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General discussion (archive)Really starting to get resentful at xboxlive and Microsoft(59 posts)(59 posts)
(59 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted September 25, 2011
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Egotomb: There is no charge for the xbox live silver(standard) service therefore demo's are free, assuming they didn't change anything since I last used mine?
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StingingVelvet: They delay demos a week or more for silver members.
Yes, paying members get first access to the available bandwidth for the huge (2-3GB) demos. That's not trying to slight the Silver members as much as making sure the people footing the bill for bandwidth (Gold members) get first shot at it. Seriously, I don't think a week will kill anyone, it didn't kill me when I was Silver.
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mushy101: ...
You realize the XBox 360 supports UPnP as well, which is the core protocol behind DLNA (it probably supports DLNA as well, but I've never tried, it's just encryption on top of UPnP)?

As wodmarach said, yep, XBox 360 supports external media fine. Max partition size is 16 GB which is lame and I'll grant the disk format is ridiculous.

UPnP plus any UPnP media server (ps3mediaserver works fine) on your computer will stream your movies right over to you big TV, seriously this isn't rocket science, it's like clicking two buttons.

Actually, did you actually try these yourself or are you just parroting something you read? You seem pretty misinformed if 90% of your XBox 360 rants aren't even true.
Post edited September 25, 2011 by orcishgamer
Posted September 25, 2011
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orcishgamer: You realize the XBox 360 supports UPnP as well, which is the core protocol behind DLNA (it probably supports DLNA as well, but I've never tried, it's just encryption on top of UPnP)?
Media Centre extenders are actually a superset of DLNA and media player just uses straight DLNA after some research the limitation with wireless is due to some flaky sections of the UPnP module which make wireless the first section scanned by which time the xbox has usually timed out for the wired check... PS3 actually suffers from the same problem but scans a little longer allowing it to catch some but not all wired DLNA servers.
Posted September 25, 2011
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mushy101: Compared to MS dictatorship of the xbox platform, Sony seems like a benign democracy.
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wodmarach: Yeah I mean Sony only takes away features it advertises with, has no legal way to homebrew, removes your rights in it's TOS... Sony is in no way benign about it's only major advantages are the B-ray and free online gaming.
Which is something I wish somebody would have pointed out to me when I bought my PS3 slim. It was a substantially worse value than previous PS3s as it didn't come with Other OS and Sony had ripped all the PS2 compatibility out of it to save money. And didn't bother to put on the box that it was no longer compatible with the PS2 games.

When it comes to MS versus Sony, they both suck, most folks that say otherwise are probably fanbois.

That being said, if you just want to play games, the PS3 is perfectly respectable, I haven't had any trouble with it, but I mostly use it to play Blurays and borrowed games.
Posted September 25, 2011
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KyleKatarn: I've always thought that comparing multi-platform ps3 and xbox 360 games to each other isn't really fair for the ps3.

....

If there is a game that was designed separately for both the 360 and the ps3, that would be something to compare.
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orcishgamer: Yeah but that doesn't happen and there's no better comparison. Sony talks a good game about their hardware, they did so with the PS2 as well, it never turns out as good as they are able to make it sound. The Sega Dreamcast that launched a year earlier still seemed to have way better looking games than the PS2.

For whatever reason, whether Sony's software toolkit sucks or they're just fond of putting in bottlenecks that degrade performance, Sony's PS3 doesn't really look better than the 360. Sometimes you get games that look better on one or the other, but in aggregate they're about the same, regardless of specs.
Well, I shouldn't try to defend Sony. I've always liked their hardware, they seem to make quality stuff that works and lasts a long time, but they've been horrible on the drm side of things.

As for the quality of the games on the consoles, I'm no game developer or a programmer so I'm just going to keep my mouth shut from now on about what the reasons are for that, since I don't truly know.
Posted September 26, 2011
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KyleKatarn: As for the quality of the games on the consoles, I'm no game developer or a programmer so I'm just going to keep my mouth shut from now on about what the reasons are for that, since I don't truly know.
Yes but you play games, your opinion on how a game looks or plays is plenty valid:)
Posted September 26, 2011
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orcishgamer: Yes, paying members get first access to the available bandwidth for the huge (2-3GB) demos. That's not trying to slight the Silver members as much as making sure the people footing the bill for bandwidth (Gold members) get first shot at it. Seriously, I don't think a week will kill anyone, it didn't kill me when I was Silver.
Somehow Steam get by without doing so.
Posted September 26, 2011
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orcishgamer: Yes, paying members get first access to the available bandwidth for the huge (2-3GB) demos. That's not trying to slight the Silver members as much as making sure the people footing the bill for bandwidth (Gold members) get first shot at it. Seriously, I don't think a week will kill anyone, it didn't kill me when I was Silver.
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StingingVelvet: Somehow Steam get by without doing so.
I'm not saying it's the only available economic model, just that there's an economic reason and it's not some dark plot to sucker you into buying a Gold sub. The lack of multiplayer is a dark plot to sucker you into a Gold sub:)
Posted September 26, 2011
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orcishgamer: I'm not saying it's the only available economic model, just that there's an economic reason and it's not some dark plot to sucker you into buying a Gold sub. The lack of multiplayer is a dark plot to sucker you into a Gold sub:)
I'm pretty sure it has absolutely nothing to do with bandwith and everything to do with creating incentives for singleplayer gamers to go Gold, same as Netflix and and such being Gold only despite having their own subscription costs. You can disagree of course.
Posted September 26, 2011
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orcishgamer: I'm not saying it's the only available economic model, just that there's an economic reason and it's not some dark plot to sucker you into buying a Gold sub. The lack of multiplayer is a dark plot to sucker you into a Gold sub:)
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StingingVelvet: I'm pretty sure it has absolutely nothing to do with bandwith and everything to do with creating incentives for singleplayer gamers to go Gold, same as Netflix and and such being Gold only despite having their own subscription costs. You can disagree of course.
Well, the whole thing is a plot to get XBox users to pay for something that they effectively already pay for. Anybody who isn't already paying an ISP for internet isn't going to be interested in a gold membership anyways.
Posted September 26, 2011
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orcishgamer: I'm not saying it's the only available economic model, just that there's an economic reason and it's not some dark plot to sucker you into buying a Gold sub. The lack of multiplayer is a dark plot to sucker you into a Gold sub:)
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StingingVelvet: I'm pretty sure it has absolutely nothing to do with bandwith and everything to do with creating incentives for singleplayer gamers to go Gold, same as Netflix and and such being Gold only despite having their own subscription costs. You can disagree of course.
I don't know what the bandwidth of Steam is but Gold used to get you a disproportionately fast bandwidth a few years ago. In fact it was literally the only thing that could max my cable connection back around 2007 or 2008. That stuff costs money. Yes, you can get free demo downloads from a lot of places but the infrastructure was not at all like that.

These days Gold doesn't seem too much faster than most other stuff. It's still on the pretty fast end of the scale though. Do PC game demos weigh in at 2-3GB? They didn't used to, I was actually surprised by the large size of the demos on my XBox 360 back when first got it.

Should it be free? Maybe, all I know is Live is largely a good experience. I've heard some pretty questionable things about PSN, though mostly back closer to launch so I suspect it does probably cost some serious cash to maintain this infrastructure. You're paying for it on Steam too, you just don't see a separate cost:)
Posted September 26, 2011
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orcishgamer: Should it be free? Maybe, all I know is Live is largely a good experience. I've heard some pretty questionable things about PSN, though mostly back closer to launch so I suspect it does probably cost some serious cash to maintain this infrastructure. You're paying for it on Steam too, you just don't see a separate cost:)
Well I'm paying for it on Steam through the cut Steam gets from sales. Microsoft takes a cut of console game sales too though, and they sell a lot more copies hence they get a lot more sales. Most of the multiplayer is peer-to-peer, Netflix handle their own bandwith, demos are sales drivers...

The only reason Microsoft charges for Live is because they can. People pay it.
Posted September 26, 2011
I feel like consoles in general are treating their customers worse just because they can and because they have such a large slice of the video gaming pie now.

I used to do most of my gaming on console, but it's things like this that made me give up on console gaming after the previous generation. I really didn't like the way the current generation of consoles was going, and I have to say recent developments have made me more glad I decided not to bother with consoles anymore.
To me it seemed that consoles were, and still are, becoming more like part of an effort by the MS and Sony as well as big publishers to gain more control over the art form and entertainment medium known as video games rather to advance and promote it.
Posted September 26, 2011
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orcishgamer: You're correct, I didn't take into account European and Aussie gamers. In my defense you guys seem to get screwed on price regardless. In the US (and I presume Canada) a lot of this season's big PC titles are retailing for 60 USD which is the same as your average console title.
For some reason we seem to get screwed only on console games, not so much PC games.

Comparing "some big PC titles" to "average console title" is not useful. You should compare what the mutliplatform games, which are released about the same time on both PC and consoles, cost on both platforms in the same store. That is the only meaningful comparison.

If console and PC games cost the same in US, then I think the US PC gamers are the ones being screwed because the PC game price does not include the licensing fees going to the console manufacturer.
Posted September 26, 2011
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mushy101: The media restrictions sour the 360 and push me towards the PS3. Yes, having Windows media player installed on your pc will allow you to stream media to your 360. But I chose to uninstall that for a better media player, and the 360, (to my knowledge), won't work with any other. Using DLNA is superior, since my HTC Desire S can also stream to and fro from my ps3 AND PC.
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wodmarach: Umm the xbox is DLNA compatible but for some f'd up reason only over wireless (I have NO clue why it doesn't work fully over wired) just click video/music library and select your comp as long as theres a DLNA server it works.. infact I find it more stable than my PS3 with certain files.

I didn't have much reason to try it cabled. My routers ports are all took up by the PS3, 2 desktops, sky'dodgy'box and laptop. Same goes for my friends, who 360s are using the adaptor. We all tried on each other's networks, and kept hitting walls in regards to the 360 visibility on the DLNA enabled computer. Add to this that my phone (rooted and custom flash rom) will not work even when usb is attached to the 360 and phone is in file transfer mode. I have been told it's due to my root and that CM7 is still teething on the desire s. Yet it's only a xbox problem. Both connected, the PS3 and PC works with my phone.

Thanks for clearing that up and I'll suggest to all of them that if they want to stream media, they hook up with ethernet. I'll also try my phone when the 360 is wired.
We then move onto HDD benefits. I can use all of my thumbsticks and portables HDD's without the need to reformat for the PS3. transferring most files and folders. Though you can't read documents, you can store them on the PS3 hard drive. Nearly all types of images AND music files require a simple transfer before you can play/view them. No stupid DRM is employed, no hoops to jump through.
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wodmarach: Plug in thumb sitck choose video/music library choose portable storage.. win?


Sadly, no. As I mentioned, the PS3 works with my thumbsticks and HDD's. I experimented with 7 360s and 3 of them worked with my storage device without reformatting. Once reformatted, it went up to 5. I also took the default 120 gig PS3 HDD and put it in a custom enclosure. Didn't work with the 360 but did with my pc, laptop and PS3. It is a problem unique with my device(s) and I am not prepared to reformat all of them yet again since I sold my 360, or buy new storage devices simply because I can use them on friends 360. It's easier taking my laptop.


The awesome thing is though, the movie viewing. I have a huge collection of movies, from dvd rips to blu ray rips to .MP4's and everything in between. The ps3 plays 90% flawlessly. In fact the PS3 has options to clean up the image and make the picture much better. The only trouble with films it has are ones which use a high level .MKV transfer. But this is remedied by encoding them to type 2 .MKV.
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wodmarach: 1.install Divx or equiv on pc if using media centre, Tversity if not
2.???
3.profit

As mentioned above, HDD benefit. My movie collection can fit easier on my PS3 then 360. Ofc the new Xbox S has a standard HDD making it easily upgradable, but I don't know one who owns it. Add to the fact you have to buy one just for this feature. Sorry I didn't mention using the PS3 as a secondary movie library in my original post. :(
Want to back up save files? No problem! Bang in a usb HDD, memory card or thumbstick and transfer them over. If you wish, you can back them up as many times as you want on any computer or device.
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wodmarach: unless copy protected ofc and the same applies to the xbox

Ah, thought the xbox only allowed back ups to it's propriety memory card, my bad.
Compared to MS dictatorship of the xbox platform, Sony seems like a benign democracy.
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wodmarach: Yeah I mean Sony only takes away features it advertises with, has no legal way to homebrew, removes your rights in it's TOS... Sony is in no way benign about it's only major advantages are the B-ray and free online gaming.
I'm comparing to MS control of the xbox, and calling it benign. Which in my and my friends experience it was. We've had a better experience with the PS3 then xbox. Enough for them to move over for to the PS3. As for homebrew and linux, I have a PC.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussion (archive)Really starting to get resentful at xboxlive and Microsoft(59 posts)(59 posts)
(59 posts)