Uh... *eyes Lou with the same look a Crusader would have given someone telling him to strip off his armor before battle*

avast! is prett good about avoiding false positives, but some products are better.

Try F-Secure or Microsoft Security Essentials as anti-virus products with the lowest false-positives. (Information from www.av-comparatives.org).

I've always hated false positives in Anti-virus products (one of the reasons I won't use McAfee anymore), as it makes me not trust the software, and then it is practically useless. :-(

I like those with NPC better. I love (good) story more than munchkins tip top killing machines without back story and own opinions.

So, I see a "genre" difference between own and npc party, same as between RPGs and Dungeons.

Yes, alot of great titles mentioned. Too bad I can count them on my hands and still have fingers left over, lol. Which M&M are you taling about? That series seemed more a tactical beast judging from the ones I've played. Running stacks of various creatures (albeit handpicked) doesn't exactly equate to what I'm talking about...
M&M-Dark Messiah excluded, but I would definately reccomend that one to anybody that liked Arx Fatalis. Anyway, DM certainly didnt have you creating a party either.

I am glad to see the name-droppin' in the thread tho. Most games that were mentioned were fine examples of what im talking about: Icewind Dale, etc...
I was particularly happy about being reminded of Wizardry too. I also have played some of Spiderweb's games. Avernum6 was a great game, closest I've come to getting the vibe recently. However, I think Geneforge was just one toon to start, and both series were somewhat limited in the customization aspect. Wiz8 was much the same, I dont think you ever saw your toons did you? Great stuff tho, Raccoon Fighter FTW!
Also, I never intentionally implied that one method of CRPGs was better than the other. I like both the whole party creation and I dig the lone wanderer picking up NPC friends along the way. My point was that the former seems to have dissapeared. Wiz8 and ToEE were a while back now. Those are the most recent I remember, so I'm glad you posted a link to that inde title; If anyone has any other "head's up" links on any titles using party creation that are more recently created please post 'em.
...and for the guy that gave up on ToEE because of software conflicts:
1) get all the patches/mods you want for ToEE then unplug your intenet, you do not need to be online to play; ubisoft had nothing to do with this game.
2) uninstall every single program that doesnt like ToEE, keeps it from running, or mocks it about the brothel, the kids, or any other of it's shortcomings.
3) Play ToEE
4)reinstall all the crap that kept you from that gamin goodness to begin with and plug in the intrawebz again. that should work, and your computer will be unharmed by the process.

Never played the later M&M games, but in M&M1, you have to create your own party IIRC.

Don't you confuse the M&M games with Heroes of Might and Magic? In the latter, you indeed use stacks to defeat your enemies; in the former, you play as a group of adventurers.

Oh, I see my source of confusion. I'm mixing up the M&Ms. Heroes of M&M is what i was thinking of. appologies.

edit: also, kudos to DrIstvaan, for being quick. I see M&M 1-6 are on GoG, I do remember some of them i think... where's 7-9? oh, I see who accuired 3DO, lol, nm.

Realms of Arkania let you create your own party too. All 3 games are available here and at least the 3rd one is a great game.

It may be worth mentioning, too, that the RoA series are considered fairly hardcore in that you have to make sure your characters eat, drink, and sleep with the proper covering. I enjoy the games, but be prepared for some character micro-management if you play them.

I haven't played Arkania myself, but I thought this article from Hardcore Gaming 101 was a good review to let people know what they'd be getting into:

http://www.hardcoregaming101.net/arkania/arkania.htm