In that case, I'd suggest taking a look at "A Dance with Rogues" at some point. Requires you to play with a female character, (and pretty much a set kind of character) but it's all great. :D

So I just finished Episode 1. It was awesome. I don't want to come back to real life. I recommend it to anyone.

Side note, I retract my kind words re: Darkness Over Daggerford. It was a small step up from the OC, but there was really no substance to it.

Yall guys should play Kosigan, though. It was so awesome. It's essentially what I'm hoping The Witcher will be (which I haven't played yet).

Well back in those days BioWare called this a spiritual sequel to Baldur's Gate 2.
When they realized that the OC was pretty average (at best) and full of plot holes they decided that it would be a good idea to re-market Dragon Age as spiritual sequel to Baldur's Gate 2 and forget NWN.
Marketing at its worst :)

what bothered me the most about the oc was the "four points" system: always four objectives in the chapters. sigh.

It's basically a template game design. If you think about it every BioWare game works like that. A hero with companions has to collect MacGuffins in order to get the girl and face the antagonist. (you can apply this template to NWN, KotOR, Mass Effect, DAO and so on).

it's no different from Terminator movies... Arnold arrives, Arnold gets clothes and guns, first car chase scene, first gun fight and so forth. I believe it does have its expiry date.

While 10 years ago the template might have served them well I personally believe it is a time to move on and do something new (something of the Witcher like quality).

i can "tolerate" templating. but templating within templating within templating just shows a lack of vision. i've always said that nwn is a toolit, with a not so great official implementation. I liked the expansions tho.

also, what's up with the "losing xp when you take companions"?

I think that is a part of D&D rules :)

RE: templates, have you guys seen the Bioware Cliches chart that the bioware writers raged about? Just as you are both suggesting, this fellow suggested that bioware games follow a standard formula, but the employee who saw it was furious.

I agree with the suggestion re: witcher. The Witcher came across as sincere and heartfelt, though maybe that's just because the most genre games had become redundant.

Side note, after playing NWN and seeing that chart, I feel hesitant to try the other bioware games.

Err, the original site's offline, but here is the chart:
http://gza.gameriot.com/content/images/orig_320200_1_1257581825.png

Yep, seen that some time ago... its valid all right.

Don't take me wrong, I like BioWare games, in principle they are a solid, well developed products though in most cases devoid of any surprising originality. Furthermore, it seems that BioWare takes the criticism of their games rather personally, which I find rather odd. I suppose the legion of fanboys (biodrones) inspires them on daily basis…

I can only hope that the existence and development of CD Projekt Red and the Witcher respectively will give BioWare a pause and a chance to re-invent itself. Though given their aggressive PR and rotten marketing as well as their ability to sacrifice and turn what is the best (KotOR) for, or rather into what makes the most money (TOR MMO) is stacking the odds against them.

I suppose everyone is in the business to make money, but when money takes place ahead of integrity of the product or the associated story and turns it into a cash cow… anyway, those are my opinions and they do not necessary reflect a community at large.

Very interesting chart; although I would claim that most of the Baldur's Gate series does not fit the template that well (outside of the dreams). NWN was really the start of the template-era, followed closely by KOTOR. Both of those titles also has severe issues with the underlying ruleset which is very detrimental for the games.

As D20 games, when you start the game you need to know what you want your character to look like at the end of the game, and plan accordingly. NWN can actually be a quite interesting study in character building and combat, but the story itself is second-rate.

KOTOR suffers from severely unbalanced classes; My first character was a scoundrel that had some difficulties clearing the first planet, while my second soldier cleared all of the first planet without any problems, without leveling up. His reward was 18 levels of Jedi. Ranged weaponry is also very underpowered; charging a soldier wielding a repeating blaster with martial weaponry should really be a death sentence. In KOTOR it is, but for the blaster-wielder...

KOTOR also really doesn't fit the canon all that well; or atleast not the original. Quite interesting to meet a Quarren crimelord in this era, when their planet was discovered by the Empire (according to old West End Games material).

Planescape Torment on the other hand, is something very very different. Despite being given a predetermined character at the start of the game, it's one of the games where your choices during the game have the largest impact.

I find it odd that anyone from Bioware would be upset by the chart. Sure, it's true, but that doesn't necessarily take away from the quality of the games. That guy sounds crazy.

It is quite refreshing to be able to talk about good and bad things that BioWare was responsible and not being immediately flamed by 10k angry fanboys with Sith mentality (if you are not with us 100% then you are against us)...

Thank you guys :)

As for NWN, I really quite hated the original campaign - however, now I'm trying the bonus packages and they are amazing! I mean seriously, I played Kingmaker, which is awesome and with great replayability for longer than average campaign of a full game is nowadays. Mad.

Original campaign is quite weak thou

Soooo I just have to make another plug for this NWN module: Bastard of Kosigan, Episode 1. It was really one of the best RPG experiences I've had in years.