no. piracy leads to escalation and more intrusive DRM. the only way to stop DRM is to ignore completely all games with DRM.

The upshot of videogames staying "underground" was that they had a much better chance of maintaining a culture of preservation and ownership. There was reverence and respect for the craft that from what I see is lacking nowadays. My theory is that the mainstream audiences don't have the same kind of view and that gaming is more a disposable product to them, hence the current (grim) era of gaming.

You mentioned several quality games, the crown jewels of which I would say are The Witcher 3 and Fallout: New Vegas (my #1 game all time). I find it interesting, though, that those 2 games I mentioned most closely resemble the massive, complete experiences that were an appeal of gaming prior to gaming going mainstream. I am very thankful we have these games. That said, my view is that there would be more - not less - of them if gaming stayed underground.

Please consider that the bigger gaming gets, the bigger the trend-jumping gets. Look at the rush there was to have Call of Duty clones...now it is battle royale games. Look at all the games that "had" to become MMOs to cash in on World of Warcraft's popularity. The point I am making with this is that all the resources that went towards making games with "mainstream appeal" could've instead went toward more artful and much deeper, complex experiences.

The main reason that certain niches are making a small comeback now is due to the relative ease of indie development compared to the past. It is easier to make games and also easier to get funding for it. But by and large the "mainstream" companies are not funding classic projects and when they do, it is to put out a subpar (imo) product banking on name recognition (Konami pachinko machines, Dungeon Keeper reboot from what I have heard).

Since the main observable reason for certain niches and artful games coming back is due to the greater possibility of developing games independently with more freedom away from major publishers/development studios, it seems to indicate that even without gaming going mainstream, the same type of phenomenon could have hypothetically occurred...with less cash-ins, less anti-consumer practices, and more art.

I will also add that had gaming stayed underground and retail, or at least with many different outlets to purchase games, a DRM monopoly over nearly the entire market could not have occurred.

There was DRM very early on. And the very first video games sold were console games.
So, you are talking almost exclusively about big RPGs. It's fine that you love them, but they are hardly indicative of the production of quality games on the whole.

If gaming stayed "underground" as you put it, where do you think development money for a game like Witcher 3 would come from?

I'll point out that "underground" only ever applied to crpgs. Space Invaders was as mainstream as it gets - 1978 or 79. Pac Man the next year. And those games didn't even need DRM in the form of software - YOU ACTUALLY RENTED TIME TO PLAY THE MACHINES.

That money never would have gone toward your pet favorites.

Exactly my point! A game like Hollow Knight gets made today. Would not have been made pre-2000. Or, maybe one game like Hollow Kinght would have been made, but not the dozens upon dozens per year that we have now.
What actually happened in the early days was that in 1981 the gaming industry had become so money hungry and trend jumping and mainstream and full of crappy products that the entire industry crashed.

If you restrict your discussion to crpgs and ignore arcade gaming and console gaming all the way up through the early 90s, then I can see how you might think that staying underground might have helped the industry. But, if that had happened, we would not have games like New Vegas and Withcer 3, we would have games like Wizardry VII (Oh, we do, like Grimoire) and ADOM (Oh, we do, like Tales of M'Jayal) or The Bard's Tale (Oh, we do, like the new Bard's Tale), or like Ultima VlI (OK, maybe we don't have anything quite like Ultima VII, but we sure as hell have Dwarf Fortress).

My point is, we still have as many (or even more, as I contend) games of quality for whatever your favorite niche is than we ever had in the glory days (whenever you want to set them). The only price you have to pay is that there is also a lot more crap, and a lot more mainstream hype and empty spectacle, etc. Just avoid that stuff and get the good games. There are enough great games put out every year nowadays to keep you playing nonstop.

And as for your DRM nonsense, there was no glord days of the virtue of ownership. DRM caught on early and spread like wildfilre. It's only now that there is a bona fide movement against it. And I maintain that it is a good movement but will always be about providing a niche alternative. It will never become the industry wide norm.

Cheers.

I feel like we will agree to disagree but I wanted to say I appreciate your reply. As for DRM, I am aware it was around in the past but not to the intrusive degree it is now.

To borrow your analogy, mainstream gaming appears headed back to the "you pay the arcade machine to rent a playthrough" days, only worse. You could at least eventually purchase arcade machines, they weren't in "the cloud" :)

rjbuffchix got it: games made for the lowest common denominator which is the trend since many years now.
To my eyes the difference between the games I grew up as a gamer with and what's available today is so big that there's even no point in trying to discuss the matter.
But apparently someone is happy with today's incredible quality games and for their pleasure they are going to get even more of that.

there escalting DRM without everyone pirating, the thing is microsofts next xbox console is apparently cloud only gaming which makes you have to buy online marketplace prices,basically kills any gameshops left who trade still, and no lending games to friends. anyways aslong as companys are allowed to do it they will just ocme up with newer ways to fuck over the playerbase. u got 3 choices, be part of the DRM disease, pirate games or wait until they release DRM free here but dnt hold your breath GOG are just a weeb and indie company now. last well known game i saw release was darksiders 3