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KiNgBrAdLeY7: I couldn't agree more; but to prevent someone from beating you up, you actually have to beat the crap out of them first, or else...
Not really. Consider that a busted knee is quite an effective fight stopper, almost as much as a broken rib. A busted knee though is less likely to prove fatal, while a broken rib can pierce the lungs or the heart.
The less aggressive martial arts work on dodges and throws, so you can get away from the attacker (or get the attacker away from you), while the most aggressive ones do deal with actively disabling the attacker, but they also advise breaking extremities (elbow and knee in particular, though arms and legs are also fair game) instead of going for the head or the torso.
So, if you want to defend yourself, you usually try to do it in the most efficient, yet still safe for the attacker way. If you want to beat the crap out of the other, you don't usually care about keeping him alive.

Oh, and do learn how to do a proper chokehold. When used properly, and assuming you can get in position, it can disable your attacker fast and efficiently, allowing you to defuse the situation. Just make sure to know how long you need to apply pressure so you don't end up killing the guy.
Martial arts are not useless. However your post appears to suggest that the usefulness of martial arts is in self defence. Have a read of the Karate Do Kyohan by Gichin Funakoshi. In that he explains the purpose of Karate, and highlights self defense as being by far the least important of his three main reasons.

As others have pointed out to various degrees, and it is almost universally accepted that firearms ended martial arts as being anything other than an interest / art in terms of combat.
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KiNgBrAdLeY7: Don't get me wrong, i love tradition and antiques, them being an item, a teaching, or an ideal. Yet, they are actually entirely useless? If you cannot utilize those techniques into practical protection of your person, or retaliation against people that harmed you a lot, then, what would be their use, i wonder...?
You speak as if defending oneself, and revenge, are somehow equal?

One of the reasons laws exist in the first place is to cut the retaliation spiral that could easily ensue without them:

I called your wife ugly => you let your dog pee on my lawn in retaliation => I shoot your dog => you shoot my wife => I set your house on fire etc. etc. etc.

So the only "retaliation", or rather, compensation, you should seek should be through lawful ways (call the police etc.). That's how modern societies nowadays work. The main point of police and courts is not necessarily to compensate either party, but to cut the escalation of the problem.

Furthermore, you seem to have a very traditional view on martial arts. If you want to know how you are allowed to act on real situations etc., I suggest you seek non-competitive (and possibly non-traditional) martial arts classes which take local laws into account. For instance at least here krav maga and defendo tend to be such martial arts. At least in the KM classes I've attended there has been lots of talk about what is perceived as lawful course of action in different situations.

That's why e.g. when someone someone simply grabs your wrist, we weren't taught to instantly hit the grabber to the face with our free hand (and/or kick to the groin), which would probably be the simplest and most effective course of action in such a case. No, we are taught to get our wrist free from the grab, without striking.

It is both because it would not be lawful to strike someone for simply grabbing your wrist (unless, maybe, he was pulling you towards the bushes, or had a knife in the other hand, or it was otherwise apparent it is a dangerous situation), but also because quite often you wouldn't necessarily even want to strike him/her. What if he was your friend grabbing your wrist in jest, or your wife/husband, or your boss? You might want to get free without damaging the grabber.

Also, such martial arts take also psychological effects into account, e.g. how to de-escalate such encounters so that no physical fighting is necessarily needed at all. Hitting a wrist-grabber to the face could easily escalate the problem further, even if you were able to put the lights out on him (his friends see you hitting their friend etc.).
Post edited May 03, 2015 by timppu
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KiNgBrAdLeY7: Don't get me wrong, i love tradition and antiques, them being an item, a teaching, or an ideal. Yet, they are actually entirely useless? If you cannot utilize those techniques into practical protection of your person, or retaliation against people that harmed you a lot, then, what would be their use, i wonder...?
That is a good question.

Today is Sunday, crappy weather and I'd rot at home all day long if I wasn't going to meet a good friend of mine 10 minutes from now to do some friendly sparring outside. That is why I do martial arts and in that regard it is 100% useful to me.
low rated
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KiNgBrAdLeY7: I couldn't agree more; but to prevent someone from beating you up, you actually have to beat the crap out of them first, or else...
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JMich: Not really. Consider that a busted knee is quite an effective fight stopper, almost as much as a broken rib. A busted knee though is less likely to prove fatal, while a broken rib can pierce the lungs or the heart.
The less aggressive martial arts work on dodges and throws, so you can get away from the attacker (or get the attacker away from you), while the most aggressive ones do deal with actively disabling the attacker, but they also advise breaking extremities (elbow and knee in particular, though arms and legs are also fair game) instead of going for the head or the torso.
So, if you want to defend yourself, you usually try to do it in the most efficient, yet still safe for the attacker way. If you want to beat the crap out of the other, you don't usually care about keeping him alive.

Oh, and do learn how to do a proper chokehold. When used properly, and assuming you can get in position, it can disable your attacker fast and efficiently, allowing you to defuse the situation. Just make sure to know how long you need to apply pressure so you don't end up killing the guy.
Hey, chokeholds have many counters and easy reversals... Other than that you are certainly correct, except for the rib part; its bones are the weakest in human body and can be targeted the most easily, too. Knee moves all the time and breaks really, really hard. Dodges are also transitory, no one can dodge forever; once or twice to confuse the other one, then straight to the gut! From a moral perspective you are correct, but i really doubt this suggestion can help you while in danger... I might be mistaken, of course.

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wpegg: Martial arts are not useless. However your post appears to suggest that the usefulness of martial arts is in self defence. Have a read of the Karate Do Kyohan by Gichin Funakoshi. In that he explains the purpose of Karate, and highlights self defense as being by far the least important of his three main reasons.

As others have pointed out to various degrees, and it is almost universally accepted that firearms ended martial arts as being anything other than an interest / art in terms of combat.
Thanks for the suggestion. I like good reads.
Play Baldur's Gate. Go to High Hedge. Speak to Thalantyr.
You shall learn...
NOOOOO
martial arts cannot be useless, damn all those childhood dreams and movies coming crashing down, no jackie chan will save the day, his martial arts are real and useful in all scenario
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djranis: no jackie chan will save the day, his martial arts are real and useful in all scenario
Oh yeah, because using a rickshaw and a step ladder to defend myself happens almost every day. :P
Post edited May 03, 2015 by tinyE
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KiNgBrAdLeY7: Hey, chokeholds have many counters and easy reversals...
By chokehold I was thinking of the Rear naked choke, mostly due to the time required for unconsciousness. Yes, there are ways to escape said choke, but how many people know them? And if you think you will need to use said choke, shouldn't you also learn the counters to the counters?

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KiNgBrAdLeY7: Knee moves all the time and breaks really, really hard.
I am not talking about a broken kneecap (επιγονατίδα). I am talking about the whole knee. A properly broken knee means the leg cannot move any more, the person cannot stand, and if someone in that kind of pain can continue fighting, you have a different opponent to worry about.
Clearly martial arts are not useless:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8p0JEOUi4Q&feature=youtu.be&t=160
Thanks for the replies. An apology is due, some people probably got offended. The title, i mean... Of course they are not useless. Useless are only the cowards like me who don't employ the techniques they learn on people deserving to receive them and instead allow themselves to be trashed.

Case solved and closed.
Post edited May 05, 2015 by KiNgBrAdLeY7
It appears that you have some concerns about traditional martial arts and their practicality in the modern legal and social context. Let's break down your points and address them one by one.

1. Teaching Self-Restraint and Compassion: Many traditional martial arts[ do emphasize self-discipline, self-restraint, and compassion as integral components of their teachings. While this may seem counterintuitive when it comes to self-defense, it's important to remember that these values aim to promote harmony, discourage violence, and encourage practitioners to use their skills responsibly. Self-defense should ideally be a last resort, and the focus on restraint and compassion reflects a broader goal of fostering responsible individuals.

2. Legal Consequences: You're correct that carrying certain martial arts weapons like nunchaku or chain weapons can lead to legal trouble, even if you're using them in self-defense. Laws vary by jurisdiction, and some places have stricter regulations regarding weapons than others. The intent behind these laws is often to prevent potential misuse and escalation of violence. It's essential to be aware of and comply with local laws when it comes to carrying and using such weapons.

3. Practicality: Traditional martial arts often include a wide range of techniques, some of which may not be directly applicable in modern self-defense situations. However, they also teach valuable skills such as balance, coordination, and self-confidence. The practicality of martial arts depends on how well the practitioner adapts their training to real-life situations. Some martial arts schools do incorporate modern self-defense techniques and scenario-based training to bridge this gap.

4. Favoring Law-Abiding Citizens: The legal system aims to maintain order and protect citizens. Laws regarding weapons are not necessarily biased against martial artists or those who practice self-restraint. Instead, they aim to strike a balance between personal rights and public safety. If someone is attacked and uses self-defense appropriately, the legal system generally recognizes their right to protect themselves.

In summary, traditional martial arts emphasize self-discipline, compassion, and personal development, which can have a positive impact on practitioners beyond just self-defense. However, understanding and adhering to local laws regarding weapons is crucial to avoid legal trouble. The practicality of martial arts for self-defense can vary depending on the individual's training and adaptability. Ultimately, the law seeks to protect all citizens, and it's essential to strike a balance between personal rights and public safety.
This may be the most useless thread that has been reesurrected from the dead by a bot lately.
Where do people find these types of ancient threads?
Is King Bradley actually useless?