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"China" returned 29 posts
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Timboli: There is no other store like GOG, that offers its benefits, flawed as it may often be at times, nothing else beats it.
And what would those benefits be exactly? "FCKDRM" and offline installers as a token gesture but from now on you either use the launcher with their own flagship game or don't get all the content that is already in it? 30-day refunds that sound great on paper as long as you don't actually try to apply for one yourself (as thousands of testimonies all around the Internet now attest to)? Or is it their "utmost care for customers," as manifested by the lack of even any pretense of customer service because they wanted to do it on the cheap instead of hiring enough staff in preparation for the launch of their most anticipated game?

In a way you're right, there is no other store as duplicitous, pretending to be everything they're not.

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Timboli: Perhaps even losing some of you is a minor loss compared to the gains ...
Just where would those gains be coming from?

People abandoning Steam, where they already bought most of their games, so that they can try a different flavor of DRM with an inferior launcher, now semi-mandatory, and paying extra for it (never mind the higher prices on GOG)? So that they can enjoy slower downloads in certain regions of the world GOG is supposedly focusing on (e.g. China), and often missing features (see the long list of games that treat GOG customers as second-class)? Enduring all this so that up to "100% of their money" can go to a company now infamous for manipulating reviews, lying about the state of their game, and letting external actors "curate" their platform and delist "hand-picked" games while their customers have to do without even an explanation? Absolutely, people must be flocking in by the droves as we speak to be part of this experience.
Post edited December 27, 2020 by Turbo-Beaver
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wpegg: Final thought: I've seen this behaviour before in several companies. It's generally what you see when a company is not aiming for long term "trust", the short termist sales focus is usually when a company is trying to fatten up the books in preparation for a sale. It would stand to reason that the founders of CDP would quite like a retirement package, and that CP77 was the final release to really make them more than just "The Witcher Games Company".
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elgonzo: It could be. The addition of the Epic Games Store to Galaxy not that long ago made me think then what the future of GOG will be and whether that could be a sign a of a possible upcoming reorg of the CD Projekt group. As a side note, 40% of EGS is owned by Tencent, and it wouldn't be entirely frivolous to imagine some relationship between this and the complete withdrawal/cancellation of Devotion on GOG...
According to this post: https://www.gog.com/forum/general/devotion_is_coming_to_gog_on_dec_18th/post908 Epic does (unlike "we are rebels" CDPSA) not bow down to CCP. Reason being Tim Sweeney has control over Epic and not Tencent.
Note A: The link doesnt work - you have to manually go to post #908. (Presumably this is due to forum censorship = moderators deleting posts in the thread which makes the linking buggy.)
Note B: I dont know if the linked post is true. Although I did a little research and found no contradiction.
Note C: Given the current state of GOG I find the hating on Epic inappropriate - assuming the linked post is properly true.

Due to the linking problem I am quoting the full post too:

#908

#907
Thing is, they're completely correct. This is a stunning display on CDPR/GOG between the two debacles. I used to be greatly hopeful that they'd be a force for good, but it is on full display that the suits don't give a damn about principles or making games that work. There needs to be a serious and swift course correction if CDPR/GOG hopes to regain trust with customers. At least Epic is openly in bed with the CCP, GOG just insults longtime customers with poorly crafted lies.
There have been so many missteps and never really any personal consequences. There cannot possibly be any change if the same people are still in charge incapable or unwilling to change or to fulfill the countless promises to do different. Find the people in leading positions that are not compatible with your moral/ethic code and just offer them a different position, that suits them better. I mean It's simple parenting 101, if there are no consequences to ones actions, no lessons will ever be learned.

As far as Epic is concerned, what makes you say that they are in league with the CCP? Because Tencent is owning 40% of their stock? During the Blizzard Hong Kong protest controversy Tim Sweeney stated "Epic supports the rights of Fortnite players and creators to speak about politics and human rights." which clearly opposes the CCP. Also Fortnite was banned in China in 2018, because of "Blood and gore, vulgar content", unlike Blizzard Epic refused to make changes to their game to cater to the Chinese market .When his stance concerning free speech was challenged because of the large share Tencent holds, Tim Sweeney essentially stated that nothing would happen to undermine that as long as he was in charge "Yes, absolutely. That will never happen on my watch as the founder, CEO, and controlling shareholder."
So far he has stayed true to his word.
--


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Orkhepaj: ah sad to see another one go , btw where will you get your games?
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Chielus86: At the moment, I simply won't as there is no options left. Gaming has been my hobby since the early 90's, but the landscape has changed. I do have a very very large collection (physical) of games, many of which I have barely played or not at all. You know, buying a bulk of games 2nd hand and such.

So I will spend some time, probably up to years, digesting that collection and enjoying many gems from the past. But as far as buying new things, I simply can't at this moment. Steam is worse, EpicGames is... Let's not dive into that burning dumpster and barely any (if at all) developer sells their games separate of a major storefront.
There is this thread if you dont know it:
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/list_of_drmfree_video_games_digital_distributors/page1]https://www.gog.com/forum/general/list_of_drmfree_video_games_digital_distributors/page1[/url]
Post edited December 27, 2020 by Zrevnur
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elgonzo: Third, why would one's opinion about Epic depend on one's opinion of GOG? I don't get it. If my opinion of GOG is not good, am i obligated to have a good opinion about Epic? Huh? Maybe i am missing context to understand your note C correctly...
The context is exactly what you wrote in your own post (but not limited to your post - similar sentiments were expressed elsewhere too): "... The addition of the Epic Games Store to Galaxy not that long ago made me think then what the future of GOG will be..."
You use GOG adding Epic as an argument against GOG. But this only makes proper sense to me if you believe Epic to be worse than GOG.

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elgonzo: Second, with regard to Sweeney having control over Epic (and going a bit off-topic): There is no situation in reality where a majority shareholder of 50-something percent could easily ignore and overrule the wishes of a 40-something percent shareholder and vice versa without being hostile to the other shareholder, quite possibly unfolding as a public drama. With a 40-something percent shareholder on his side, Sweeney is not free of strong influence and constraints in regard to exercising control of the company. The same is true also the other way around, too. Don't get me wrong, I am sure Sweeney has no problems playing hard-ball with Tencent, his stock majority gives him the power to do so. However, being able to control and steer the company requires that both Sweeney and Tencent find common ground and agreement over how to control and steer the company. (I assume this mostly expresses itself as choosing figures for the board of directors with views and visions that are acceptable to both Sweeney and Tencent.)
As you write yourself - this goes both ways. And if its one vs the other ("bow to China" or "dont bow to China") then the 50+% wins over the 40%. The 40% would have to successfully sue for proper reasons (like not making money or breaking laws) to get their way. (Also Tencent usually doesnt mess openly with the companies they invest in anyway. This is not how the CCP plays their cards - it would obviously be stupid for them to do that.)
Post edited December 27, 2020 by Zrevnur
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elgonzo: Third, why would one's opinion about Epic depend on one's opinion of GOG? I don't get it. If my opinion of GOG is not good, am i obligated to have a good opinion about Epic? Huh? Maybe i am missing context to understand your note C correctly...
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Zrevnur: The context is exactly what you wrote in your own post (but not limited to your post - similar sentiments were expressed elsewhere too): "... The addition of the Epic Games Store to Galaxy not that long ago made me think then what the future of GOG will be..."
You use GOG adding Epic as an argument against GOG. But this only makes proper sense to me if you believe Epic to be worse than GOG.
Okay. But how is me diskliking EGS now suddenly inapproriate just because GOG is "shitting on the carpet"? That's not making any sense. I disliked EGS and the EGS integration in GOG long before the current GOG affairs. (Note that i said "it made me think then...", referring to the time when EGS was being integrated in Galaxy, and more specifically referring to a comment i made at that time: https://www.gog.com/forum/general_beta_gog_galaxy_2.0/new_store_inside_gog_galaxy_launches_in_test_phase/post62 ). You seem to believe that i just started to dislike EGS (and Galaxy's EGS integration) because of current GOG events, which is incorrect.

As you write yourself - this goes both ways. And if its one vs the other ("bow to China" or "dont bow to China") then the 50+% wins over the 40%. The 40% would have to successfully sue for proper reasons (like not making money or breaking laws) to get their way. (Also Tencent usually doesnt mess openly with the companies they invest in anyway. This is not how the CCP plays their cards - it would obviously be stupid for them to do that.)
Yes, it goes both ways. I absolutely agree. Yet, you still seem to like sticking to the "it only goes one way, Sweeneys way" theory, while then at the end kinda changing position back to a "it goes both ways" by introducing a secret mysterious squirrel-way of Tencent being able to get their way. Hmm...

And ofcourse any arguments or disputes between Sweeney and Tencent are normally not done in the open (public). This has nothing to do with how the CCP likes to do things at all. Regardless of the company and regardless of the actual shareholders, arguments, disputes, negotions about the direction of a company and/or the personnel of the BoD between large shareholders (and other investors and stakeholders) are usually not public but rather behind closed doors, unless they turn hostile and one party drags the dispute into the open.
Post edited December 27, 2020 by elgonzo
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Turbo-Beaver: And what would those benefits be exactly? "FCKDRM" and offline installers as a token gesture but from now on you either use the launcher with their own flagship game or don't get all the content that is already in it? 30-day refunds that sound great on paper as long as you don't actually try to apply for one yourself (as thousands of testimonies all around the Internet now attest to)? Or is it their "utmost care for customers," as manifested by the lack of even any pretense of customer service because they wanted to do it on the cheap instead of hiring enough staff in preparation for the launch of their most anticipated game?

In a way you're right, there is no other store as duplicitous, pretending to be everything they're not.

Just where would those gains be coming from?

People abandoning Steam, where they already bought most of their games, so that they can try a different flavor of DRM with an inferior launcher, now semi-mandatory, and paying extra for it (never mind the higher prices on GOG)? So that they can enjoy slower downloads in certain regions of the world GOG is supposedly focusing on (e.g. China), and often missing features (see the long list of games that treat GOG customers as second-class)? Enduring all this so that up to "100% of their money" can go to a company now infamous for manipulating reviews, lying about the state of their game, and letting external actors "curate" their platform and delist "hand-picked" games while their customers have to do without even an explanation? Absolutely, people must be flocking in by the droves as we speak to be part of this experience.
Honestly I don't know why you are still here if you hate the place so much.

Clearly your sense of the overall logic is being impacted by your emotions which have created blinkers.

My advice, is to take a deep breath, stand back to see the full picture, and then look again, but objectively this time. :)

BOL
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Turbo-Beaver: And what would those benefits be exactly? "FCKDRM" and offline installers as a token gesture but from now on you either use the launcher with their own flagship game or don't get all the content that is already in it? 30-day refunds that sound great on paper as long as you don't actually try to apply for one yourself (as thousands of testimonies all around the Internet now attest to)? Or is it their "utmost care for customers," as manifested by the lack of even any pretense of customer service because they wanted to do it on the cheap instead of hiring enough staff in preparation for the launch of their most anticipated game?

In a way you're right, there is no other store as duplicitous, pretending to be everything they're not.

Just where would those gains be coming from?

People abandoning Steam, where they already bought most of their games, so that they can try a different flavor of DRM with an inferior launcher, now semi-mandatory, and paying extra for it (never mind the higher prices on GOG)? So that they can enjoy slower downloads in certain regions of the world GOG is supposedly focusing on (e.g. China), and often missing features (see the long list of games that treat GOG customers as second-class)? Enduring all this so that up to "100% of their money" can go to a company now infamous for manipulating reviews, lying about the state of their game, and letting external actors "curate" their platform and delist "hand-picked" games while their customers have to do without even an explanation? Absolutely, people must be flocking in by the droves as we speak to be part of this experience.
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Timboli: Honestly I don't know why you are still here if you hate the place so much.

Clearly your sense of the overall logic is being impacted by your emotions which have created blinkers.

My advice, is to take a deep breath, stand back to see the full picture, and then look again, but objectively this time.
Is this really the best you can do?
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Timboli: There is no other store like GOG, that offers its benefits, flawed as it may often be at times, nothing else beats it.
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Timboli: Perhaps even losing some of you is a minor loss compared to the gains ...
You made some pretty bold claims, and failed to substantiate them at all. I pointed out a lot of evidence to the contrary. Now, instead of discussing what I wrote on its merits, you are just telling me to go away because you disagree?

Everything you wrote to me is devoid of any relevance to the actual topic of the discussion. This only demonstrates that while you don't like what I wrote, you also couldn't find anything factually or logically incorrect in my argument.

If I'm really missing "the full picture" as you are alleging, why don't you help me with my "clearly impacted sense of overall logic" and show me the light through my "blinkers?" But "objectively this time."
Post edited December 28, 2020 by Turbo-Beaver
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Zrevnur: The context is exactly what you wrote in your own post (but not limited to your post - similar sentiments were expressed elsewhere too): "... The addition of the Epic Games Store to Galaxy not that long ago made me think then what the future of GOG will be..."
You use GOG adding Epic as an argument against GOG. But this only makes proper sense to me if you believe Epic to be worse than GOG.
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elgonzo: Okay. But how is me diskliking EGS now suddenly inapproriate just because GOG is "shitting on the carpet"?
I dont think disliking EGS is inappropriate. What I meant with "hating" is the "bad/worse guy there"-fingerpointing from a GOG perspective.
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elgonzo: I disliked EGS and the EGS integration in GOG long before the current GOG affairs. (Note that i said "it made me think then...", referring to the time when EGS was being integrated in Galaxy, and more specifically referring to a comment i made at that time: https://www.gog.com/forum/general_beta_gog_galaxy_2.0/new_store_inside_gog_galaxy_launches_in_test_phase/post62 ).
If thats what you meant then this doesnt even imply "dislike Epic" - its just about GOG.
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elgonzo: You seem to believe that i just started to dislike EGS (and Galaxy's EGS integration) because of current GOG events, which is incorrect.
I dont know when you started to dislike EGS...


As you write yourself - this goes both ways. And if its one vs the other ("bow to China" or "dont bow to China") then the 50+% wins over the 40%. The 40% would have to successfully sue for proper reasons (like not making money or breaking laws) to get their way. (Also Tencent usually doesnt mess openly with the companies they invest in anyway. This is not how the CCP plays their cards - it would obviously be stupid for them to do that.)
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elgonzo: Yes, it goes both ways. I absolutely agree. Yet, you still seem to like sticking to the "it only goes one way, Sweeneys way" theory, while then at the end kinda changing position back to a "it goes both ways" by introducing a secret mysterious squirrel-way of Tencent being able to get their way. Hmm...

And ofcourse any arguments or disputes between Sweeney and Tencent are normally not done in the open (public). This has nothing to do with how the CCP likes to do things at all. Regardless of the company and regardless of the actual shareholders, arguments, disputes, negotions about the direction of a company and/or the personnel of the BoD between large shareholders (and other investors and stakeholders) are usually not public but rather behind closed doors, unless they turn hostile and one party drags the dispute into the open.
But we have the public statement by Tim Sweeney. Otherwise not sure what you were trying to say.
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Shiznown: This, also state the real reason why Cyberpunk is being more censored with each patch. Put back the nudity in Cyberpunk, Apologize for the whole situation, release mod tools and donate to a charity; donate preferably to a Hong Kong charity, even if it's a neutral charity like a historical monument charity. Oh, and add Devotion to the damn store.
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toupz111: Lol nice troll, why would someone donate to hong kong? China is the shittest place
You're lucky you're just some asswipe on the internet
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Shiznown: donate preferably to a Hong Kong charity, even if it's a neutral charity like a historical monument charity. Oh, and add Devotion to the damn store.
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RafaelRamus: Don't you mean Taiwan instead of Hong Kong?
Either or, but preferably both.
Post edited December 28, 2020 by Shiznown
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toupz111: Lol nice troll, why would someone donate to hong kong? China is the shittest place
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Shiznown: You're lucky you're just some asswipe on the internet
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RafaelRamus: Don't you mean Taiwan instead of Hong Kong?
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Shiznown: Either or, but preferably both.
donate hungary pls
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elgonzo: It could be. The addition of the Epic Games Store to Galaxy not that long ago made me think then what the future of GOG will be and whether that could be a sign a of a possible upcoming reorg of the CD Projekt group. As a side note, 40% of EGS is owned by Tencent, and it wouldn't be entirely frivolous to imagine some relationship between this and the complete withdrawal/cancellation of Devotion on GOG...
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Zrevnur: According to this post: https://www.gog.com/forum/general/devotion_is_coming_to_gog_on_dec_18th/post908 Epic does (unlike "we are rebels" CDPSA) not bow down to CCP. Reason being Tim Sweeney has control over Epic and not Tencent.
Note A: The link doesnt work - you have to manually go to post #908. (Presumably this is due to forum censorship = moderators deleting posts in the thread which makes the linking buggy.)
Note B: I dont know if the linked post is true. Although I did a little research and found no contradiction.
Note C: Given the current state of GOG I find the hating on Epic inappropriate - assuming the linked post is properly true.

Due to the linking problem I am quoting the full post too:

#908

There have been so many missteps and never really any personal consequences. There cannot possibly be any change if the same people are still in charge incapable or unwilling to change or to fulfill the countless promises to do different. Find the people in leading positions that are not compatible with your moral/ethic code and just offer them a different position, that suits them better. I mean It's simple parenting 101, if there are no consequences to ones actions, no lessons will ever be learned.

As far as Epic is concerned, what makes you say that they are in league with the CCP? Because Tencent is owning 40% of their stock? During the Blizzard Hong Kong protest controversy Tim Sweeney stated "Epic supports the rights of Fortnite players and creators to speak about politics and human rights." which clearly opposes the CCP. Also Fortnite was banned in China in 2018, because of "Blood and gore, vulgar content", unlike Blizzard Epic refused to make changes to their game to cater to the Chinese market .When his stance concerning free speech was challenged because of the large share Tencent holds, Tim Sweeney essentially stated that nothing would happen to undermine that as long as he was in charge "Yes, absolutely. That will never happen on my watch as the founder, CEO, and controlling shareholder."
So far he has stayed true to his word.
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Zrevnur: --

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Chielus86: At the moment, I simply won't as there is no options left. Gaming has been my hobby since the early 90's, but the landscape has changed. I do have a very very large collection (physical) of games, many of which I have barely played or not at all. You know, buying a bulk of games 2nd hand and such.

So I will spend some time, probably up to years, digesting that collection and enjoying many gems from the past. But as far as buying new things, I simply can't at this moment. Steam is worse, EpicGames is... Let's not dive into that burning dumpster and barely any (if at all) developer sells their games separate of a major storefront.
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Zrevnur: There is this thread if you dont know it:
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/list_of_drmfree_video_games_digital_distributors/page1]https://www.gog.com/forum/general/list_of_drmfree_video_games_digital_distributors/page1[/url]
Thank you for sharing this. Hopefully the Epic store will get better features. I still wish Unreal Tournament would be completed.
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XVX777: Hah, that's not really what I said. I buy games after they've come out, when they've gotten cheaper, and received updates, because I'm aware of other people's odd habit of wanting to buy shit at 'launch', as if that makes a difference. As a consequence of that, game devs rush out their games to meet arbitrary dates, and then whine in forums when they're unfinished or rushed. It's a circle jerk, and I'm not participating.

Secondly, Devotion IS NOT important in the grand scheme of things. It's laughable to see neckbeards rage out and go all black panther about something so insignificant. You can wake me up when companies bowing to the Chinese has actual consequences that I would care about. If you haven't forgotten about this important issue by then, that is.
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Shiznown: First of all, people having principles is a good thing. It doesn't make them "neck beards". I personally know people in Asia, am engaged to a woman from Asia and grew up with a love for Hong Kong culture. You may not care, because you're a piece of shit that doesn't care about human rights, but know thankfully there are people that aren't like you. I notice you're in Germany. Imagine someone saying the same sort of thing about a company that bowed to the Nazis. I guess if you were around during that time you still wouldn't care. Get lost, prick.
I didnt say china is bad but their government is satan
Post edited December 29, 2020 by toupz111
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XVX777: Hah, that's not really what I said. I buy games after they've come out, when they've gotten cheaper, and received updates, because I'm aware of other people's odd habit of wanting to buy shit at 'launch', as if that makes a difference. As a consequence of that, game devs rush out their games to meet arbitrary dates, and then whine in forums when they're unfinished or rushed. It's a circle jerk, and I'm not participating.

Secondly, Devotion IS NOT important in the grand scheme of things. It's laughable to see neckbeards rage out and go all black panther about something so insignificant. You can wake me up when companies bowing to the Chinese has actual consequences that I would care about. If you haven't forgotten about this important issue by then, that is.
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Shiznown: First of all, people having principles is a good thing. It doesn't make them "neck beards". I personally know people in Asia, am engaged to a woman from Asia and grew up with a love for Hong Kong culture. You may not care, because you're a piece of shit that doesn't care about human rights, but know thankfully there are people that aren't like you. I notice you're in Germany. Imagine someone saying the same sort of thing about a company that bowed to the Nazis. I guess if you were around during that time you still wouldn't care. Get lost, prick.
Wow, that's certainly a terrible human rights violation, having some third rate, dime-a-dozen, first person ripoff horror game removed from a store. Like I said, it's hilarious how many people take this that seriously, including you. Plus, I'd really like to know if there is some evidence that actually proves that the EVIL GOVERNMENT of China was responsible for this ban, and not GOG as a company responding to complaints from pro-government Chinese customers, as was the case with Steam. Because so far all I've heard is bullshit from neckbeards and really hardcore rebels that put Winnie the Pooh in their avatar or something.

Have I also mentioned that I think it's comical to expect high morals from companies? ANY company will do shady stuff if they can get away with it, some just do it more openly, that's all. Don't know what fantasy world you're living in if you think otherwise.

Plus, you can't really tell me to get lost, considering we're not physically interacting, just by the way.
Post edited December 30, 2020 by XVX777
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Shiznown: First of all, people having principles is a good thing. It doesn't make them "neck beards". I personally know people in Asia, am engaged to a woman from Asia and grew up with a love for Hong Kong culture. You may not care, because you're a piece of shit that doesn't care about human rights, but know thankfully there are people that aren't like you. I notice you're in Germany. Imagine someone saying the same sort of thing about a company that bowed to the Nazis. I guess if you were around during that time you still wouldn't care. Get lost, prick.
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XVX777: Wow, that's certainly a terrible human rights violation, having some third rate, dime-a-dozen, first person ripoff horror game removed from a store. Like I said, it's hilarious how many people take this that seriously, including you. Plus, I'd really like to know if there is some evidence that actually proves that the EVIL GOVERNMENT of China was responsible for this ban, and not GOG as a company responding to complaints from pro-government Chinese customers, as was the case with Steam. Because so far all I've heard is bullshit from neckbeards and really hardcore rebels that put Winnie the Pooh in their avatar or something.

Have I also mentioned that I think it's comical to expect high morals from companies? ANY company will do shady stuff if they can get away with it, some just do it more openly, that's all. Don't know what fantasy world you're living in if you think otherwise.

Plus, you can't really tell me to get lost, considering we're not physically interacting, just by the way.
How many books burnt by your grandfather were Shakespearean masterpieces?
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XVX777: Wow, that's certainly a terrible human rights violation, having some third rate, dime-a-dozen, first person ripoff horror game removed from a store. Like I said, it's hilarious how many people take this that seriously, including you. Plus, I'd really like to know if there is some evidence that actually proves that the EVIL GOVERNMENT of China was responsible for this ban, and not GOG as a company responding to complaints from pro-government Chinese customers, as was the case with Steam. Because so far all I've heard is bullshit from neckbeards and really hardcore rebels that put Winnie the Pooh in their avatar or something.

Have I also mentioned that I think it's comical to expect high morals from companies? ANY company will do shady stuff if they can get away with it, some just do it more openly, that's all. Don't know what fantasy world you're living in if you think otherwise.

Plus, you can't really tell me to get lost, considering we're not physically interacting, just by the way.
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shattenyagger: How many books burnt by your grandfather were Shakespearean masterpieces?
My grandfather didn't burn books. That's very funny, though, you assuming that every German in WW2 times was a book burning Nazi. Not at all prejudiced to think like that. Great argument.