity of flag" - those are nationalists...

Caesar.: For those who were asking what I meant about "proportioned means": from what I've read from non-nationalist-propaganda sources, the incidents have happened with protestors harassing and threatening the police while they were doing their job, not "people peacefully waiting to vote". If this is proven not to be the case, I will gladly take my words back.

Caesar.: Also: voting for independence is not a "human right". The propaganda has been repeating this for months, but it is not.

Caesar.: If you don't think those protestors are nationalists... then you don't know very much about Catalonia. (I don't mean it in a condescending way. I encourage you to research the situation if you're interested about it. This is a textbook example of a nationalist government trying to model a society after their ideology).

Crosmando: No offense, but there isn't many examples in history where a a region has seceded from a country without the permission of the mother country, without some kind of fight taking place. I personally think the idea of secessionism is a downfall spiral because once you guarantee the universal right to self-determination, it means any tiny tribe or region can claim to be a nation, splintering nations into every smaller states like what happened to the former Yugoslavia.