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Hi to all.

I finally put my hands again on NWN 1 after hiatus in 10 or even 15 years, so I don't remember much from my last playthrough (especially considering I never finished it). My favorite class in D&D games was always Thief/Rogue (I just can't help from picking locks and pockets by myself, and I like backstabbing people :P).

So what are the best stats distribution for a Rogue? Would it be affordable to get some minuses in stats (WIS, CHA maybe)? Would it be wise to push this big "Recommended stats distribution" button? And what about the best prestige classes for a Rogue? I'm not a big knower of NWN D&D system tricks, so any advice from the Rogue profies would be helpful.

Thanks in advance.
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Nyktouros: So what are the best stats distribution for a Rogue?
Depends on what you want. I personally think the best approach with Rogues is to multiclass Fighter and focus on strength-based combat, putting a 16 into strength and then balancing out the other stats to taste. Whether that fits your concept of your character is another matter.
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Nyktouros: Would it be affordable to get some minuses in stats (WIS, CHA maybe)?
Definitely. A low wisdom score will mean you're dependent on items (either gear or consumables) to protect you from nasty effects, but a Rogue will never have a great will defense anyways. This isn't pen and paper, immunity effects and defenses are absolute so it's possible to completely moot your will save.
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Nyktouros: Would it be wise to push this big "Recommended stats distribution" button?
I've seen it do some pretty stupid stuff, so I don't recommend hitting the recommended button.
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Nyktouros: And what about the best prestige classes for a Rogue?
Fighter, Barbarian, or Paladin have the best synergy with Rogue due to offering it all the proficiencies it lacks while also shoring up its weak combat abilities. Not really prestige classes, but sometimes traditional multiclassing does the job best.
Post edited January 22, 2018 by Darvin
Oh, I forgot to mention that I'd prefer to be a pure Rogue and a Human :) I never liked multiclassing much and never imagined myself as an Elf or all the more so as an Orc or Dwarf (for some reasons I don't clearly know, maybe role-playing or esthetical).

For me the ideal Rogue is swift, agile and deadly, lonesome assassin, sneaking and thieving like a nightshade :) With crossbow and poisoned dagger, perhaps.
Post edited January 22, 2018 by Nyktouros
I love Rogues (and Bards). But I no longer believe in going absolutely pure. I started the Original Campaign as a pure Rogue and was very happy until about Level 8 when I found I couldn't hit anything because their armour class was too high.

I second Darvin here. A Rogue with two levels of Fighter to give you two extra feats is a lot more powerful and hits harder. If you take Weapon Focus in a melee weapon you can go to the Champion of Torm prestige class later, that gives you extra feats and boosts your saves as well. Would suggest two or more levels of that around Level 9.

My favourite Rogue is a dexterity-based dual wielder with 14 Strength, then boost Dex all the way. But play the game the way you want and enjoy!
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Nyktouros: Oh, I forgot to mention that I'd prefer to be a pure Rogue and a Human :) I never liked multiclassing much and never imagined myself as an Elf or all the more so as an Orc or Dwarf (for some reasons I don't clearly know, maybe role-playing or esthetical).

For me the ideal Rogue is swift, agile and deadly, lonesome assassin, sneaking and thieving like a nightshade :) With crossbow and poisoned dagger, perhaps.
I started a (mostly) pure Rogue for my first play through. It needed 1 level of Shadow Dancer for Hide In Plain Sight, and then it was a blast against anything I could sneak attack (and a pain before then). The hordes of undead and constructs were a major drag, however.

I'd suggest mixing in some fighting class, and/or focusing strength for the extra damage against things that can't be backstabbed. Also, 1 level of SD for that sweet, sweet HiPS.
Well, but what about a mercenary as a tank? Can I avoid of fighter-biased multiclassing while having some hefty heavy-hitting monk or someone else on the frontline? (and with HenchmenAI mod mercenaries become more versatile and effective, IIRC).
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Nyktouros: Well, but what about a mercenary as a tank? Can I avoid of fighter-biased multiclassing while having some hefty heavy-hitting monk or someone else on the frontline? (and with HenchmenAI mod mercenaries become more versatile and effective, IIRC).
It is more about you being able to deal damage than about tanking incoming damage.

Easiest way may be to simply take a straight Rogue for a few levels, and see how you like it. There are enough Undead and Constructs in Act 1 to give you a feel for what you'll be up against.

And I really can't overstate how much I recommend a single level dip into Shadow Dancer. The ability to hide even after enemies have spotted you is so incredibly valuable. I wouldn't bother with more than one level, but HiPS is worth it.
This is certainly doable. The Barbarian is good in Chapter 1. After that the Monk (and later the Cleric) also pick up in power.

Trap setting is another strategy to damage those pesky undead and constructs. A few points in Set Trap and a bunch in Disable Trap and you can recover most traps, and then set them to take out your enemies!

My recommended stats for a well-rounded human Rogue:
Str: 14
Dex: 16 (increase all the way)
Con: 12
Wis: 8
Int: 14 (for lots of skill points)
Cha: 12 (a charmer)
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Nyktouros: Well, but what about a mercenary as a tank? Can I avoid of fighter-biased multiclassing while having some hefty heavy-hitting monk or someone else on the frontline? (and with HenchmenAI mod mercenaries become more versatile and effective, IIRC).
Post edited January 23, 2018 by PracticalKat
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Darvin: Depends on what you want. I personally think the best approach with Rogues is to multiclass Fighter and focus on strength-based combat, putting a 16 into strength and then balancing out the other stats to taste. Whether that fits your concept of your character is another matter.
Total agreement here. Being a dex finesse fighter in NWN sucks.

You end up relying on your Sneak attacks for damage, and Sneak attacks don't work against the large hordes of Undead, don't work against constructs, and many boss type creatures will be made a immune as well.

Relying on Dex also means you are limited in weapons you can use. Want to use the most ubiquitous weapon in the game: Longsword? Well tough luck. Not a Finesse weapon, so you are shit with it.

First play should not not stuck with only finesse weapons.

My starting stat choice is:

Str: 16 ( Hit bonus with all melee weapons, and damage bonus too)
Dex: 16 (AC bonus, Rogue stuff, dual wield if you want it)
Con: 12 (hit points, fort Saves)
Wis: 8 (Dump Stat 1)
Int: 14 (skill points)
Cha: 8 (Dump stat 2) Yeah Cha would be nice if it wasn't more beneficial elsewhere, you can make up for every application of Cha with more skill points, you get from Int.

I wish we had spoiler tags here, so we could post builds without them taking up so much room, making clutter.
Hm, looks like a decent guide:

https://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/188666-neverwinter-nights/faqs/18823

Any comments?
I like it a lot. Especially the tone :) Doesn't deal with prestige classes, but otherwise it's pretty sound. Focussed more on dex builds, and a str build will be easier on a first play through.

It inspired me to try a Rogue myself, and inspiration (for me) is half the fun of playing..


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Nyktouros: Hm, looks like a decent guide:

https://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/188666-neverwinter-nights/faqs/18823

Any comments?
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Nyktouros: Hm, looks like a decent guide:

https://www.gamefaqs.com/pc/188666-neverwinter-nights/faqs/18823

Any comments?
Rogues are my favorite class in the game, and I have played them multiple times through all the original campaigns.

That FAQ is Ok, for it's time, but I disagree with some things.

Races:
I think Humans are a great Rogue race. The extra feat is always welcome, they extra skill points are very handy for a Rogue, and being able to multiclass more freely is a big bonus, plus being normal size means all weapons are open to you.

Elves are nice but IMO they don't multiclass well, since Wizard is their free multiclass, and that is really NOT the best option for Rogue Multiclassing.

Halflings are also good, but small size really limits weapons...

I take human Rogues 90%+ of the time.

Skills:
He gets this mostly right but he undervalues Use Magic Device (UMD), IMO this is one of the most awesome skills in the game. Say you just killed that Evil Boss and he dropped black bastard sword that has Vampiric Regeneration, but it is only usable by Evil characters, but also Rogues with enough UMD, Clerics Healing scrolls, Rogue with UMD, Wizards wand of FIreballs, Rogue with UMD... Get the picture. A Rogue is the ultimate resourceful character, that can use any item in the game. This is the best skill in the game, keep it maxed out.


Multiclass:
Fighter: is typically my first choice for a multiclass. Feats, Feats, and more feats, and Weapons specialization, because you want damage when fighting sneak immunes.

Ranger: is another good choice, you gain some extra skills but lose the fighters feats.

IMO, in this game, all Rogues should not only multiclass, but triple class. There is no reason not to.

Some Rogue/Fighter options:

Rogue/Fighter/Paladin.

Overlooked and very handy all round option for the original campaigns. In the original campaign, undead are a ubiquitous and annoying enemy. They are sneak immune, often have damage reduction, and often cause disease, and some have an aura of fear. I HATE fear. It makes my character run away and worse yet, run into walls and do nothing while getting slaughtered.

Paladins are immune to disease, at second level they are immune to fear, and at 3rd level they get the ability to cure disease, which also fixes almost any stat draining caused to you character, and you get full use of the "Holy Avenger" which I think you might find. Best melee weapon in the early game.

A Fighter/Rogue/Paladin I posted before, though this one is more fighter oriented, with high Str and low Dex for platemail. Though you could do similar with Rogue primary and 16 Str, 16 Dex to stealth in light armor:
https://www.gog.com/forum/neverwinter_nights_series/companions_misbehaving/post5

Rogue/Fighter/Ranger.

Ranger adds some skill points while progressing with your combat abilities, and easy path to dual wielding weapons, and some nice flavor. With Animal Empathy, a Ranger can talk to friendly animals, which are scattered all over the original campaigns.

Rogue/Fighter/Shadowdancer.

Common but a little overrated IMO. If you want use stealth a lot. Shadowdancer, lets you enter stealth in a room full of enemies. Handy but it's really taking a class for one feat.

Rogue/Fighter/Champion of Torm.
COT is mainly a booster for saving throws, while giving lots of feats like a fighter.


Rogue/Fighter/Weapon Master.

Boost your critical damage with one weapon. Somewhat popular, but painful class to qualify for.

Stats.

No matter which classes you pick. they remain the same.

16 Str
16 Dex
14 Int

Are the key stats. Even if you want to play dex first(which I recommend against strongly), don't set your strength to 10 like many guides suggest. You can start with good dex and str and take it from there.
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PeterScott: No matter which classes you pick. they remain the same.

16 Str
16 Dex
14 Int
Wow, quite impressive heap of advices, thanks!

But what about CHA? Persuade and such. There should be whole quests or quest branches/resolutions only available after succesful persuading, IIRC (though I played last time very long ago and might be wrong here).

And that guide-guy said Pick Pocket is worthless... How can it be that an honest Rogue won't find anything valuable in his fellow-citizens' pockets?? Or in their stores?! :)
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PeterScott: No matter which classes you pick. they remain the same.

16 Str
16 Dex
14 Int
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Nyktouros: Wow, quite impressive heap of advices, thanks!

But what about CHA? Persuade and such. There should be whole quests or quest branches/resolutions only available after succesful persuading, IIRC (though I played last time very long ago and might be wrong here).

And that guide-guy said Pick Pocket is worthless... How can it be that an honest Rogue won't find anything valuable in his fellow-citizens' pockets?? Or in their stores?! :)
Persuade is the most used diplomatic skill. Take the Persuade skill maxed at each level up. That will cover your low Cha score and leave those ability point to better use elsewhere (Dex/Str/Int). There are occasional bluff/intimidate checks but not worth chasing IMO. 2 points of Cha = +1 on persuade. 2 points of Int = +1 persuade every level (+4 at first level).

I usually take 1 point in pickpocket, so I can do it If I really need too (then equip all gear possible, drink potions etc..), but I also don't think it worth investing in with so many good skills to choose from.

Core (I max these for quite a while):
Disable Trap, Open Locks, Hide, Move Silently, Search, UMD, Tumble, Persuade are the main skills I chase, and I usually don't have much points beyond that.

Optional (do what ever you want if you have leftover after core):
A little Lore at the beginning is nice to identify gear before other ways turn up, Appraise can really boost money from stores, Heal can really boost the benefit of healing packs, Pick Pockets, Set Traps if you are into that and have the spare points, etc...
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PeterScott: Rogue/Fighter/Shadowdancer.

Common but a little overrated IMO. If you want use stealth a lot. Shadowdancer, lets you enter stealth in a room full of enemies. Handy but it's really taking a class for one feat.
I mostly agree with what PeterScott is saying (though I don't have first hand experience with the Rogue/Fighter). I do want to point out that SD lets you stealth if you want/need a quick breather to let regeneration do its thing (or enemy buffs to run out, or debuffs on you to run out (like Shadow strength drain)), or you want to reposition without enemies getting free attacks on you while you are spending time relocating, or to escape from combat without enemies chasing you to (or possibly through) a zone transition, or simply to sneak attack something again.

Repeated stealth sneak attacks are a great way to deal damage to enemies that can be sneak attacked (and that can't see invisible), even if you only really get one swing per round this way. At least the physical based enemies might not get some of their attacks per round either.

Granted, I might be a bit biased because I really enjoyed stealthing in and out of combat. :)