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I thought the X models also came with bigger coolers.
Themken: I thought the X models also came with bigger coolers.
I think some fist generation X models actually came without coolers. Personally, I would prefer to be able to buy any given CPU without a cooler, because I'll always get an aftermarket cooler after doing some research - that being probably something from be quiet!.
Sure you can buy the tray version. A pity they often cost MORE than the boxed versions.
Themken: Sure you can buy the tray version. A pity they often cost MORE than the boxed versions.
I don't remember seeing any try version for Ryzen. At least not at my store of choice. But it's nice if they offer them as well.
Ryzen 1000 series definitely had tray models since we even got a few of them here, but they certainly weren't very common in retail. I haven't seen any retail for Ryzen 2000 though, but then I haven't looked especially.

Ryzen 1700X and 1800X had no cooler, but the Wraith Prism would have been fine. From personal experience the Prism which came with the 1700 is extremely good for a stock cooler- but I cannot recommend the thermal paste though, it sets like cement. I upgraded to a Noctua later and gave myself a heart attack when despite warming the CPU up it pulled out of the socket when trying to get the cooler off (no damage though, fortunately).

XFR is pretty useful if you don't want to spend the time getting the absolute best overclock possible. Most people also don't manually overclock at all (even true, iirc, for the 9900k and other Intel flagships) and rely on boost only, so an automatic overclocker is potentially useful to a lot of people.
low rated
We've got a new beast coming in September:

* Ryzen 9 3950X 16C/32T 3.5/4.7GHz 105W 64MB L3 Cache $749

And 2 new APUs which are not Zen 2 but Zen+ (12nm FinFET process) coming in July:

* Ryzen 5 3400G 4C/8T 3.7/4.2GHz Vega 11 65W 6MB L3 Cache $149
* Ryzen 3 3200G 4C/4T 3.6/4.0GHz Vega 8 65W 6MB L3 Cache $99
Post edited June 11, 2019 by PainOfSalvation
All quiet in here...
Themken: All quiet in here...
The calm before the storm? :D

I'm excited to see the real world benchmarks. Still loving my 1700X but I did consider upgrading for the hell of it. Tomorrow will be an exciting day for sure.
Reviews are out and Zen2 looks really great.

I haven't put together a PC in many years but with that 65W 3700X I'm strongly considering building a sff mini ITX computer.

As for Navi... well I wasn't expecting the cards to be great (I assume nobody was) so no surprises on that front.
From what i can see the 3700x is defo the best buy especially with that TDP of 65w, about same performance as the 3900x in gaming and at a much lower price point.

As for Navi, i think the RX 5700 is a worthwhile mid range card, and something i'd consider upgrading too.
I was hoping for the 3000 series to beat Intel's 9000 series in some games at least :-/ Even if the difference is small now, Intel will release their new processors for desktop computers soon seeing how they already released them for the mobile market.

The overclocking was disappointing as the benefits were very limited but the automatism is very nice as it will then also clock down automatically.

To invest in PCIe 4.0 now or not? Looking into my crystal ball and only seeing mist.

I guess fast RAM will sell out soon as everyone scambles to grab a set to go with these.

Intel's Core i7-9700K still looks like the best choice for a pure gaming pc.

Now waiting for these processors to show up in shops here so I can see the prices.
Here are a lot of reviews:

Didn't have time to check much but from what've seen big jump in IPC (~15%) comparing to Zen+ like they promised.

@Themken: Intel won't release new desktop processors yet, they're still struggling with 10nm. And when they do, i'm sure AMD will have answer for that.
PCIe only benefits NVMe type stuff at the moment, even a 2080Ti doesn't saturate PCIe 3 yet. It's a buying point, but like RTX its practical use is near zero at present.

Intel has nothing to release on desktop except a rumoured 10 core Comet Lake 14nm refresh. Their binning is topped out so they can't get better clocks on 14nm which leaves adding cores; while losing performance to security mitigations. 10nm? Do not hold your breath (rather long winded explanation as to why below...)

They've been promising 10nm since 2015 (and volume since 2016). The 10nm SKUs for Ice Lake and the single Cannon Lake SKU are laptop only as they have the double whammy of poor clocks and bad yield- and that on their lowest density 10nm setting as well, which is actually less dense than Samsung/ TSMC existing 7nm bulk process already is (Intel has three 'density' sets for 10nm, 2 are better than others' 7nm but only the worse one is working). Poor clocks don't matter on laptops as the chips are undervolted/ clocked anyway to save power and even the Ryzen models have few cores, but they're deadly to desktop performance where thermal constraints are a lot less. To get viable desktop chips they need better yields/ more working cores, higher clocks and the higher density 10nm to be working as otherwise they will be worse than the chips they already have. Even if they have 18% better IPC that is performance per clock; a 30% drop in clockspeed completely removes that advantage and then some. The realistic estimate for desktop 10nm is 2021, and perhaps the super realistic estimate is no 10nm desktop chips at all or a very limited release like the 5775C was for Broadlake, with a kludge like the 5775's expensive on chip EDRAM to boost performance. And, rumour is that Intel's 7nm process was built on 10nm, so they may not even have anything to skip to without fixing 10nm first. Only good thing from Intel's perspective is that at least desktop is a small part of the overall market, but without good yield they can't get 10nm into the extremely high margin server market either as they need lots of working cores for that even with low clockspeed. And that is why they took the rather extraordinary step of firing their CEO publicly with no benefits; not because he was boffing his secretary as stated.

Ultimately, Intel royally screwed the pooch by tying architecture improvements in their CPUs to specific manufacturing processes; so they simply cannot make Sunny Cove based cores on the 14nm process as might be a sensible stop gap as they will only work with the 10nm process, and their 14nm chips are also stuck with awful integrated graphics 2 gens behind what they could produce on 10nm, if it were working.
Phasmid: Their binning is topped out so they can't get better clocks on 14nm which leaves adding cores; while losing performance to security mitigations.
I swear that's the top thing I am so irritated about Intel. They gotta revamp their hardware design from the scratch. At this point it's a flat out stupidity and it is the customers that are losing because of it.

I probably will vote with my money and go with AMD build for my next PC because of that.
Post edited July 08, 2019 by zeroxxx