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Made a Monk too.

For not starting 13+ CHA, will likely miss on some quests, starting with Zhurlong'sBoots.
For starting with 18- STR will miss on certain stuff, starting with Joseph's Greenstone Ring (to bash the door you either need adequate lockpick, or 19 STR to bash).
For not being a mageling, can't circumgo the Problem of the Tomes, thus this char will not have them.

I also for see problem not being able to cause all sorts of damage (no non-magic attack: problem with magic golems, no fire damage: problem with trolls etc.).

And man, Monk sucks! Has no HP, has no attack speed... Youhave to sneak to Nashkel ASAP to get a minor healing bhaalspawn-ability, because sleeping for 1 HP SUCKS.
Btw, if you manage to defeat an opponent, keep it. You'll desperatly need the exp.

The assassination attempts are a major nuisance too. The one at the Inn has the problem of starting with mirror image, and later throwing magic missiles at you,and at this point you might not be even full of your miniscule HP. So as soon as you activate the fight run away and let the soldiers thin 'im down. To get the exp save, go in, hope the horror does not struck you, and do the finishing blow.

For the Beregost-one I needed clvl 3, starting with a successful stun punch, and manage to land two criticals. But did it, and that's what's important.
Oh yes, until you get to, I dunno, a comfortable level, sleep after each enemy for stun punch!
With clvl 3 could also retrieve M's letter. That was nice.

NOTE: I'm playing on Core diff as always, and set it to easy when leveling up for max HP (sountil clvl 10).

Managed to defeat those half-ogres the guy in Beregost wanned. Depends on luck though for a bit, though if your stun lands, it becomes substantialy easier.
This gave me enough reputation to make Zhurlong gimme his quest.
With some reloads managed to do the Carnival events, and save the talking chicken, and through all this running up-and down reached clvl 5.
With lvl 5 and double stun punch you actualy start to become somewhat of a threat. IF you are not sorrounded. You can beat up Basillus for example. Also, for Silke Idid her task, but as she refused to gimme more reward, Idecided to dash her this time.

At clvl 6 Hulric's Cow got protected.
Post edited January 11, 2020 by twillight
I've looked at this tomic some, and there is one important question that you never answer, and that really should have been answered in the first post:
* What is a poverty run?

In particular, if you are playing with self-imposed restrictions, what are they?
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dtgreene: I've looked at this tomic some, and there is one important question that you never answer, and that really should have been answered in the first post:
* What is a poverty run?

In particular, if you are playing with self-imposed restrictions, what are they?
Oh.Wow. My bad then. I thought the title explains it, but I'm standing here corrected. Sry, and thx for the notice. This below will be insterted in the first post too.

THE SOLO POVERTY RULES

Originaly the challenge is actualy Solo Insane Poverty, the difference being you were supposed to play on Insane Difficulty. I skipped that part not being masochistic, only looking for a challenge. So, here are the RULES OF POVERTY:

- it is a self-imposed restriction rule for the gameplay
- you play solo
- you play as high a difficulty as you dare. My choice of difficulty is Core Difficulty, where the monsters deal the damage as intended. Playing solo the "no permanent death for the party" rule means absolutely nothing (the only other thing the difficulty setting is for).
- I play the games merged. This means I always thave the 8 million exp cap, no artificial barrier anywhere. I still gather exp though normaly doing quests and stuff.
- here is the most important rule: YOU ARE NO ALLOWED TO USE ANY ITEM. You heared that right. No weapon, no armor, no rings of Gaxx, no wands, no potions, no nothing. (I only have the original trilogy, my bet goes, the additional expansions make BG2's beggining even more easy, so for this challenge it works better if you don't have those, I have no idea on mods though, so you'll hear no Ascension or such from me.)
- sub rule: you may use quest items. This means items demanded to finish quests. Only for their intended purposes.
- optional rule: you may use quest items. This means either items to solve quests, but for other means than just use them where they are absolutely demanded, or even quest-rewards. This though can highly endanger the purpose of this challenge (still a fun idea, way smalleritem pool then you got used to). My sorcerer actualy worn the Mask of King Strohm III for a while, which given he wasn't hit often can be considered just a very lucky play (the mask prevents critical hits). He lost his mask though for the dragon of Shuldanesselar though.
- another rule is, that you are not allowed to spend any money aside when quests demand it. So no buying items, no buying reputation, and no buying healing. You sold everything you own, and gave the money to the poor, to earn your reward in the Hall of Fame.

And that's pretty much it. No items (aside for solving quests), and no money (aside for the purpose of solving quests).

Byur current knowledge 3 characters might have a chance getting anywhere this way: the sorcerer, the monk, and the cleric/thief. None is sure any of them can finish the trilogy. It is proven sorcerer (or sorceress) can reach atl east to Abazigail (I'm still to try thatfight, and after that Balthazar, The Ravager,and finaly Amelyssan), and Cleric/Thief to beat Sharevok.
So you have to be either a cleric, or monk, or sorcerer. Pretty much. But then sorcerer is way too op for unmodded games. A cleric may be a better challenge.
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twillight: - here is the most important rule: YOU ARE NO ALLOWED TO USE ANY ITEM. You heared that right. No weapon, no armor, no rings of Gaxx, no wands, no potions, no nothing. (I only have the original trilogy, my bet goes, the additional expansions make BG2's beggining even more easy, so for this challenge it works better if you don't have those, I have no idea on mods though, so you'll hear no Ascension or such from me.)
- sub rule: you may use quest items. This means items demanded to finish quests. Only for their intended purposes.
- optional rule: you may use quest items. This means either items to solve quests, but for other means than just use them where they are absolutely demanded, or even quest-rewards. This though can highly endanger the purpose of this challenge (still a fun idea, way smalleritem pool then you got used to). My sorcerer actualy worn the Mask of King Strohm III for a while, which given he wasn't hit often can be considered just a very lucky play (the mask prevents critical hits). He lost his mask though for the dragon of Shuldanesselar though.
- another rule is, that you are not allowed to spend any money aside when quests demand it. So no buying items, no buying reputation, and no buying healing. You sold everything you own, and gave the money to the poor, to earn your reward in the Hall of Fame.

And that's pretty much it. No items (aside for solving quests), and no money (aside for the purpose of solving quests).
Possible variant: Extend the prohibition to apply to quest items and money spent, unless it's required for a mandatory quest (and there's no alternative path that would avoid this). In other words, if a side quest requires an item or requires spending money, you are not allowed to do that side quest. This would mean that the only permitted side quests are those that don't involve quest items and don't require spending money.

(Of course, in BG2 paying the fee needed to go from Chapter 2 to Chapter 3 would be allowed, as that's a mandatory part of the main quest, unless you're willing to glitch around that requirement (and I think that glitch may require Limited Wish, making it not reasonable to require for this challenge).)

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amazingchestahead: So you have to be either a cleric, or monk, or sorcerer. Pretty much. But then sorcerer is way too op for unmodded games. A cleric may be a better challenge.
Are spells that create weapons, like Flame Blade and the classic version of Enchanted Weapon, allowed?

(The Enchanted Weapon spell was changed in the Enhanced Edition so it now modifies existing weapons instead of creating new ones, so the EE version of the spell would not work for this challenge.)

By the way, it occurs to me that Druid could be a viable option, as they get spells just like Clerics (so no scrolls needed), and their shape change ability can allow them to actually fight (assuming that the natural weapons of such forms don't violate the rules, but I wouldn't expect it to). You could even try Fighter/Druid for the improved THAC0 and number of attacks from the Fighter levels, which IIRC work while shapechanged. (Plus, before shape change, there are spells that create temporary weapons that could be used.)
Post edited January 11, 2020 by dtgreene
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amazingchestahead: So you have to be either a cleric, or monk, or sorcerer. Pretty much. But then sorcerer is way too op for unmodded games. A cleric may be a better challenge.
Cleric is very dependant on equipment, I don't think pure cleric will get you anywhere. Cleric/Thief seems more advantageous, with Trap Of Cheese, and stealth. But be welcomed to try pure cleric.

And no, sorcerer is NOT overpower even in unmodded game. It is likely your bestbet, but you need a very specific spell-set to get far, and possibly get over the original exp-limit ofBG1 to gainsome demanded spell.

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dtgreene: Possible variant: Extend the prohibition to apply to quest items and money spent, unless it's required for a mandatory quest (and there's no alternative path that would avoid this). In other words, if a side quest requires an item or requires spending money, you are not allowed to do that side quest.
The problem is, a poverty-character is in exp-hunger. You definitely want exp ASAP, else you'll be massacred for the lack of HP, thac0, or the lack of ability to hurt people.

Are spells that create weapons, like Flame Blade and the classic version of Enchanted Weapon, allowed?
Sure, because that is an ability of yours, not a permanent physical thing. Yes, the EE version of mentioned spell will not suffice. BUT considering how the original spell worked, and it is a useless wizard spell (with wizard caster you rly don't want to melee at that level), you could, for the duration of the spell (IF you manage to successfully cast it) put an unenchanted weapon to use in EE, giving equaly chance, or something. I rly think this topic is entirely marignal.Take good intentions dealing with it.
Things that should work are things like Melf's Minute Meteors, Energy Discs, Shillelagh, Flame Blade, Spiritual Hammer, Black Blade of Disaster, Sol's Searing Orb (this one sucks).
Basicaly consider any summoned weapon as any summoned creature, trap, etc.

PS: at clvl 6 got through the Nashkel Mines, so now have 2 small healing spell. For the next two abilities, ahve to mention, both suck for monk. The cure poison will soon be redundant as onlvl 11 you gain immunity to it, but ghoul touch is like a nerfed stun punch - does the same, but takes away your damage, and has higher casting time. And if you'd have those, you'd have to grind back your reputation toget DUHM,which is obviously superior to Vampire Touch.

The Mountain Bear (where you can get the snow boots) ment unexpected headache,what I managed to overcome at clvl 7. Things start to look good, but being mobbed is still a pain.

Against casters yourmain strategy is peek-a-boo,aka. make them run out of spells.
Your biggest weapon though is your speed. Do hit&run. Many enemies can't even hit you, youcansimply run out of reach before they could strike. And for like the bandit camp main tent, you can lure the enemy to the fieldof your choice, where you can run into the fog-of-war and rest, dividing them, hunting them down one-by-one, luring themby showing yourself.

PPS: the reason why not many classes cantake the Poverty Challenge at all is, without a weapon you can't kill things. Literly, they just faint, and never disappear from the game, stand up again and again attacking you. And you can't trap everything.
So thieves are out of question, because their only method to finish are traps. And good luck with that.
Bards only gain spells from lvl 2. Warriors don't gain spells at all.
This leaves us with casters - and the monk. I just realised something considering the monk. Remember the room, right after you turn into the slayer in Bodhi's Maze, at Spellhold? The room, where you are taken to be tested by the supervisors? The room with 6 golbins, some standing on pillars? Now that's the reasopn why monkcann ot finish this challenge!
Thus I abandon my mmonk, unless someone points out how I could do ranged damage with it without equipment.
Post edited January 12, 2020 by twillight
Well, even if I'll have to "cheat", I'll keep the monk. Still too bad.

I'm gradualy working up through the areas, currently unvisited are:
- N of FAI, Cloakwood 2+, Ulcaster, Gullykin, Firewine Bridge, NE of Nashkel Mines.

In Ulaster met the problem that Icharyd is immun to normal weapons. Bugger.
Aec'Letec is also immun to normal weapons, not that I'd ever tryto mess with its gaze anyway.
I'm pretty sure too, monk fist doesn't count as silver weapon, so there goes Werewolf Island (you still can deliver the chart).
Mustard Jellies are out of reach too, because of immunity to normal weapons. Can't wait for clvl 9. Aside the fact, that officialy you're not supposed to reach that level, the exp-maximum for monk, even with TotSC (or just EE) is lvl 8.
Flesh Golems are also normal weapon immun (NWI from now).
Oh, ye, there are Vampiric Wolves too. Of course just like the Revenant. And the Doomsayer.

Also, monk's AC is not good, so avoid ghouls and ghasts whenever possible. See no chance toraid that tomb with 3 ghasts in it for example.

Nowthis is weird. That enemies never sleep (and likely don't suffer fatigue) isa good thing, I want to rise another thing. Skipped CWF#2 by sneaking, so thought, I never attacked the shadow druiids in #3, why not. Well, the reason is, they cost reputation for some reason. Bugger.
Post edited January 12, 2020 by twillight
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dtgreene: Possible variant: Extend the prohibition to apply to quest items and money spent, unless it's required for a mandatory quest (and there's no alternative path that would avoid this). In other words, if a side quest requires an item or requires spending money, you are not allowed to do that side quest.
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twillight: The problem is, a poverty-character is in exp-hunger. You definitely want exp ASAP, else you'll be massacred for the lack of HP, thac0, or the lack of ability to hurt people.
Well, I guess you would just need to find other ways to get experience, like killing enemies or figuring out which quests you *can* do without breaking the rule.
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twillight: The problem is, a poverty-character is in exp-hunger. You definitely want exp ASAP, else you'll be massacred for the lack of HP, thac0, or the lack of ability to hurt people.
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dtgreene: Well, I guess you would just need to find other ways to get experience, like killing enemies or figuring out which quests you *can* do without breaking the rule.
I don't think you catch up to the situation.
With the serious downgrade of solo poverty, there isn't much choice of doing quests. At least not until oyu are Bloody High Level. And believe me, you won't be that in BG1. BG2 has a lot more leaway, but there you get certain timed quests just to spice tings up, heh (assuming you don't want to just abandone those).
And hunting random monsters? You can't be serious with this. When a random enemy gives lett's say 100-200 exp, and the next level is 10-100K expaway, that's onlya theoretical option. You need the quests, and with no items, you barely have enough to reach the nextlevel before the run out.

Let's take my current situation.
I'm lvl 7, closing lvl 8. I'll need to double my exp to reach lvl 9. Reaching clvl 9 is still technicaly fine, as I don't have Siege of Dragonspear, and that'd give that the exp-cap, so I'm very generous with this one. On that level though I should be able to face Sharevok. And I'm not sure monk can.
But let's getback to the present.
I can't do the Ooze-mage quest (NE ofNashkel mines) because of lack of magic weapon. Taking the basilisk-area is a major risk, and I have no idea if I could effectively help the ghoul. Can't defeat Icharyd (Ulcaster) for lack of magic weapon. No idea about the ankhegs, but they are no suprise, the original power-barrier. Can't face the Doomsayer for lack of magic weapon, and because it's bloody strong. Can't win against the Best Swordsman, and can't even hit the Carsa Jahr ogre mage. So my only option is, facing the Cloakwood Forest 2, where everything will want to poison me, andmy crappy AC. And what'll happen when I get down its mine? The battle horrors sound major problem. If I get stuck there, whatcan I do?
Ok, I justrealised I have stealth, so I could, at least in theory, start Durlag's Tower (super strong enemies, and what's not is ghast/ghoul,aka. Bloody Annoying),
Giving this a shot, I think a clear winner here is Shifter druid. Unlike other druids, you can wildshape from level 1 and basically never shift out except to cast spells. So far I've made it to Nashkell on my own without resting, reaching level 4 without much difficulty. I doubt this would be a great build to solo through BGII and ToB but it's crazy strong out of the gate in BG TuTu.

I think even a vanilla druid could manage with melee spells and barkskin although it would be a lot rougher. I'd still take druid or cleric over monk any day, I don't know how anyone has the patience for that class.

P.S. I think using the ability enhancement tomes should be a clear violation of the vow since those are some of the most powerful items you can find in the game.
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dtgreene: Well, I guess you would just need to find other ways to get experience, like killing enemies or figuring out which quests you *can* do without breaking the rule.
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twillight: I don't think you catch up to the situation.
With the serious downgrade of solo poverty, there isn't much choice of doing quests. At least not until oyu are Bloody High Level. And believe me, you won't be that in BG1. BG2 has a lot more leaway, but there you get certain timed quests just to spice tings up, heh (assuming you don't want to just abandone those).
And hunting random monsters? You can't be serious with this. When a random enemy gives lett's say 100-200 exp, and the next level is 10-100K expaway, that's onlya theoretical option. You need the quests, and with no items, you barely have enough to reach the nextlevel before the run out.

Let's take my current situation.
I'm lvl 7, closing lvl 8. I'll need to double my exp to reach lvl 9. Reaching clvl 9 is still technicaly fine, as I don't have Siege of Dragonspear, and that'd give that the exp-cap, so I'm very generous with this one. On that level though I should be able to face Sharevok. And I'm not sure monk can.
There are people who would actually take the time to accomplish such feats.

There was one person who took the time to reach max level in the first dungeon of Final Fantasy 7. Apparently, it took roughly 500 hours to do that, but somebody actually felt like doing that tedious task.
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twillight: I don't think you catch up to the situation.
With the serious downgrade of solo poverty, there isn't much choice of doing quests. At least not until oyu are Bloody High Level. And believe me, you won't be that in BG1. BG2 has a lot more leaway, but there you get certain timed quests just to spice tings up, heh (assuming you don't want to just abandone those).
And hunting random monsters? You can't be serious with this. When a random enemy gives lett's say 100-200 exp, and the next level is 10-100K expaway, that's onlya theoretical option. You need the quests, and with no items, you barely have enough to reach the nextlevel before the run out.

Let's take my current situation.
I'm lvl 7, closing lvl 8. I'll need to double my exp to reach lvl 9. Reaching clvl 9 is still technicaly fine, as I don't have Siege of Dragonspear, and that'd give that the exp-cap, so I'm very generous with this one. On that level though I should be able to face Sharevok. And I'm not sure monk can.
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dtgreene: There are people who would actually take the time to accomplish such feats.

There was one person who took the time to reach max level in the first dungeon of Final Fantasy 7. Apparently, it took roughly 500 hours to do that, but somebody actually felt like doing that tedious task.
If you want to do that, just simulate the effect adding yourself exp through the cheat-bar. But where's the fun in that?