It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
avatar
KasperHviid: snip
avatar
MaximumBunny: A gorilla that didn't do anything, or a bunch of uncivilized barbarian migrants that only cause trouble in any country they inhabit? I think the news picked the right topic. Of course their deaths aren't important. Several people were spared from being attacked, murdered, robbed, raped, etc.

"But that's racist and heartless and bigoted and <a bunch of other silly names I can think of to try to make your FACTS irrelevant>" - You're welcome to accept them into your home and take care of them. Voting them in to become other people's neighbors and not yours is the only reason you're still supporting the notion. There's a massive difference between providing opportunity and making them someone's responsibility, and you have to account for whether or not the horse you lead to water will drink it. Literally 6% of them want a new life and the rest just want free handouts and privileges from socialist policies. Any immigration that doesn't help will become a burden.

"But but...human lives matter and you're just being an asshole. Didn't you see the pictures of that 1 kid and 1 mother?" - Unfortunate deaths of people crossing into territories that didn't want them (people > government policies), sure. Tragic. But if you have a friend who's a slob and has a dirty car you're not going to let them borrow your shiny new one. If you have people who've trashed their countries, economies, and governments then why would you want them in your country too expecting them to be different? Common sense always goes out the window when people try to guiltbait you into all of these misguided agendas.
I completely agree with MaximumBunny. Very logical analysis of the current refugee problems.

Too bad big businesses support refugees and illegal immigration because they want cheap labor.
avatar
Gede: What are those American values? Don't they include tolerance, acceptance and freedom?
Yup, and it works both ways. For example, raping women for not dressing under sharia rules because they're intolerant of western values. It's not "we'll tolerate you while you make demands of us and don't integrate" like they're doing in Europe. They need to give up their Middle Eastern ideologies that conflict with ours. I've spoken with seemingly nice people in those countries who still have no problems with homosexuals being executed because "I hate it. It's disgusting.". This mindset is not tolerable at all and those people are not welcomed here.

avatar
Gede: I suppose that you were lucky. You never went to sleep hungry, you never had to sleep on the street, you never felt your life was in real danger. I am glad this was so. However, it is not easy to understand what other people have to endure just to make it to the following day alive.
I'm sure you're the expert on my life and what I understand and don't understand if you can make statements like this one with confidence.

avatar
Zjeraar: In short, I don't believe the 94% is grounded in reality if the article or the report the journalist used is taken as its origin.
I certainly hope it isn't. Also:

avatar
Zjeraar: Thirdly, the 91,4%, nor the other percentages mentioned in the article, don't exclude refugees that hold a job (or are studying!) at the same time
Does the studying part include the these students? http://dailycaller.com/2016/06/28/report-adult-refugees-enrolled-in-canadian-high-school-harassing-young-girls/ - As much as people try to tolerate them, they obviously need to be sent back to whatever fate their homeland has for them.
avatar
MaximumBunny: Does the studying part include the these students? http://dailycaller.com/2016/06/28/report-adult-refugees-enrolled-in-canadian-high-school-harassing-young-girls/ - As much as people try to tolerate them, they obviously need to be sent back to whatever fate their homeland has for them.
You mean these students?

Yeah, it includes them and also students like these.

When really looking into these articles it appears that these sweeping statements about (Middle-Eastern) refugees being freeloaders or savages don't hold true.

Yet you continue to make them.

avatar
MaximumBunny: I've spoken with seemingly nice people in those countries who still have no problems with homosexuals being executed because "I hate it. It's disgusting.". This mindset is not tolerable at all and those people are not welcomed here.
You know this mindset is shared by some (more or less prominent) Americans as well, right?

Edit: Added link to Reddit topic.
Post edited August 21, 2016 by Zjeraar
avatar
MaximumBunny: I've spoken with seemingly nice people in those countries who still have no problems with homosexuals being executed because "I hate it. It's disgusting.". This mindset is not tolerable at all and those people are not welcomed here.
avatar
Zjeraar: You know this mindset is shared by some (more or less prominent) Americans as well, right?
But no "(more or less prominent) Americans" condone pushing them off the roofs of buildings, hanging them, or shooting them.
avatar
Zjeraar: You know this mindset is shared by some (more or less prominent) Americans as well, right?
avatar
mm324: But no "(more or less prominent) Americans" condone pushing them off the roofs of buildings, hanging them, or shooting them.
You forgot stoning them.

Look up statements made by American clerics and politicians like Scott Esk, Phillip Kayser, Larry Kilgore and Kevin Swanson just to name a few.
avatar
mm324: But no "(more or less prominent) Americans" condone pushing them off the roofs of buildings, hanging them, or shooting them.
avatar
Zjeraar: You forgot stoning them.

Look up statements made by American clerics and politicians like Scott Esk, Phillip Kayser, Larry Kilgore and Kevin Swanson just to name a few.
I wouldn't consider any of them "(more or less prominent)".
avatar
Breja: Western lowland gorilla population- maybe 100 thousand (and other kinds number only a few thousand, or less than a thousand). Conservation status- critically endangered.

Humanity- 7.4 billion and rising.

Mistery fucking solved.
And people often claim that "all minds are unique" which then undermines your logic. Also, the reason the gorilla population has declined had to do with survival of the fittest. Human beings are better at adapting to various changes while gorillas are too lacking in intelligence.

Also, animals are suppose to be a means to an end. We only care about them in order to support us in terms of food, clothing material, fertilizer, or (in some strange yet highly scientific cases) medical components but of course, even when a wild animal is killed in a licensed hunt (not related to Harambe) and the meat is inspected and given to villagers, people still bitch about it even if the animal is not listed as "endangered" but rather "least concern."

The following summarizes my thought on all this gorilla-worship as well as animal-worship in a general sense...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vNZ63iwnn5M
avatar
mm324: I wouldn't consider any of them "(more or less prominent)".
I admit I had trouble finding the right word. 'Public' perhaps is better.
avatar
mm324: I wouldn't consider any of them "(more or less prominent)".
avatar
Zjeraar: I admit I had trouble finding the right word. 'Public' perhaps is better.
I'll admit that we have our share of crazie. The difference is if they push off a roof, hang, shoot, or stone someone we don't cheer them we put them in jail.
Overall people need to remember that when the media is talking about gorillas or creating blood libel against certain groups of people like hunters (more specifically white people who go on safari hunts), there is usually another story out there they do not want you to see related to things like national debts, trade agreements (TPP with Fast Track), Islamic terrorism in Europe, Islamic terrorism in a general sense, or various scandals like the revelations from the hacked emails of the Democratic National Committee.

Last year, people cheered about the US Supreme Court decision that treats marriage licenses for gay couple like driver's licenses by making them valid in every state while ignoring how the US federal government passed the TPP with Fast Track thereby further screwing over American workers. They also bitched about the killing of the wrong lion while forgetting that lions are listed as "vulnerable" and not endangered and that the intended target was a rogue lion, one that had been exiled from its pride and tends to kill livestock and baby animals. They also ignore that normally the meat of the animal is inspected and given to villagers and that the revenues from the licenses supports anti-poaching efforts and open land preservation without starving out children in the name of "nature."

The following image kind of illustrates my point with selective outrage and covering the more important things up. It deals with CNN making the story of how Donald Trump was eating fried chicken the front and center topic and the media outlet attacking him for it while treating the story of thirty people getting slaughtered in a gas attack in the Middle East as a scroll story, the type that appears in the moving text at the bottom of the screen and is support to be reserved for smaller stories.
Attachments:
cnnbias.jpg (55 Kb)
avatar
KasperHviid: An article on Vox mentions the irony of how the story about the death of one (1) gorilla overshadows the story of a thousand dead human beings:

Harambe’s death occurred the same week in which 1,000 people died attempting to cross the Mediterranean Sea to immigrate safely into Europe. Given that the gorilla’s death largely overshadowed the conversation about actual human life, backlash to the backlash was swift to follow.
avatar
KasperHviid: However, the article itself is about the gorilla. The 1.000 dead people are only mentioned in that single line.
So what you're saying is that Gorilla Lives Matter? Wow. Racism FTW.
avatar
MaximumBunny: Yup, and it works both ways. For example, raping women for not dressing under sharia rules because they're intolerant of western values. It's not "we'll tolerate you while you make demands of us and don't integrate" like they're doing in Europe. They need to give up their Middle Eastern ideologies that conflict with ours.
I'm pretty sure that rape is not tolerated on your country for whatever reason. And it appear that it is the same way in Islam. In America, everyone should submit to American law. The same goes for discriminating against homosexuals. I've even talked with people who think Muslims should all be either converted to Christianity or executed.

I do grant you that culture will be a very tough nut to crack in the short term, that is true. People do not change their culture overnight. But the Western values do include tolerance, right? Let us try to accommodate them and not discriminate against them.
By calling them freeloaders and throwing them out to die will not help cultural integration or show any good will towards them. It will only strengthen radicalism.

avatar
Gede: I suppose that you were lucky. You never went to sleep hungry, you never had to sleep on the street, you never felt your life was in real danger. I am glad this was so. However, it is not easy to understand what other people have to endure just to make it to the following day alive.
avatar
MaximumBunny: I'm sure you're the expert on my life and what I understand and don't understand if you can make statements like this one with confidence.
I did use the word suppose. But you are right, I am no expert on you and should not assume much based on what you say. I would expect more compassion from you if you had struggled for your survival at some point.

I am sure, however, that you are not the expert on the lives of Eastern refugees, and what they understand and don't understand, if you can make statements like calling them "a bunch of uncivilized barbarian migrants that only cause trouble in any country they inhabit" and "Of course their deaths aren't important. Several people were spared from being attacked, murdered, robbed, raped, etc." with confidence.

I think that America has worse problems. If money is the problem, maybe fixing tax loopholes would help.
avatar
Gede: I am sure, however, that you are not the expert on the lives of Eastern refugees, and what they understand and don't understand, if you can make statements like calling them "a bunch of uncivilized barbarian migrants that only cause trouble in any country they inhabit" and "Of course their deaths aren't important. Several people were spared from being attacked, murdered, robbed, raped, etc." with confidence.
The thing is that both facts are true. That there are Syrian refugees that want peace and better lives, and that there are savage freeloaders causing problems. This is why both the "throw them out to fend for themselves" and "take them all in mindlessly and hope it works out" options don't work. We need a limbo to keep them in, some type of neutral zone.
avatar
Gede: I am sure, however, that you are not the expert on the lives of Eastern refugees, and what they understand and don't understand, if you can make statements like calling them "a bunch of uncivilized barbarian migrants that only cause trouble in any country they inhabit" and "Of course their deaths aren't important. Several people were spared from being attacked, murdered, robbed, raped, etc." with confidence.
avatar
MaximumBunny: The thing is that both facts are true. That there are Syrian refugees that want peace and better lives, and that there are savage freeloaders causing problems. This is why both the "throw them out to fend for themselves" and "take them all in mindlessly and hope it works out" options don't work. We need a limbo to keep them in, some type of neutral zone.
Airplanes and boats go both ways. What can be brought in can be shipped out.