It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
We (still) want to hear from you!

We recently asked you guys for feedback based on some potential games that we may be able to sign in the future. The results were pretty clear--and we will be sharing them with you all soon--but we did want to ask you a single follow-up question with an actual real-world game example. One of the games that we would like to add to our catalog is Planetary Annihilation. This is an RTS with many modern gaming features, and we figured we'd use it as our test example.

<iframe width="590" height="332" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Xpze54xgqtg" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

Planetary Annihilation is distinctive for the following:

- Multiplayer and skirmish focused gameplay; there is no story-based single-player campaign, but AI skirmish matches provide a great single player experience.
- Optional persistent online features such as scoreboards, social features, achievements, and the online multiplayer campaign - a persistent galaxy-wide war; an account with the developer's online service is required in order to use these features.
- No activation, unique codes, or third-party accounts are required for single-player play or, LAN/direct connection multiplayer.
- A unique key is required for Internet multiplayer, and an account with the developer's service is only required for the persistent online features.

Now, that you know about the game's specifics, here's our question:
Post edited April 15, 2013 by G-Doc
avatar
ShaolinsKunk: Woah there, who said anything about Steam keys?

An account with the developer's service is what's required to access their online features not Steam.
avatar
Sogi-Ya: I did; framing the question around PA is stupid, there have been plenty of other releases on gog with cd keys required for mp so that example is a non issue except as a parallel to steam's description of service.

Here is two more titles that are probably caught in the crossfire:

Bruta Legends & Shadowrun: both games have strong potential on GoG but their MP is locked up in Steam.
And Steam is well beyond the line for DRM any game the requires steam in any form has zero place on GOG.
Indeed any game that requires the installation of a 3rd party software to boot, play or install isn't remotely ok.
Any game that's multiplayer focused needs to have LAN, direct connect, hot-seat, et al to remove the dependency upon Dev servers. Any game that's story driven needs to allow full and complete play of the story without any form of registration, tracking or other DRM (Heros 3 is a good example, I've played over a thousand hours of that game in the years since it's release and I still tend to forget there's a multiplayer mode).

If a game wants to be on GOG it's developers (not the players) have to adapt to DRM not being a "feature" of their coding/creation. D3 and SC2 are great examples of what would not work. Blizz would need to fundamentally alter the way they've iterated those games, especially D3, before they money and power grab "features" aren't obstructing basic game play any longer (which is sad because I've quite enjoyed both series before Blizz got greedy).
avatar
korell: there is no single player campaign but there is a multiplayer persistent galaxy wide war campaign.
GOG wrote it really badly.

The Galactic War, aka. the "campaign", doesn't have a story. It's the singleplayer campaign, but doesn't have a story, so there is "no story-driven single-player campaign". The same campaign with the difference that AI players are replaced with live ones, still called Galactic War but now online, is referred to as "online campaign" in the text. This makes it sound like "no single-player, yes multiplayer", when it's "the campaign is single and multiplayer, but if you want to play the game on our server, you need to log in to our server".

To quote http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/659943965/planetary-annihilation-a-next-generation-rts/posts/303555 :
The Galactic War is a replayable single and multiplayer metagame. Play locally by yourself or co-op with your friends against our world class Skirmish AI’s. Or play on the live multiplayer servers and try to conquer the galaxy!

...unless there's something sinister they forgot to mention to the backers and whatnot.
avatar
Feyjoo: and those 5 days could have been spend on another classic or a new game DRM-free.
Spend 5 days now, for a possible increase in profits with little to no additional time, or ignore it and keep the current time/profit rate. Risk, investment, gamble, call it what you will, it seems worth it in my opinion.

avatar
Feyjoo: And to think DRM free was a bonus?
There are games I want to play now. Those games I will buy from whoever is selling them. Last 2 times those were XCOM:EU and Brutal Legend, which I pre-ordered and played at once. Same holds true for Assassin's Creed 2 and Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood. Those were games I wanted to play, and when the price was right (for me) I bought them. If I could grab them somewhere else DRM-free, I would have gotten them there (especially since AC:B and AC2 can be played offline without any trouble). Thus, DRM-free is a bonus for me, but not a necessity.

Every man has a set of principles, and a point for which he will disregard them. I salute the person who says "These are my principles, and I won't break them for any reason". I also pity that person for not being able to adapt if needed. I won't tell you to buy a game with what you consider DRM, and I do hope you will eventually get to play that game.

And as I said before, my definition of DRM-free is that I can play single and LAN without needing to ask permission from a 3rd party. What is your definition of DRM-free, that you consider mandatory?
avatar
korell: there is no single player campaign but there is a multiplayer persistent galaxy wide war campaign.
avatar
JMich: The persistent galaxy wide thingy can also be played in single player, though obviously you are the one saving it. 2 posts here already mentioned it, and linked to the Kickstarter update mentioning it. Can dig it up if you want me to.
I based my answer purely on GOG's description, I didn't go researching the game. The way GOG described it was no single player campaign, but there are AI skirmishes. It only mentioned the persistent galaxy wide war against the optional features for online multiplayer.

So, to the way GOG described the features, my answer is no. If GOG didn't represent the game accurately, well, I can't help that.
avatar
Feyjoo: I know what you mean by not having a campaign but we are not in those times anymore in other words there is no limit to what they can do to the game. I just see the SP on this game as a poor effort unless the AI is smarter than your average RTS player and it has plenty of maps to not bore me.
Speak for yourself, I still live in that world.

And there are other people like me out there, because FTL was a success and it's like that.

Having only campaign mode means I get to play through the game an handful of times at best.

Having a flexible skirmish mode on randomly generated maps means infinite re-playability.

Flexible skirmish > Campaign mode, unless it's an RPG, a game based on a well established film(s) which begs for a story or a game carefully crafted to have a truly engrossing storyline and well thought of maps and pre-scripted events.

The campaign in a lot of games is lame. They might as well not have one. In some, it was so bad that I stopped playing the campaign and went straight to skirmish.
Post edited April 15, 2013 by Magnitus
As long as its clearly stated on the game's page that an account on a third-party site and a product key are required to access certain online features, I don't have a problem with it.
high rated
Planetary Annihilation lets you run your own servers

“The difference between our official servers and end-user servers is how we set them up. [For] end-user servers, you’ll see individuals who just want to run their own games with friends, you’ll see clans, you’ll see mod servers and different kinds of gameplay,” said Mavor.

Even if you don’t have access to your own personal server, you can still play private matches on Uber’s hardware; although, you will be restricted to Uber’s rules and current game limitations.
avatar
Feyjoo: and those 5 days could have been spend on another classic or a new game DRM-free.
avatar
JMich: Spend 5 days now, for a possible increase in profits with little to no additional time, or ignore it and keep the current time/profit rate. Risk, investment, gamble, call it what you will, it seems worth it in my opinion.

avatar
Feyjoo: And to think DRM free was a bonus?
avatar
JMich: There are games I want to play now. Those games I will buy from whoever is selling them. Last 2 times those were XCOM:EU and Brutal Legend, which I pre-ordered and played at once. Same holds true for Assassin's Creed 2 and Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood. Those were games I wanted to play, and when the price was right (for me) I bought them. If I could grab them somewhere else DRM-free, I would have gotten them there (especially since AC:B and AC2 can be played offline without any trouble). Thus, DRM-free is a bonus for me, but not a necessity.

Every man has a set of principles, and a point for which he will disregard them. I salute the person who says "These are my principles, and I won't break them for any reason". I also pity that person for not being able to adapt if needed. I won't tell you to buy a game with what you consider DRM, and I do hope you will eventually get to play that game.

And as I said before, my definition of DRM-free is that I can play single and LAN without needing to ask permission from a 3rd party. What is your definition of DRM-free, that you consider mandatory?
Not been able to adapt? what are you talking about.

Anyways before you go attacking me again I'm reading about this galactic war and if it does have singleplayer replay value on it then yes it has a spot on GOG in my opinion.

And before you go saying your opinion on other people I have my own opinion and principle when I buy a game and no matter what you say or any other person if I consider to be a bad deal I won't buy no matter how much I want to play it. Diablo fan here and I have never played D3 even though I watch the first trailer that was 22 minutes long I beleive once a day. That was before the barbarian had rage and used mana.

And for your last question DRM free for me means that If I buy the product I will get the full product without any kind of DRM.
avatar
Asbeau: The DRM-free aspect of GOG has never been a big attraction for me, I like you guys because of your awesome catalogue and your conscientious attitude to your customers, and because you've always made me feel like I'm buying from hardcore gamers rather than some businessmen that don't care about the quality of their products.

Bring it on, the game looks great!
I agree with almost everything here, except I cannot fathom how having DRM is remotely comparable with being conscientious or caring about the quality of products on offer. DRM by it's very nature is onerous to customers and hobbling to products, it is by design created to limit the playability of games and that's assuming that somehow it's working 100% correctly without introducing any bugs, compatibility issues or recurring barriers to game play.

Perhaps I am alone in this but in my perception use of DRM flagrantly demonstrates a lack of both respect/regard for customers and for the art/quality of the games themselves. DRM, like engineering an item for "planned obsolescence" is an act of puerile greed.
avatar
Feyjoo: I know what you mean by not having a campaign but we are not in those times anymore in other words there is no limit to what they can do to the game. I just see the SP on this game as a poor effort unless the AI is smarter than your average RTS player and it has plenty of maps to not bore me.
avatar
Magnitus: Speak for yourself, I still live in that world.

And there are other people like me out there, because FTL was a success and it's like that.

Having only campaign mode means I get to play through the game an handful of times at best.

Having a flexible skirmish mode on randomly generated maps means infinite re-playability.

Flexible skirmish > Campaign mode, unless it's an RPG, a game based on a well established film(s) which begs for a story or a game carefully crafted to have a truly engrossing storyline and well thought of maps and pre-scripted events.

The campaign in a lot of games is lame. They might as well not have one. In some, it was so bad that I stopped playing the campaign and went straight to skirmish.
I hope FTL you don;t mean faster than light, because if you are that game is all one campaign, replay value comes from the roguelike style of randomized events. I have FTL BTW
I see in the forum's there's been additional clarification on gog's text. For anyone who cares, I only knew of gog's text and here was my response:

"A key, an account with the developer, (and the developer's servers?) are seemingly needed for the "persistent galaxy-wide war" which seems a primarily important part of the product. I vote no, if something like this makes it to GOG, there at least must be extremely visible and unmissable notices on its gamecard. A notice such as red text or even another confirmation step in the checkout process when such an item is in the order."
avatar
korell: there is no single player campaign but there is a multiplayer persistent galaxy wide war campaign.
avatar
JMich: The persistent galaxy wide thingy can also be played in single player, though obviously you are the one saving it. 2 posts here already mentioned it, and linked to the Kickstarter update mentioning it. Can dig it up if you want me to.
Well damn, I didn't know that. If it has some replay like that for single player, then I might change my answer if the survey allows me to.
avatar
Feyjoo: I hope FTL you don;t mean faster than light, because if you are that game is all one campaign, replay value comes from the roguelike style of randomized events. I have FTL BTW
FTL doesn't really have a campaign.

There is no predefined series of dots leading from the beginning to the end.

The only constant in an FLT game is encountering and defeating the final boss. That's 2 dots (the beginning and the end).

All other encounters in the game fluctuate quite a bit.

In that respect, it has much more in common with older games like Master of Orion (where the only constant is having to defeat all your opponents) then the carefully orchestrated campaign mode found in most modern games.
Post edited April 15, 2013 by Magnitus
avatar
iippo: Its Planetary Annihilation - the new coming of Total Annihilation and Supreme Commander!
Nah, didn't look like it. Maybe the second coming of SupCom2 judging by the video, but then I don't really need the second coming of that piece... The game did seem to have some interesting aspects though. It just looked too click-festy to me.

On the topic, I voted yes. It was because I understood that all gameplay was basically available without accounts or DRM. Only the persistent-universe multiplayer conquest seemed suspect. If they provide the server-side requirements, then that's not an issue either.
avatar
korell: I had to go with no myself. Sure, the whole third party account thing is optional, but then if you choose not to take that option you end up with a limited game - there is no single player campaign but there is a multiplayer persistent galaxy wide war campaign.

I see some have mentioned activation keys in comments to games already here on GOG, but my understanding is that they are just unique keys to prove you have a legitimately purchased game and that they don't bind to any accounts or machines or anything like that. Please let me know of any games here on GOG if this isn't the case for them.
But this game focus is MP. If you, as me, don´t aprecciate that, simply don´t buy it. The problem that matter is: If the game had a solid SP campaing, that will suffer from online must to play? If yes, there´s a problem. If no, which fits the case, what to worry?