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General discussion (archive)New Gaming Options: Follow-up Survey(519 posts)(519 posts)
(519 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted April 15, 2013
We (still) want to hear from you!

We recently asked you guys for feedback based on some potential games that we may be able to sign in the future. The results were pretty clear--and we will be sharing them with you all soon--but we did want to ask you a single follow-up question with an actual real-world game example. One of the games that we would like to add to our catalog is Planetary Annihilation. This is an RTS with many modern gaming features, and we figured we'd use it as our test example.

<iframe width="590" height="332" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Xpze54xgqtg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Planetary Annihilation is distinctive for the following:

- Multiplayer and skirmish focused gameplay; there is no story-based single-player campaign, but AI skirmish matches provide a great single player experience.
- Optional persistent online features such as scoreboards, social features, achievements, and the online multiplayer campaign - a persistent galaxy-wide war; an account with the developer's online service is required in order to use these features.
- No activation, unique codes, or third-party accounts are required for single-player play or, LAN/direct connection multiplayer.
- A unique key is required for Internet multiplayer, and an account with the developer's service is only required for the persistent online features.

Now, that you know about the game's specifics, here's our question:
Post edited April 15, 2013 by G-Doc
Posted April 16, 2013
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mrkgnao: But I do have a problem with games that have "no story-based single-player campaign".
Master of Magic, Master of Orion, Master of Orion 2 and the whole Civilization genre go in a corner to cry :(
Because those games don't have a story-based single-player campaign either. Just a map to play against AI in.
Posted April 16, 2013
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mrkgnao: However, I do regret the fact that GOG did not have the courage to ask a neutrally phrased question (not the one from my post you quote, which is intentionally phrased in the opposite direction), but had to resort to this one in order to get the answer it wanted.
Yes, this is sad but at least they had the decency to ask anything, not like Blizzard, they don't even give you a answer when their online services don't work (like when Diablo 3 was launched and no one could even install the game).

I think GOG is going in the wrong direction, from Good Old Games they have rebranded the site to GOG.com and started selling new games, DRM on multiplayer would be the end of this site we love so much.
Posted April 16, 2013
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mrkgnao: But I do have a problem with games that have "no story-based single-player campaign".
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JMich: Master of Magic, Master of Orion, Master of Orion 2 and the whole Civilization genre go in a corner to cry :(
Because those games don't have a story-based single-player campaign either. Just a map to play against AI in.
And I indeed do not play them.

But the PA case is different, nonetheless. Here the story-based SP campaign was not thrown out in order to create another type of (great) SP experience. It was thrown out for online, social gaming. There's a difference.
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mrkgnao: However, I do regret the fact that GOG did not have the courage to ask a neutrally phrased question (not the one from my post you quote, which is intentionally phrased in the opposite direction), but had to resort to this one in order to get the answer it wanted.
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EPurpl3: Yes, this is sad but at least they had the decency to ask anything, not like Blizzard, they don't even give you a answer when their online services don't work (like when Diablo 3 was launched and no one could even install the game).
I agree. GOG is still better. That's why I'm here.
Post edited April 16, 2013 by mrkgnao
Posted April 16, 2013
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RoseLegion: Your statement is a bit contradictory, you don't want DRM as much as the next guy.... except the "extreme" anti-DRM people on the GOG forums? Moving beyond the contradiction what makes these members, in your view, extreme? How do you qualify those aspects? Are there any players (even theoretical ones) you can cite that have no interest in what steam has to 'offer' which you would not consider extreme?
The idea (that is quite wrong and is frankly a fallacy of epic proportions) that ANYTHING that requires an Internet connection (even a one-time activation) is considered to be DRM when in fact the opposite is true. I'm talking about the really extreme DRM things like always-online games (even for single player games), and things that get in the way of enjoyment of one's games.

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RoseLegion: Most of the social features of steam can be had without steam itself nor bound to a specific game, most of the game catalog features (obviously with the exception of size due to the number of publishers who still cling to DRM) of steam are things GOG already offers. One-time activations are unneeded when you have no DRM so GOG does that one better, I could go on but I'll keep this short.
I am talking achievements, etc. The idea is that one would "cheat" on achievements UNLESS the game was locked down with DRM is also a big-time fallacy that I'd love to see destroyed.

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RoseLegion: The point is that even tho I voted "yes" on the survey due to the game offering LAN and direct connection options that are fully DRM free (if my reading has been accurate anyway), that no you are certainly not as opposed to DRM as the next guy at least if the next guy is one of the ones like me who won't use steam because of it's integrated and imbedded DRM (not to mention truly horrendous customer service, I mean they're no EA but they give it a good shot).

Note, despite my closing paragraph my first should not be viewed as rhetorical, I absolutely do want explicit and detailed answers from you regarding the questions posed there.

Legion
IF it's fully DRM-free, then my "yes" vote is still relevant.
Posted April 16, 2013
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mrkgnao: I have absolutely no problem with all this register/activate/LAN/internet/keys/codes mumbo jumbo. But I do have a problem with games that have "no story-based single-player campaign". Even if they're free (Yes, I'm looking at you, Warsow).
Uber said that the reason why they did not want to have a story based single player is because those tend to be extremely hard ans expensive to make, and most players only play it once and then go play skirmish, so what they did is have the skirmish mode be some kind of procedurally generated campaign instead.

See this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5caRZBS9QsM
Post edited April 16, 2013 by riboshom
Posted April 16, 2013
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mrkgnao: But the PA case is different, nonetheless. Here the story-based SP campaign was not thrown out in order to create another type of (great) SP experience. It was thrown out for online, social gaming. There's a difference.
Actually, there never was a campaign planned for it. The game was made out to be a slugfest, and that is what it is. Whether the idea of a series of challenges is enough to be considered a SP campaign is debatablem though UT had just that and people accept it.

So imho, a game can have a great single player portion without a story-driven campaign, with just a series of slugfests. Different tastes though, and no harm in liking any kind of game.
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EPurpl3: I think GOG is going in the wrong direction, from Good Old Games they have rebranded the site to GOG.com and started selling new games
Ability to buy new games from GOG.com? Yes please. I'll take two of them. How can I add more?

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EPurpl3: DRM on multiplayer would be the end of this site we love so much.
What DRM on multiplayer? The LAN has no checks, the IP connect has no checks, only the Matchmaking and "league" so to speak requires an account. If Uber closes down the day after release, we'll still be able to play the game fully.
Post edited April 16, 2013 by JMich
Posted April 16, 2013
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TheEnigmaticT: You know, I don't believe we've had a single week since our launch in 2008 where we haven't released at least one classic game. Excepting the few weeks at the beginning of each year where we give you guys a break.

(of course, if I'm wrong I'm sure someone will correct me. :P)
Can we correct you even if you are right? It IS the internet, you know! :P
Posted April 16, 2013
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TheEnigmaticT: You know, I don't believe we've had a single week since our launch in 2008 where we haven't released at least one classic game. Excepting the few weeks at the beginning of each year where we give you guys a break.

(of course, if I'm wrong I'm sure someone will correct me. :P)
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hucklebarry: Can we correct you even if you are right? It IS the internet, you know! :P
You win sir.

Just to state my opinion: I never saw more complete and well priced catalogue of classical games. I will continue to support gog by buing more games unless something big happens. Like an apocalypse or such.
Posted April 16, 2013
I have to say, that games with the OPTION to use third party accounts for online play are perfectly acceptable to me. Games such as Diablo, Diablo 2, etc would be a welcome sight! The only thing I am abhorantly opposed to, is the REQUIREMENT to have a third party account, an internet connection, EVEN A ONE TIME REGISTRATION :P If the game isn't mine free and clear, it sure as hell does not belong here at GOG in my view. REQUIRE me to do ANYTHING with it in order to play it, and you have just entered the DRM zone.

For the record, I voted yes to this survey, despite voting no to EVERY question on the last one :)
Post edited April 16, 2013 by PhoenixAshes
Posted April 16, 2013
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Nettle: ... I will continue to support gog by buing more games unless something big happens. Like an apocalypse or such.
... or DRM on Gog. Which would be about the same. :-)
Posted April 16, 2013
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Trilarion: I don't mind such games on GOG. Maybe they should negotiate with the publisher a minimum up-time of the game server. 5 years seems a reasonable time. Otherwise money back.
Please no, if I buy a game on GOG I want it to work indefinitely. As long as I have the necessary system to run the game, I should be able to install and play the game. No end-of-life time is reasonable.

Just my 2c
Posted April 16, 2013
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mrkgnao: I have absolutely no problem with all this register/activate/LAN/internet/keys/codes mumbo jumbo. But I do have a problem with games that have "no story-based single-player campaign". Even if they're free (Yes, I'm looking at you, Warsow).
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riboshom: Uber said that the reason why they did not want to have a story based single player is because those tend to be extremely hard ans expensive to make, and most players only play it once and then go play skirmish, so what they did is have the skirmish mode be some kind of procedurally generated campaign instead.

See this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5caRZBS9QsM
Unfortunately, I am not most players. I don't play skirmishes, just campaigns.
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mrkgnao: But the PA case is different, nonetheless. Here the story-based SP campaign was not thrown out in order to create another type of (great) SP experience. It was thrown out for online, social gaming. There's a difference.
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JMich: Actually, there never was a campaign planned for it. The game was made out to be a slugfest, and that is what it is. Whether the idea of a series of challenges is enough to be considered a SP campaign is debatablem though UT had just that and people accept it.

So imho, a game can have a great single player portion without a story-driven campaign, with just a series of slugfests. Different tastes though, and no harm in liking any kind of game.
Indeed no harm.
P.S. By "thrown out" I did not imply that they planned it and then cancelled it. They apparently threw it out in the planning stage.
Post edited April 16, 2013 by mrkgnao
Posted April 16, 2013
I really don't see the problem here, there is no DRM that will stop you from playing solo and you can't have online without some kind of DRM or online acount. So if you really don't want DRM don't play online or just don't buy it, but I think there is a lot of people who would be happy to buy it from GOG.
Posted April 16, 2013
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EPurpl3: I think GOG is going in the wrong direction, from Good Old Games they have rebranded the site to GOG.com and started selling new games
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JMich: Ability to buy new games from GOG.com? Yes please. I'll take two of them. How can I add more?
I think you know exactly what I have meant, by "new games" I meant recently released games, for example games released in 2013, 2012, 2011 and so on. So not games highly praised by many for their great quality and features and are still played today but games that are here just to help GOG to make more money, for example the games made by Projekt RED, the owner of GOG.


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EPurpl3: DRM on multiplayer would be the end of this site we love so much.
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JMich: What DRM on multiplayer? The LAN has no checks, the IP connect has no checks, only the Matchmaking and "league" so to speak requires an account. If Uber closes down the day after release, we'll still be able to play the game fully.
I was not talking about this game but in general, I rephrase, "If GOG will start to introduce in its catalog games that have DRM even only on internet multiplayer this would be the end of this site we love so much" so please don't sell games with DRM.

About this game. "A unique key is required for Internet multiplayer". This is some sort of DRM and the game may feature pay to win features services as long as Uber has the control over the internet play and that is not cool.

I am a huge Total Annihilation fan and I want to like this game and I hope it will be great but I rather not buy it if this means the beginning of the end for GOG.
Posted April 16, 2013
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tischepe: ...
Please no, if I buy a game on GOG I want it to work indefinitely. As long as I have the necessary system to run the game, I should be able to install and play the game. No end-of-life time is reasonable.

Just my 2c
You know infinity is really long. I doubt anyone can guarantee that. Also you will probably die at some point or computer technology might move on and does not provide backwards compatibility. However now they don't even guarantee a single day. In this light 5 years would seem like a great leap forward covering around 80-90% of all usage cases. So I could understand if you would ask for a longer time but outright refusing guaranteed lifetimes and rather choosing no guarantee at all.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussion (archive)New Gaming Options: Follow-up Survey(519 posts)(519 posts)
(519 posts)