Thanks, that clears things up a bit for me. You didn't make a softclaim, you chose not to claim. I must have misread that in your posts.

Ba. Dum. Ts.

You mean... "The Post"? Not you, too!

It's true, I might have in this setup, if I was scum. But I'm not and I didn't.

Me and Pooka on a scum team together? Come on.

Me and Lift would be a whole lot more likely. But no.

That turned out to be correct although I have to admit I was afraid by the end of the day Yesterday that he is leading me by the nose.

Because they were min/max-ing and wanted to get someone who would also might be a problem in general? Keeping players around for extended suspicion and confusion also brings the side effect of them still being around and keeping to do their own stuff.


You didn't want him to claim yesterday but you do now?

Process of elimination. He's the one I feel is most likely scum at present. I want a vote somewhere, if only to provide a record for the future.

It's not a good reason, but it's the best I have right now.

I'd agree with you, but that way lies WIFOM.

Apart from the game, I do agree with this quite strongly.

Both. Either. It was very sudden and you hadn't looked at (read, talked about) GR before you voted him. It reads like scum trying to find any lynch as deadline looms, then suddenly GR's wagon is given wings and you hop on it.

Oh, I'm every bit as lurky as people make out. It just doesn't mean I'm scum. I perma-lurk.

Because I didn't have time. It was a rushed post.

The Towny things that you've said outweigh the Scummy things you've said. The scale could be tipped pretty easily, though.

Why wouldn't Scum NK you when you've indicated that you have a PR, as opposed to "blindly" firing at ZFR?

I think our Scum are experienced. I'd expect less-experienced scum to hit you based on your softclaim. But since you survived the night, I bet scum are hoping to get you lynched today.

-----

That's my post for the moment. I may be able to make another in about 6 hours, but no promises.

That's exactly what it was. Deadline was getting close, I went away for the evening with pooka closest to lynch, but lifthrasil still a strong contender, and returned past my bedtime to discover that some jerk had re-instigated GameRager's wagon and with deadline imminent and sleep overpowering me the only wagon was gamerager.

Would you have preferred me to stay off? Likely the day would have ended in no-lunch. Would it have been worth it?

It occured to me on my way home just now that zfr was probably really excited to draw the cop role. So whoever targetted him the second Night One in a row you can take that on your conscience as well. For Shame!

ZFR - I've decided I'm going to stop blaming you for this horrible mess you left us in and start avenging you!

except for the 'scum' part. That's not me softclaiming ;p

I like the direction this Day is going over yesterday. A lot more focus and real or seemingly real analysis. I'll need to go back and look more deeply into this talk of various PR soft claims. Not something I noticed at the time except for the GameRager talk about it, but also not something I look for either.

There are a couple things that pique my interest, but I want to re-read them and look into the greater context before expounding on them. We've had our day 1 brigades based on thin reasoning. Day 2 should be much better and I want to do my part. Unfortunately, I've got a few things to do this afternoon first. Hopefully I'll have something more useful to say tonight.

Might that only be because I'm not voting for you now? Shall we test it?

vote Lifthrasil

Alright I don't know what this is gonna prove.

unvote lifthrasil

If this is some kind of evil master plan to trick us into believing you're town, it's working.

There's a big difference between hours away from the end of D1 and the beginning of the next day. Evaluating any PR on D1 is fairly useless, since it burns time away and an investigative role has no information to provide. It's now D2 though, which means an investigator would have a result, although any other PR type wouldn't have any reason to out themselves. I also wanted to see if anyone thought Pooka used a softclaim to avoid a lynch, which, since he wasn't actually softclaiming, couldn't have been the case.

That's fine but if he had a good result to share he would have, no? But you were wondering whether or not we should make him claim. Speaking of which, how exactly would we do that if we wanted?

I do. For me, personally, nothing has changed in that regard since Yesterday so I don't have a reason to switch my stance. I'm still suspicious of him but seeing how pretty much everyone else sees him as various shades of Town I realize I may be tunneling and forcing myself to see something that's not necessarily there. So I'm not pushing it but no matter how much I try I can't shake the bad feeling I've had about him on D1.


Do you?

Is it? I must remember that tactic for when I'm scum. :-)

But the rest of you post is less funny. Why would you want to out a PR without need? If they found something that's necessary to share, they would do so. Or if Pooka is Vanilla, why would you want to force him to reveal that? (if he's Town). Why do you want to narrow down the field of valuable targets for scum?

I had the impression that agent's unmotivated vote on RFG looked a bit scummy and his weak explanation when asked doesn't really help either. But then RFG goes along and suggests forcing an unnecessary claim. Which is quite scummy too. So perhaps agent was on to something, weak as his reasoning was (even by his own admission).

Or perhaps agent knows that he's on to something, because they are both scum and this was a soft distancing? I notice that RFG didn't react at all to agent's vote. Which looks strange too.

@RFG: why is the fact, that someone votes you and has you apparently as their top scum pick not worth reacting to? Do you, perhaps, know that agent poses no actual danger to you?


Interesting. I read his refusal to claim differently. But that's how perception differs, I guess. It wasn't that, which made me reconsider him. It was his willingness to be the lynch for the day. Of course, that may have been acted, but at the time it felt genuine.

Not only is it not a good reason, it also contradicts other statements by you. Going back I just noticed something beyond the fact that you have the lowest number of posts of all players (and only few of them game-relevant):
You kind of contradicted yourself! You ended D1 with a vote on Pooka, stating that you would prefer his lynch. So clearly he was your top scum pick at the end of D1. Then you started this Day by saying that Pooka's first post of the Day feels very wrong. Which suggests that you still see him as scummy, maybe even more so than on D1. 'Very wrong' is a strong statement.

But still you list Pooka as leaning Town. When only one 'very wrong' feeling post is in between your rating him as your top Scum pick. So, what exactly in that 'very wrong' post convinced you that Pooka is leaning Town? It just doesn't fit.

Until I get an explanation for this discrepancy, I'll:

vote agentcarr

Let me try to clarify this one last time. Overall, I believe that Pooka is town. I also believe that softclaiming to avoid a lynch is scummy. So as long as I thought that Pooka was softclaiming, I had evidence against my Town!Pooka position. The way Pooka replied to my post caused me to look back and realize that he was refusing to claim, not softclaiming, and refusing to claim isn't scummy. I'll also ask another question I was trying to find out with that first post.

@Anyone who thinks Pooka is scum, do you think Pooka's post constituted a softclaim or a refusal to claim, and what is your reaction to it? And does that make him look more or less town? Dedo already told me that that's what he thinks, and I'd like to hear some other thoughts.

He didn't give me anything worth reacting to. First he gave no argument, then he gave POE as his reason for voting me. Since you had already asked for agent's reason, there wasn't any good response I could think of at the time.

@Agent, if you have already decided that I am scum, you should be able to find something else in my past posts, right?

The weekend is almost over vote count

Being Voted ------------------------------------------------Voted by
RedFireGaming---------------------------------------------Agent (Post 349)
agent---------------------------------------------------------Lift (Post 372)

RedFireGaming and agentcarr are closest to lynch at L-4

OK. I see both points. And no, I didn't read Pooka's refusal to claim as soft-claim.