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Magmarock: When people talk about how Linux is so moddable they fail to take into account that being a programmer automatically affords the ability to mod most things.
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xyem: That's because you are presuming that when they say it is "so moddable", you think they are referring to the user they are saying it to modifying it, but they're not.

Non-programmers can get it modded to their liking by doing other things like convincing a programmer to do it, paying a programmer to do it or contributing to a bounty to do it.

Just because it can be DIY, doesn't mean it has to be.
I have commissioned a programmer myself to write a patch for Dead Space 1 and Metro 2033/Last Light for Windows. Again, what's the Linux advantage?
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hummer010: First, free has two meanings when it comes to Linux. Yeah, it's free, as in, it doesn't cost money. But it's also free, as in, it has no encumbrances. I can run Linux on whatever hardware I want, and I can use whatever components I want. Don't like Firefox? Don't install it. Don't like Thunar? don't install it. Don't like systemd? No problem, you can still use init. Now, let's look at Windows - don't like Internet Explorer or Edge. Too bad. They're an integral part of the OS. Don't like Windows Explorer? Too bad. You don't have to use it, but you can't remove it. This is where Linux is truly free.

The assessment of whether or not it's "good" is too subjective. Linux is very good at certain things, but if those things don't interest you, Linux probably isn't "good" for you.
Well yeah that's what I meant. I the Linux could do a lot more to better communicate that though. That being said you can mod Windows quite a bit. Not as expensively as you can Linux but knowing how to code affords you the ability to mod quite a lot. Now you can't remove IE that much us true. However you can remove edge and winshop though it is quite complicated. Linux is highly modeable, so in that regard is has no encumbrances. I agree with you there. But it does have encumbrances in terms of functionality and compatibility. I don't think this will ever change because the more I think about it the more I think it's high modability is the reason why so few programs are made for it. There's no "vision" for Linux only a large number of people making it how they want it to be.

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dtgreene: As a programmer who actually has modified code without access to the source (albeit only a couple of times, and both times very small changes), it is *much* easier to make changes if you have access to the source code. In fact, I would say that only a small minority of programmers have the capability to modify a program without the source code. (Actually doing this requires a good debugger and knowledge of assembly language.)
I did not know that, thanks for sharing.
Post edited June 28, 2018 by Magmarock
Please, stay on topic!

The thread is called "I use Linux because:", not "I hate Linux because:" (to everyone interested in HATRED I hereby grant my permission to use my idea and create the topic with this name :D :D :D ).
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Alm888: Please, stay on topic!

The thread is called "I use Linux because:", not "I hate Linux because:" (to everyone interested in HATRED I hereby grant my permission to use my idea and create the topic with this name :D :D :D ).
Half the people this thread are talking about Apple.
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Magmarock: I have commissioned a programmer myself to write a patch for Dead Space 1 and Metro 2033/Last Light
Where do I get the source code for those?
I currently run Mac as my main desktop, but Linux on my 3 VPSs and my ancient home server. There's no alternative for a server, especially if you're self-employed and on a tight budget. You can do anything with it!

I am going to be switching to Linux as a base for my next machine though. 90% of my professional use is in Windows VMs anyway, and I can run those on top of Linux easily enough - probably more easily. Other than that, I can use Docker containers and keep my system clean.
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Magmarock: I guess I like the apk system for Android because you can easily download them from the web and back them up using tools like apk extractor. Backup deb files from the repository is a lot more work and a lot more specific to the distro making it very impractical.
Deb is designed with connected ecosystem in mind, it makes no sense for non-proprietary application to pack all its dependencies among. There will be conflicts, lost disk space and exploitation holes. For proprietary, its other thing - vv221 on this forum provides script to generate Deb from most Linux GOG installers, which result in one big Deb.

You don't need special tools to unpack Deb, its a zip archive that contains compiled code for the project, but not the shared code. But you can package everything inside single Deb, but this is going to turn ugly for the system, because there is no reliable way to manage duplicates and filename conflicts. This will end up with similar mess like WinSxS. Nix and Guix as a newer gen. tech. shine here.

Android is distribution with pretty strict ABI guidance (Windows too), if Android fork deviates from its ancestor to same extent typical Linux distributions do, software stored in Apk will start to get big runtime issues pretty quick.

I think you are Windows user with very limited Linux knowledge, I can recommend you to grow up faster. I've seen whole websites dedicated to trashing the Linux way, but they all disappeared meanwhile as people eventually grew up and started using what they are comfortable with. Its all - compromises.
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Lin545: For proprietary, its other thing - vv221 on this forum provides script to generate Deb from most Linux GOG installers, which result in one big Deb.
By the way, here is an exclusive bit of information: we made it to official Debian repositories!
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Lin545: Deb is designed with connected ecosystem in mind, it makes no sense for non-proprietary application to pack all its dependencies among. There will be conflicts, lost disk space and exploitation holes. For proprietary, its other thing - vv221 on this forum provides script to generate Deb from most Linux GOG installers, which result in one big Deb.
I'm going to throw in some words here to say that most package formats work similarly. RPM, Pacman, and so on. It's when you get into things like Snaps, Appimages, and (ugh) flatpack that things get murky.
I use Linux because...

I'm sick to death of MicroSoft's bullshit and hegemony. 8 and 10 were the final straws. I've tried several distros and a bunch of flavors of those distros. Recently been bouncing back and forth between Mint and Solus, dual booting with Win7. When 7 is no longer viable for what I want, I'll be able to easily make the transition.
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Magmarock: I have commissioned a programmer myself to write a patch for Dead Space 1 and Metro 2033/Last Light
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xyem: Where do I get the source code for those?
The code is private. I can link you to the patches but that's about it.
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Lin545: Deb is designed with connected ecosystem in mind, it makes no sense for non-proprietary application to pack all its dependencies among. There will be conflicts, lost disk space and exploitation holes. For proprietary, its other thing - vv221 on this forum provides script to generate Deb from most Linux GOG installers, which result in one big Deb.
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Darvond: I'm going to throw in some words here to say that most package formats work similarly. RPM, Pacman, and so on. It's when you get into things like Snaps, Appimages, and (ugh) flatpack that things get murky.
THANKS! I've been saying that for ages. That all package managers are pretty much the same and if you don't like that system you probably like any Linux distro.

Also you could never use appimage for games. afaik they work kind of like tiny virtual machines for apps, and wouldn't be able to draw in the performance needed to make games work.

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Lin545: I think you are Windows user with very limited Linux knowledge, I can recommend you to grow up faster. I've seen whole websites dedicated to trashing the Linux way, but they all disappeared meanwhile as people eventually grew up and started using what they are comfortable with. Its all - compromises.
I never said I was an expert that that I know how to use it. But more importantly let me ask you this. When you write comments like this is there at all a moment where you think "gee that comes off a little arrogant." Seriously where do you get off on telling me what I do and do not know followed by telling to me to grow up XD. Talk about zero self awareness

Every time criticism is thrown at Linux it's someone elses fault.

You're a noob and can't use it, It's Microsoft fault that got in first, it's the retailers they won't sell Linux computers, it's just different you just need to get used to it.

The Linux community is toxic but don't take my word for it. I'll let one of when one of your own break it down for you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV68DJ2SLyc
Post edited June 29, 2018 by Magmarock
I use Linux because:

• it's lightweight and runs on old hardware
• it starts in 20 seconds and closes in 5
• it's extremely easy to maintain and keep software up to date
• it's configurable and never tells me "it cannot be done"
• it looks beautiful
• it's secure
• it's free
• I like people from Linux community
• I love idea of installing software with one-click from repositories
• you can always install and try new distro (and there is hundreds of them, whatever you like!) in 15 minutes without a need to destroy all your data, patience and configuration
• because using Windows is now a real pain for me, all above does not apply to Windows
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Magmarock: I never said I was an expert that that I know how to use it. But more importantly let me ask you this. When you write comments like this is there at all a moment where you think "gee that comes off a little arrogant." Seriously where do you get off on telling me what I do and do not know followed by telling to me to grow up XD. Talk about zero self awareness
You are too much of yourself, I didn't assume you are an expert - I assumed you at least spent fair amount of time dedicated to one ecosystem to understand it. But everything points out that you didn't - you even claim that its Windows advantage that there is no Witcher 3 for Linux.

You also seem to be kind of guy who would accuse an old woman to be old, poke her eye out and proudly present it to your friends of similar mentality. I don't see any constructiveness from you, all you do is hijacking topics to boast the poked out eye.

I would much better see you to:
- start to contribute to existing project that supports your ideals, or
- spin your own project (still waiting for the code of YOUR package manager), or
- move on to system with compromises which suit you

Why? Very simple, because work with brain is much harder than work with tongue, plus you'd get into advantages and disadvantages of everything and will confront the real reasons why the package decisions are as they are.


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Magmarock: ....
Every time criticism is thrown at Linux it's someone elses fault.

You're a noob and can't use it, It's Microsoft fault that got in first, it's the retailers they won't sell Linux computers, it's just different you just need to get used to it.
The criticism should be properly formatted and hosted on bug tracker. This isn't a bug tracker.

I must disagree with your theory of being noob, before switching to Linux I contributed to Nlite and RyanVM projects, did unattended silent installers, automatic registry monitors, inf scripting - but then Vista came out and I had to break my 20 year long ties with MS products.
My current setup suits me well, it does what its supposed to, doesn't upgrade to "surprise" state and I have no unsolvable problems. Thank you very much for you concern.

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Magmarock: The Linux community is toxic but don't take my word for it. I'll let one of when one of your own break it down for you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BV68DJ2SLyc
Well, you are true here. All the cleaning agents tend to be extremely toxic, but they do work. But they are never used without reason, I assure you. So, the better fit question is - why is everyone around you suddenly a bleach and if there is a better way to return to productive state?
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xyem: Where do I get the source code for those?
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Magmarock: The code is private. I can link you to the patches but that's about it.
There's the answer to your question then.