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greeklover: Anyone can give an opinion, are the dlcs a must for Pathfinder Kingmaker?
I enjoyed the Varnhold's lot mini campaign, and the endless dungeon is cool but I have not played it much.
Post edited January 17, 2020 by RPGFanboy
Off-topic but related: on a series of games that was also inspired by BG: Anything to say about Dragon Age: Origins? IMHO, great beginning(s), a setting that was original enough, a combat system that was interesting (they wanted to make something original there) but after the first great battle, once you hit the road it started to feel repetitive (for this player, at least). Also, the beginning was so great that afterwards, when there is less depth to the character building (as the beginning is where almost everything is an opportunity to build the personality of your main character), it felt a bit lacking. Never played the sequel nor finished the game, but who knows, maybe one day.
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Carradice: Off-topic but related: on a series of games that was also inspired by BG: Anything to say about Dragon Age: Origins? IMHO, great beginning(s), a setting that was original enough, a combat system that was interesting (they wanted to make something original there) but after the first great battle, once you hit the road it started to feel repetitive (for this player, at least). Also, the beginning was so great that afterwards, when there is less depth to the character building (as the beginning is where almost everything is an opportunity to build the personality of your main character), it felt a bit lacking. Never played the sequel nor finished the game, but who knows, maybe one day.
I didn't enjoy the combat because I wanted to play a thief with sneak attack without using automatic moves and I found it very difficult to control him in battle and positioning him in the right place. It took me so much time that I couldn't give directions to my other characters and I just had them on auto. I prefer games where it is easier to control the full party.
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Carradice: Off-topic but related: on a series of games that was also inspired by BG: Anything to say about Dragon Age: Origins? IMHO, great beginning(s), a setting that was original enough, a combat system that was interesting (they wanted to make something original there) but after the first great battle, once you hit the road it started to feel repetitive (for this player, at least). Also, the beginning was so great that afterwards, when there is less depth to the character building (as the beginning is where almost everything is an opportunity to build the personality of your main character), it felt a bit lacking. Never played the sequel nor finished the game, but who knows, maybe one day.
DA Origins is great. And it can be played with a single character. Hence one of the issues above with not being able to place pawns, becomes irrelevant. I would really love to see more content for that game, did feel a bit linear, once you played it it’s all done, no real secrets. But really good.
Avoid the sequel like the plague though. It has a couple of areas, cut and paste over and over, no real depth or story, enemies pop into existence. Nothing good to say about it.
Inquisition is better, but it is a single player mmo rather than a crafted RPG.
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Carradice: Off-topic but related: on a series of games that was also inspired by BG: Anything to say about Dragon Age: Origins? IMHO, great beginning(s), a setting that was original enough, a combat system that was interesting (they wanted to make something original there) but after the first great battle, once you hit the road it started to feel repetitive (for this player, at least). Also, the beginning was so great that afterwards, when there is less depth to the character building (as the beginning is where almost everything is an opportunity to build the personality of your main character), it felt a bit lacking. Never played the sequel nor finished the game, but who knows, maybe one day.
I'll echo exactly what nightcrawler said. DA:O is great (I actually played through this one several times with different character classes).

DA2 sucked. Badly. It's the last game I ever pre-ordered from any company other than CDPR, and I finished it only to see how the story played out. A terrible disappointment (and up to then I was a big fan of BioWare games). By the time I was done, playing it actually seemed like a chore. I often replay games I like. I'll never play this one again.

DA:I is (IMO) far better than DA2, but far inferior to the first. Single player MMO describes it perfectly. There are some decent characters in the game, and there's actually an OK story there, but it's wrapped in a lot of MMO style kill/fetch quests that really more detract from the game than anything else. Not a terrible game, but I doubt I'll ever play this one again either.
I actually enjoyed DA2! It was a fun action/adventure with nice story and lore, but a failure of an RPG. I find it somewhat comparable to Mass Effect 1. (at least in DA2 you can control your party members)
What annoyed me the most: recycling of environments (indoors) and too much "loot".

But on topic: both Pillars and Pathfinder are still waiting in my backlog. I have some old Bioware games that I still want to play first (Icewind Dale I/II, NWN 1/2, and Jade Empire).

edit: and Arx Fatalis, Arcanum, Gothic, Temple of Elemental Evil, ... I'll stop here :-(
Post edited January 17, 2020 by teceem
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teceem: I actually enjoyed DA2! It was a fun action/adventure with nice story and lore, but a failure of an RPG. I find it somewhat comparable to Mass Effect 1. (at least in DA2 you can control your party members)
What annoyed me the most: recycling of environments (indoors) and too much "loot".
I'm honestly glad you enjoyed it. I had a lot of issues with the story, and the recycled areas. And the situations where you're trapped in a room and can't leave and the enemies literally drop from the ceiling (or the sky)... I couldn't get past that. I did like a couple of the characters, but overall I really disliked the game.
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MikeMaximus: The DLCs are well done, but I don't think you need any of them to have a great experience with the base game.

If I had to pick one, i'd say "The Wildcards" since it adds a class and companion.
And Tiefling race.
I like to think of myself as the Goldilocks of RPG writing. *Tries Pillars* This RPG is too dry. *Tries DOS:2* This RPG is too silly. *Tries Pathfinder* This RPG is jussssst right. Pathfinder is the closest to Baldur's Gate in terms of tone.
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markrichardb: I like to think of myself as the Goldilocks of RPG writing. *Tries Pillars* This RPG is too dry. *Tries DOS:2* This RPG is too silly. *Tries Pathfinder* This RPG is jussssst right. Pathfinder is the closest to Baldur's Gate in terms of tone.
Yeah, but the silliest one still has the best gameplay out of three, am I wrong?
Personally, like the Kingmaker most of the three mentioned, but it ain't revolutionary like D:OS and it lacks its interaction with the environment.
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Mafwek: Yeah, but the silliest one still has the best gameplay out of three, am I wrong?
Personally, like the Kingmaker most of the three mentioned, but it ain't revolutionary like D:OS and it lacks its interaction with the environment.
Yeah I think Divinity Original Sin 1 & 2 are still the best when it comes to just pure fun wth the combat gameplay.

Thanks for adding that "The Wilcards" DLC adds the Tiefling race to Pathfinder as well, slipped my mind.
I tried POE 1 the other month and I didn't like the RTWP gameplay at all, which is a huge step backwards from the excellent TBS gameplay of DOS 1 (although I also don't like DOS 2 because it greatly dumbed-down the gameplay from DOS 1 and also DOS 2 added a terrible new "armor" mechanic which completely wrecks the game IMO).

I also tried Planescape: Torment the other month, and the RTWP gameplay in that was awful too.

I've never played Pathfinder, but I'm confident that since it uses RTWP, it's gameplay must surely be awful, just like the gameplay is awful in all other games that also use RTWP.
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Ancient-Red-Dragon: I tried POE 1 the other month and I didn't like the RTWP gameplay at all, which is a huge step backwards from the excellent TBS gameplay of DOS 1 (although I also don't like DOS 2 because it greatly dumbed-down the gameplay from DOS 1 and also DOS 2 added a terrible new "armor" mechanic which completely wrecks the game IMO).

I also tried Planescape: Torment the other month, and the RTWP gameplay in that was awful too.

I've never played Pathfinder, but I'm confident that since it uses RTWP, it's gameplay must surely be awful, just like the gameplay is awful in all other games that also use RTWP.
So you never played RTWP games until recently? (just asking, no judgement)
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Ancient-Red-Dragon: I tried POE 1 the other month and I didn't like the RTWP gameplay at all, which is a huge step backwards from the excellent TBS gameplay of DOS 1 (although I also don't like DOS 2 because it greatly dumbed-down the gameplay from DOS 1 and also DOS 2 added a terrible new "armor" mechanic which completely wrecks the game IMO).

I also tried Planescape: Torment the other month, and the RTWP gameplay in that was awful too.

I've never played Pathfinder, but I'm confident that since it uses RTWP, it's gameplay must surely be awful, just like the gameplay is awful in all other games that also use RTWP.
Playing Planescape: Torment for combat is like playing Doom for intelligent dialogue and peaceful solutions - completely missing the point of the game. Not going to judge you for not liking the game (or its awful combat), but I fail to follow the logic of your statement.

Especially considering OP specifically mentions that he liked Baldur's Gate 2, which does have RTWP combat, and of all mentioned games, most similar to Pathfinder: Kingmaker. Oh, and Planescape: Torment probably has "the best" gameplay of all mentioned games, however, it's not a combat part of the gameplay that makes it so.