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I'm having a weird problem with all DOSBox games that use the arrow keys and left Alt
by default. Say for example I'm playing a racing game such as Screamer. If I'm holding 'up' to accelerate and left to er, turn left (sounds like a modern tutorial :P), if I then press Left Alt to shift gear, Left Alt does not register as long as the up and left arrow keys are simultaneously depressed. Anybody got any idea what might be causing this?

*edit* D'oh! Sorry about the topic title. Don't know what happened there. Of course, I meant DOSBox.
Post edited June 02, 2015 by RetroCodger426
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Isn't there a weird menu command with alt+arrows (like the alt+enter I believe). The fact that it does nothing as far as I understand makes me doubt.
Strange, used to be that keyboards couldn't handle it but that's a long time ago.
If you're using a non-standard keyboard, you could try using KEYB to set the keyboard to the UK layout for example.
When you say arrow keys BTW, you don't mean the numpad right?
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Potzato: Isn't there a weird menu command with alt+arrows (like the alt+enter I believe). The fact that it does nothing as far as I understand makes me doubt.
If you mean in DOSBox, no, at least not as far as I'm aware. Those three keys also don't seem to function as a command outside of games, i.e. general PC use, either.
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Smannesman: Strange, used to be that keyboards couldn't handle it but that's a long time ago.
If you're using a non-standard keyboard, you could try using KEYB to set the keyboard to the UK layout for example. When you say arrow keys BTW, you don't mean the numpad right?
Thanks for the link. I'll be sure to have a look at that. My Keyboard language is set to UK English already. I'm assuming KEYB might change how the game/DOSBox 'sees' the keyboard?

To answer your question Smannesman, yes I mean the arrow keys and not the numpad. The numpad works fine with Alt.

The keyboard I've been using is a Dell one with (I don't know the scientific term) "one with slightly risen up keys, but not as sticky-up-y as the old "clicky" ones of yore :D. It's just a standard generic keyboard that came with a new PC in 2012.

So anyway, I've just dug out an older standard Dell keyboard from 2006. I believe the proper term for this kind is: Chunky, clicky keyboard with proper man-buttons that go "KA-Chunk!" when pressed. Bizarrely, the Alt+left & right arrow key-problem is no more. So I suppose it was the keyboard to blame. Still a mystery why that is :/
Post edited June 03, 2015 by RetroCodger426
A problem with Scroll Lock? Once enabled oce disabled?
It's due to poor [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rollover_(key)]key rollover[/url], which is a measurement of the number of keys that can be depressed simultaneously while still being registered correctly.

*Most* keyboards only have 2-key rollover (2KRO), meaning that if you press more than 2 keys at the same time, you are not guaranteed that all will be reported. This has to do with the way keyboards are constructed; there's an underlying grid of detectors (the key matrix) looking for key presses, and some combinations cause interference in this grid, making it look like an extra key is being pressed even when it isn't. Keyboards contain circuitry to detect this situation, but since they can't know which keypress is "fake", they also need to filter out the key you *actually* pressed down last (the third key if we're dealing with a 2KRO situation).

It is common for many combinations of more keys to work even with a 2KRO keyboard, but there will be *some* combinations that don't work, and those combinations vary between keyboard models.

Keyboards with higher KRO values tend to fairly expensive. Price, however, is not a guarantee of high key rollover; even within gaming keyboards there are quite a few 2KRO keyboards (such as the Logitech G510 I'm using).

The best option is NKRO (n-key rollover, meaning no limit) keyboard, but if you're connecting your keyboard via USB, the HID keyboard standard imposes a limit of 6KRO, so that tends to be the practical limit these days (without specialized drivers or other trickery).
Post edited June 03, 2015 by Pidgeot
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hohiro: A problem with Scroll Lock? Once enabled oce disabled?
It's funny you should mention that. I was just examining the problem keyboard and noticed again what I'd forgotten: that there doesn't seem to be a Scroll Lock key.

The keyboard that works for me with Screamer does have a Scroll Lock key. I think you might be onto something there; Scroll Lock is not something I ever use but given it alters the behaviour of the arrow keys, I bet that's what is causing the problem. On the keyboard that works, scroll lock is set to 'off' btw. Hmm maybe there's a keyboard shortcut I can use to toggle Scroll Lock on the Keyboard with the arrows+Alt fault.
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RetroCodger426: It's funny you should mention that. I was just examining the problem keyboard and noticed again what I'd forgotten: that there doesn't seem to be a Scroll Lock key.

The keyboard that works for me with Screamer does have a Scroll Lock key. I think you might be onto something there; Scroll Lock is not something I ever use but given it alters the behaviour of the arrow keys, I bet that's what is causing the problem. On the keyboard that works, scroll lock is set to 'off' btw. Hmm maybe there's a keyboard shortcut I can use to toggle Scroll Lock on the Keyboard with the arrows+Alt fault.
You can try the on screen keyboard to toggle scroll lock and then close it to use the normal one ;)... don`t know where to find it in english windows though, so my translation might be a bit off: its under all programs -> accessoirs and "easy usage" or something the like ...
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Pidgeot: It's due to poor [url=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rollover_(key)]key rollover[/url], which is a measurement of the number of keys that can be depressed simultaneously while still being registered correctly.

*Most* keyboards only have 2-key rollover (2KRO), meaning that if you press more than 2 keys at the same time, you are not guaranteed that all will be reported. It is common for many 3- or 4-key combinations (possibly more) to work even with a 2KRO keyboard, but there will be *some* combinations that don't work, and those combinations vary between keyboard models.

Keyboards with higher KRO values tend to fairly expensive. Price, however, is not a guarantee of high key rollover; even within gaming keyboards there are quite a few 2KRO keyboards (such as the Logitech G510 I'm using).

The best option is NKRO (n-key rollover, meaning no limit) keyboard, but if you're connecting your keyboard via USB, that imposes a limit of 6KRO without specialized drivers or other trickery, so that tends to be the practical limit these days.
Thanks. That makes sense also. I did wonder if it was that the keyboard couldn't handle 3 inputs at once and so would ignore the third. What threw me was the fact that eg. up, right (as opposed to the left arrow) and ALT could all function at once. Sounds like if it's not to do with Scroll Lock, it must be a "Two-Key Rollover" keyboard. Either way, seems to be a crap keyboard.
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RetroCodger426: It's funny you should mention that. I was just examining the problem keyboard and noticed again what I'd forgotten: that there doesn't seem to be a Scroll Lock key.

The keyboard that works for me with Screamer does have a Scroll Lock key. I think you might be onto something there; Scroll Lock is not something I ever use but given it alters the behaviour of the arrow keys, I bet that's what is causing the problem. On the keyboard that works, scroll lock is set to 'off' btw. Hmm maybe there's a keyboard shortcut I can use to toggle Scroll Lock on the Keyboard with the arrows+Alt fault.
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hohiro: You can try the on screen keyboard to toggle scroll lock and then close it to use the normal one ;)... don`t know where to find it in english windows though, so my translation might be a bit off: its under all programs -> accessoirs and "easy usage" or something the like ...
Thanks, I will try that :)
Post edited June 03, 2015 by RetroCodger426
I've tried the On-screen keyboard, toggled Scroll Lock on and off whilst playing Screamer. It made no difference; the problem remained. Thanks guys, all good advice that helped me eliminate the cause. It seems it is probably the poor key rollover. A pint of beer goes to Pidgeot (sorry Potzato, Smannesman and hohiro). Nah, just kidding, beer for all! :)
Now buy me a good gaming keyboard! ;)
Post edited June 03, 2015 by RetroCodger426
The problem is that you're holding down the acceleration key while shifting. Eventually you're going to screw up the gearbox unless you learn to rev-match. Full-throttle clutch-dumps are hard on the transmission. ; )
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RetroCodger426: I've tried the On-screen keyboard, toggled Scroll Lock on and off whilst playing Screamer. It made no difference; the problem remained. Thanks guys, all good advice that helped me eliminate the cause. It seems it is probably the poor key rollover. A pint of beer goes to Pidgeot (sorry Potzato, Smannesman and hohiro). Nah, just kidding, beer for all! :)
Now buy me a good gaming keyboard! ;)
Look for keyboards with "n-key rollover" as an advertised feature, they are supposed to be able to handle the whole keyboard pressed at the same time and still register each individual key (not that you'll likely need that many, but it guarantees that you won't be limited by the keyboard). "6-key rollover" ones are probably more common, and might be enough for you, but quick typists may still be able to hit the keys fast enough that they manage to hit the keyboards upper limit of "simultaneous" key presses.
You can try to change the key binding for ALT with DOSbox's built-in key mapper. Just press CTRL+F1 while the game is running. Then, select the "event" you want to re-bind, click on "Add" and hit the new key you'd like to use.
I just checked (via the game Wacky Wheels), and my keyboard has the same issues with those kinds of combinations, so I simply used "X" instead of "ALT", which seemed to do the trick.
Post edited June 04, 2015 by InfraSuperman
All good advice guys, thankyou!