It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
avatar
advowson: On the subject, how about a bit more transparency about pending updates and update policies? For example, GOG's offering of AI War is more than 2 years out of date. AI War's developer says they sent a new update to GOG, but it clearly never arrived. The GOG store page for AI War makes no mention of how badly outdated GOG's offering is. The only ways to discover this are for the in-game updater to successfully call home and then start asking to update (and, according to another recent post, that update doesn't even install correctly, though it runs fine once the user works around the bad update) or for the user to go browse the developer's changelog and notice the severe discrepancy between the in-game version number and the entries in the changelog.
,,,
Yet in all that two years, what's the dev actually done about it?

Simple fact is, it's the devs responsibility to update all versions of their game, wherever they sold them.
If they "send" an update, and game fails to update on GOG, the dev needs to find out why.
Not shrug their shoulders, and ignore it.

Over 2 years of inactivitty, suggests it's the dev that doesn't give a damn, and I wouldn't be surprised if the update was never semt.

This is such an example, update was sent to a testing channel, only dev can access.
Misunderstanding was quickly sorted out, and the patch released.

Since Galaxy came out, it's easier than ever for a dev to provide updates on GOG.
GOG's only responsible for packaging the offline installers, once they have the update on the Galaxy release channel.

Providing the update is always the devs responsibilty, and simply saying we sent one, doesn't change it.
Even if the dev did send one, as in this game, it has to be sent on the release channel, to be added automatically.
Post edited August 21, 2017 by UhuruNUru
Okay, the patch is up. The devs said on steam that they sent the patch to gog a week ago and I thought gog was dragging its feet. Turned out to be a simple mix-up. I take back my complaint that started this thread.

That said, please don't start overly relying on galaxy, some of us still like our patches and installers safely burned to disk.
avatar
UhuruNUru: [...]
Simple fact is, it's the devs responsibility to update all versions of their game, wherever they sold them.
If they "send" an update, and game fails to update on GOG, the dev needs to find out why.
Not shrug their shoulders, and ignore it.
[...]
actually, no. it is the users responsibility to get the patch from where the devs make them available, the devs have no legal (but arguably they do have a moral) responsibility to make a patch available for each store. It is still a left over from when software was sold physically, which is not yet updated to online sales.

Here it is a fact that the devs actually have no responsibility at all.... doesn't make them less of a duchbag if they don't update all digital outlets, though, but it is a matter of good will, not responsibility,

It is in gOg's interest that the games are up-to-date, and therefore their job to chase them down if this does not happen.
avatar
UhuruNUru: Yet in all that two years, what's the dev actually done about it?
Released ~26 updates that never made it to GOG, but are available for anonymous download from the developers' AWS-leased web server. For users who accept the default-enabled automatic update mechanism, the game (supposedly) can update itself with nothing more than an Are-you-sure confirmation from the user.

avatar
UhuruNUru: Simple fact is, it's the devs responsibility to update all versions of their game, wherever they sold them.
If they "send" an update, and game fails to update on GOG, the dev needs to find out why.
Not shrug their shoulders, and ignore it.
I am not familiar with GOG's developer-facing portals. Are you saying that the developer has an easy way to detect that GOG is out of date? It's not particularly easy for customers to see; it's impossible for anonymous users reading the GOG store page to see. If the developers don't have their game listed in a GOG account, they can't check the version that way, so either GOG has a developer-facing portal that shows it to them or they simply cannot see it at all and must rely on user feedback. That is part of what I mentioned above: provide a transparency mechanism so users can see whether the developers have done anything at all to provide updates.

avatar
UhuruNUru: Over 2 years of inactivitty, suggests it's the dev that doesn't give a damn, and I wouldn't be surprised if the update was never semt.
The developer has been very responsive to the community and released numerous patches (most of them beta patches, but some full formal releases too). Per the link in my prior post, GOG elected to stop updating the game because there were more beta patches released than GOG cared to handle.
avatar
UhuruNUru: This is such an example, update was sent to a testing channel, only dev can access.
Misunderstanding was quickly sorted out, and the patch released.
Sorted out after someone who had no access to see this complained publicly, prompting an investigation.
avatar
UhuruNUru: Since Galaxy came out, it's easier than ever for a dev to provide updates on GOG.
GOG's only responsible for packaging the offline installers, once they have the update on the Galaxy release channel.
Please don't act like Galaxy is actually useful for this.
avatar
UhuruNUru: Providing the update is always the devs responsibilty, and simply saying we sent one, doesn't change it.
Even if the dev did send one, as in this game, it has to be sent on the release channel, to be added automatically.
Sure, and with increased transparency as I described above, we'd have a better idea of what happened in cases like this:

- Developer didn't send it at all. Maybe they said they sent it because
they misremembered, or they don't want to admit not sending it.
- Developer thought they sent it, but it was orphaned in the update
system or otherwise dropped, so nobody on the GOG side even knew to
look at it.
- Developer sent it properly and GOG is sitting on it due to lack of
employee time to package the patch.
- Developer sent it properly, GOG is aware of it, and is sitting on it
due to quality control / policy issues.
avatar
advowson: See last post
I don't have all the answers, but though I personally detest store clients, Galaxy has certainly put the direct control of updates in the devs hands, if they use it correctly.

I have no access to the dev tools, but statements made here by GOG, and Devs make it clear, that the devs do have direct access to update their game on Galaxy.

GOG is certainly responsible for packaging the offline installers, but I've seen no evidence they aren't doing that.
Sometimes it might be a full game update, rather than a patch, but again I think that depends on how the devs updated Galaxy.
Better transparancy, and update system improvements, is always desirable, for both the customeer, and the devs.

The fact remains, providing updates is always the devs responsibility.
When they manage to get it right using Steam's system, but fail on any other method, it's still their responsibility.
Even if the fault lies in GOG's systems, it's still always the devs responsibility to get it put right.
Saying "we sent it", shrugging their shoulders, and blaming GOG, doesn't solve the issue.
Even if GOG's system is at fault. GOG still needs Devs providiing feedback to pinpoint weaknesses.

Simple fact is the Dev will likely only have one game, being actively updated, at that time.
Stores will have many, each day. So sheer self interest, should be all the dev needs to get it put right.
When they get it right on the biggest store, but not others, then they aren't treating all customers the same.
That's the real problem here.
I expect them to get it right for largest group first, that's just common sense, but not to ignore other customers entirely.

No matter whose at fault, it comes down to the dev being responsible for putting things right, whatever that requires.
Post edited August 26, 2017 by UhuruNUru
avatar
UhuruNUru: I don't have all the answers, but though I personally detest store clients, Galaxy has certainly put the direct control of updates in the devs hands, if they use it correctly.
Except that Galaxy is such a disaster that there are users who never use it, so saying that "The update is available on Galaxy" is a cop-out.
avatar
UhuruNUru: I have no access to the dev tools, but statements made here by GOG, and Devs make it clear, that the devs do have direct access to update their game on Galaxy.
Sure, and that does no good at all for the people who rely on offline installers.
avatar
UhuruNUru: GOG is certainly responsible for packaging the offline installers, but I've seen no evidence they aren't doing that.
So you haven't seen my posts?
avatar
UhuruNUru: The fact remains, providing updates is always the devs responsibility.
Sure, up to the point that they hand it off to GOG for packaging. As far as I know, the developers don't have access to put things directly into the GOG download pages, so once they've given the patch to GOG to package, it's on GOG to actually package and post it. Or are you saying it's the developer's responsibility to hack into the GOG system and package it if GOG doesn't package it in a timely manner? ;)
avatar
UhuruNUru: Even if the fault lies in GOG's systems, it's still always the devs responsibility to get it put right.
If they don't have any tools to know it went wrong, and they don't have any access to put it right, how is it their responsibility?
avatar
UhuruNUru: Even if GOG's system is at fault. GOG still needs Devs providiing feedback to pinpoint weaknesses.
Agreed.
avatar
UhuruNUru: No matter whose at fault, it comes down to the dev being responsible for putting things right, whatever that requires.
So would it be fair to characterize your position as "The developer is always wrong and GOG is always right"? That certainly seems to be the position you're arguing.

Incidentally, GOG silently updated AI War: Fleet Command to 8.024 (current, as of this writing) sometime recently. Since it was silent, I can't tell exactly when it happened, but regardless, I'm glad that this one is now right.
avatar
advowson: Incidentally, GOG silently updated AI War: Fleet Command to 8.024 (current, as of this writing) sometime recently. Since it was silent, I can't tell exactly when it happened, but regardless, I'm glad that this one is now right.
I did see your, posts about AI War Fleet Command, and that specific game has a built in updating system, so doesn't rely on GOG, alone, as you had said, and likely complicates the issue somewhat.

My position is GOG's only responsible for the offline installers, not the Galaxy updates, which like it, or not (I don't) is the main pipeline for devs to directly update the games.
I also only use offline installers, and still know of no games getting updates on Galaxy, and not getting offline ones.
That means I don't know about it, not that it hasn't happened.

As for the "Silent Update"
My copy states
Version: 8.024, Date Published: 24/8/2017

So it updated 4 days ago., don't know if you see that, as I have Barefoot Essentials, and Adalia Fundamentals installed.
They are better than GOG at keeping track of updates, that has got worse on the site, since Galaxy arrived.
Didn't tell me about this one though, it's a mod, and not perfect.

There's this user thread, that tries to keep track of all updates
The "what did just update?" thread

Maybe it's because I mod most games, and require update coordination between game, and mods, so getting them ASAP isn't a huge deal to me, I usually have to give the mods time to catch up anyway.
Post edited August 28, 2017 by UhuruNUru