I think you're just coming from the other extreme here - the example used, alway-online requirement for Sim City, was not a very good one. It was a technical limitation that went as far as to prevent people from playing the game, which is unacceptable. The Volgarr devs - in this very thread, I might add - have acknowledged the demand for the feature and said that this is not their vision for the game. I firmly believe that it is your responsibility, based on feedback or demos provided (altho I, personally, have no issues with pirating a game to make an informed decision), to decide whether or not the product is for you - it is then dev's good will to adjust it to your requests. You want respect from the developer - I think it should really be mutual.

[url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Citation_needed][citation needed][/url]

Complainers must not have been playing games in the 80s and early 90s. You play you die, you learn you die, you memorize you die, you master you succeed. All games used to be like this, only far more relentless than this one. I think this game is very fair in comparison to the games of old. Levels aren't all that big, controls are pretty smooth, hitboxes function the way you'd expect them etc. I have yet to experience any of the old frustrations other than being mad at myself for failing. I love it. Without wanting to sound like a dick I honestly think this game was made for gamers who'v been playing back than as well.

edit: also, for those who think there isn't a market for the game as it is and accuse the devs of elitism, that's simply nonsense. There is a definite market for game like this; megaman 9&10, both Souls games and many more have proven that over the last couple of years.

Let me start by saying that I like this game a lot and am fortunately skilled enough to finish it the way it is (not that hard tbh). That said, it really annoys me to no end when I keep reading all those negative comments made towards those who want the game to be a tad easier. Games should be (for the most part) all about fun and enjoyment, not some bragging rights that you can beat some hard indie game without getting hit, noone cares about that.

The lack of an easy mode is a sign of a dev not caring for it's paying customers and it really doesn't matter how little the demand is. Assuming it doesn't take a lot of resources and/or it's sort of impossible to make due to it's mechanics (Super Meat Boy being a prime example), there is just no excuse and I think none of this apply to this game.

Just look at a very recent example, another indie game - Giana Sisters. People claimed it was too hard and while I didn't really agree with that I would never try to deny someone a chance to enjoy the content he has payed for just cause I could possibly brag to someone how good I am at this very hard game. The dev was smart about it too, and in the end they got even easier levels, cause why not? Another example, I believe both IWBTG and IWBTB have popped up in this thread as a good example of hard games enjoyed by many and while that is true, both of those games actually DO have an easy mode.

That's why I believe the dev should really make the things right and make an easy mode to keep both sides happy. Noone would be forced to play the other one and those who have finished an easier mode would always have an option to try the game as it was meant to be played by devs, since some of you claim it's so important, even though it clearly isn't. Having fun is.

If you think that's what the negative comments are all about, you haven't grasped the situation at all.

It was just an example and while I probably have a fairly good idea what are they about, the bottom line is none of them matter as an easy mode wouldn't hurt anyone, so I would say it is actually you who have missed the point of my post.

Perhaps you should've checked a couple gameplay videos on Jewtube before whining. If you'd read the game description in the first place - "Classic hardcore arcade action" & "Remember when games were tough?"

If only. Live and learn! :D

I believe the point JustADreamer is trying to make is that the hostile reaction of community is completely pointless and unwarranted. A point you have just jumped in to prove as he wasn't even saying that he thinks the game is difficult.

Exactly. The way I see it people who are so heavily against it are that way cause the whole idea of making the game easier affects their own perception of the game and enjoyment. The sense of achievement when beating the game wouldn't be the same, the nostalgia value not so strong and so on. Seriously, this is not a valid reason and one of the dumbest approaches to gaming (and life in general) ever.

Hi Dreamer, wanted to appologize for my previous post. It was a bit rude, which was completely unnecessary. All I wanted to say was that I felt that you, in defense of your own position (which I don't share, but have no problems with either), were misrepresenting the opposite position by reducing it to a "bragging right".

On another note: you say adding an easy mode with savepoints and whatnot is simply something the devs should do, but I think I have a good reason why they shouldn't have to do that (other than the fact they can do whatever they want). They probably had an idea for what this game is supposed to be, and whether you agree or not, the addition of your suggestion alters the entire experience of the game. Knowing the game will screw you and knowing there is nothing you can do but persevere, learn and master is what they were aiming for, and your suggested additions would mess with that goal. No dev should have to change that (or any) goal, because than they wouldn't be making the game they want to make --> artistic integrity.

I am not reducing it to bragging rights I think I have expressed myself rather well in my latest post to what I'm reducing it, so please stick to that.

Of course the devs can do whatever they want but it pays off to be smart and accommodate to everyone's needs in the long run.

I do agree, the gameplay would be much different but as long as it doesn't affect you personally, there is just no reason to care. There are many ways to make the game easier (note that I didn't actually make any suggestions how, so no idea what are you talking about) and at the same time encourage and let the player know that the game was always meant to be played on "normal". If they wanted to be mean about it they could even cut the final level from the easy mode and tell the player that it's only reachable on the normal difficulty. Note that they have somewhat already done that by making the best ending only unlockable on a hard difficulty (which is obviously fine).

Once again, I don't really know how well those two titles are known here and I'm only referring to them because someone else already had in this thread but both IWBTG and IWBTB are games made by hardcore for hardcore, they both have an easy mode (among many more) and yet it's still quite an achievement to complete either of those games even on the lowest difficulty. I wonder why the devs didn't tell the fans to go fuc* themselves, you have to be hardcore to play! Not to mention those games are free so they really have little reason to fight for the affection of players. This is 80s' approach to gaming and while it certainly has some nostalgia feel it doesn't mean it's right.

Artistic integrity you say, I'm not really here to argue whether games are art but I believe I have already made myself clear that imo games should be about fun and while the dev can continue to be stubborn about it, the player base, ideally but not realistically, should be supportive of those who are less skilled. A lot of this animosity might also come from the state of industry and the trend to dumb down every game. However this game is different - it isn't dumbed down by design but it really could use an easy mode to make it more accessible to the broader audience. If the developer doesn't want to do it it's their lose.

I didn't get anything extra from that post to be honest. You mention that we think making the game easier would effect our perception of the game and enjoyment, and you say what would be different: The sense of achievement, the feeling of nostalgia and so on. I don't know what you mean with 'and so on', so I'll stick to the first two. One can't really argue with nostalgia so I'll stay away from that too. That leaves sense of achievement. There is a lot to be said about that, but so far all you've said about it is how we can brag about the achievement ... sorry, but that's really all I can find in your posts. You say a lot about how adding an easy mode would be a good thing. I don't have a lot to say about that. I said previously that while I don't want to have it for myself, I'm otherwise impartial to it.

As to a sense of achievement, a lot can be said about that. I recently upgraded my PC so bought Bioshock Infinite to test it's performance. I'm not normally a shooter person (I suck at it) so I'm glad for a scaling difficulty. I don't play the game for it's shooter element though, in fact I think the game should have been an adventure game, so all I can do to easy my problems in the shooter sections I welcome. I make my own experience and sense of achievement, and I thank the devs for making that possible to me with the simple inclusion of an easymode.

On page 2 of this thread Zauron talked a bit about their views for this game, the kind of experience they want to give. They realise this game with that view will only accomodate a niche audience, in fact they specifically aimed for that. It's why they went about developing the game the way they did. They don't need to cater towards a bigger audience and they don't want to. Now they have released a game that does reach a larger audience than what they are aiming for and all of a sudden people feel compelled to strongly ask for an easy mode. That is something the devs specificly set out NOT to do, they wanted to give us a niche title. What they can do, and did in this very thread, is explain why the game is what it is, explain what is attracting that niche audience to the title. People that are not part of that audience yet can be moved by that, given an insentive to look at the game differently and learn to like the experience the devs DID want to give all of it's player base.

Somebody said on page 3 what the devs are doing is bad business practice. I say it is excellent business practice. These devs actually try to sell their product, not by morphing it into something the masses would like, but by telling us "this is what it is, this is what it will give you, this is what's charming about it ... it's not for you? Well it could be if you consider this".

I'd like to say a bit about what I like about games like this. I hadn't touched games like this is years. I bought Demon's Souls when it was first released, along with a PS3+Assassins Creed 2 pack. I ended up enjoying AC2 a lot more, played a lot of megaman too but after a couple of frustrating hours of DS the game was shelved ... up untill the dissappointment called Diablo 3. A lot can be said about that game, and on of my gripes was the complete lack of challenge. We were able to rush through the game in notime, do it again and not face serious challenge whatsoever. I returned to the megamangames ones more and to DS as well. In my dissappointment about D3, I welcomed the strong contrast DS had to offer. Every wrong turn and sloppy play was punished. The game forced me to learn from my mistakes, force me to overcome my shortcommings, force me to deal with frustration and a sense of loss, force me to truly master what the game had to offer, just like in the good old days (I'v been retrogaming a lot more since, it's how I got GOG). Not doing so just wouldn't get you anywhere. When I recommend the souls games to other people I say the game is lovely, but also that it has a steep learning curve that will take an hour or 10 to beat you in submission. After you have learned those lessons the games aren't even all that hard. What they do is keep you on your toes at all times and ones you get used to that, in time the games even become relaxing. That is the sense of achievement these kinds of games have to offer, the relaxation mastery brings. You simply can't find that in an easymode because than you won't be forced to master anything. That kind of diffculty balance is far to delicate to capture in a scaling difficulty setting.

Comming back to my experience with Bioshock. I am not interested in this experience for that game. I just want to look at the stunning levels and characters, enjoy the setting and story. Hardship is not something I am looking for in that game. Volgarr however is all about hardship, so I am curious as to what people are looking for in this game, if hardship isn't it.

Nice post. Just for the reference, when it comes to 'how creators envisioned the game', I tend to agree with you more than with JustADreamer, even tho I still wish devs included some sort of easy mode. At any rate, to answer your question:
I enjoy Volgarr's gameplay immensely - yes, including the hardship part. I enjoy looking for ways to overcome obstacles this game has to offer, just as I enjoy the game's mechanics themselves - it's very tight, well-thought out and designed. I'm genuinely curious to explore the game and see what it has in store for me in later levels, and to see the further challenges. That's what I want of the game.

What I do not want of the game is repetition. Perhaps I'm just not very good at it, but truth is that it took me about an hour to get trough the first stage of the first level - which is about 10 minutes long in reality. And that applies to all stages. And I just didn't enjoy the game anymore - not because I wouldn't enjoy the new challenges the game was throwing at me, but because I've had to repeatedly overcome challenges I have already finished, to the point where it has not been about skill anymore, but about muscle memory. Now I wouldn't mind that much if this was me playing the game a decade ago - that's when I have played and finished the most classic platformers, which were a tad bit more difficult. But now I don't have nearly as much free time and when I am given a choice to be stuck in Volgarr at one spot that I have to repeatedly return to trough the rest of the level or to go and explore an entirely different game, I pick the different game.

Now you probably ask 'So why don't you play that different game and leave Volgarr alone?' It's quite simple really - there are no other games like Volgarr, none that I am aware of. Even stuff like Gianna Sisters is more of a score attack game.

I'm not sure how would it be possible to solve this problem in the so-called 'easy mode', probably some sort of spawning right before the challenge with a bit more than a basic equipment or introduction of actual checkpoints which would remember equipment you've hand when you have passed them the last time, but it would definitely increase my enjoyment of the game quite a bit.

But this game HAS an easy mode, it's called Path of the Crystal :D

actually up to the second level is pretty difficult, but when you can relevantly easy beat them the rest of the game isn't any problem. just play them til you understand the concept and you'll just breeze through the rest of the game