Interesting theory. You think it possible if not reasonably likely that the first two votes on you are both scum?

Just for amusement, let's go back and look at Wyrm's prediction last game (#631):

"Who is scum?
-------------------
JMich - Post 485
Cristigale - Post 609 (Slipped in quietly and neatly on other's reasons, while leaving herself an out if my wagon starts to fall apart)
CSPVG
Bler? (I'm getting scum vibes)

Who is town?
------------------
Wyrm
Yog
Dedo
Krypsyn
Flub
Trent?"

He gets some points because he had RW leaning scum, and JMich was only kinda sorta town, but out of 14 guesses, well...

I think the core problem here is that your gambit doesn't really have much competition. Basically the opposite problem of last game where Wyrm set the bar very high and allowed Yog (and my own insanity as I figured out what I was doing) to slide in underneath. Here the bar is low. Which creates other problems. To some extent people are voting for you for lack of a serious alternative.

CSP's gambit was somewhat similar to yours, except that you kept digging your grave (seemingly intentionally from your recent posts) when the crowd started to turn against you, and he shut up and took a diff. tack.

Do I think you'll flip town? Yes. Do I think we'll really learn much from it? Eh... time will tell, but I'm not holding my breath.

I think it's possible, not sure about reasonably likely... I think dedo and trent are the more likely scum pair, but Leonard flipping scum (or just some kind of anti town wouldn't surprise me)

Yeah, I get that. I'm not worried about going out now if that's what happens. But let's face it, it was this or sit around for a week waiting for someone else to do something.

Hey, no one else was going to dig it for me ;)
How else was I supposed to lure some scum out and get some info without some nice juicy bait?

What you learn is up to you. Once you know I was town (assuming my lynch goes ahead) you can look at what happened properly (with the additional info of any NK(s)) and decide if I might have it right or am barking up the wrong tree entirely.


I'm just going to ignore trent's post
1) because I don't have time to properly respond to it
And 2) because it's pointless anyway. Either he's town and we've both got it completely wrong, in which case the discussion is pointless, or he's scum and it doesn't really matter what I say he will try and push for my lynch. And vice versa if you want to believe I'm scum.

Which person? I bet it's dedo.

Was I right?

FWIW, I tried to post a 'lol' at your joke but gogbear ate it. On the 'lure' point, I dunno, my experience last game was that every time I tried to set a trap it blew up in my face. Several times Yog cleverly redirected if not outright blew it up, and other times I ended up tricking myself into "seeing" something that wasn't really there (Trent D2, e.g.)

Maybe I just particularly suck at it, or maybe I just haven't learned the knack. But my newbish sense is that even when people walk into the traps you set, it's not necessarily for the reason you think.

First things first,
Good luck Sage!
Hello RWarehall

Secondly,
@adaliabooks so you are saying you did basically the same thing as Bookwyrm last game? Trying to see who would jump on an easy lynch? Did that really work last game? I don't think we really gained anything from his lynch. Besides I don't think he minded being lynched because he had the property ownership power.
I think my original RVS vote is in the best place it can be right now.

If you are town then you diluted the waters like bookwyrm did last game. Presenting yourself in a scummy manner and expecting scum to jump all over it so they can get you lynched creates more problems than it helps.

What are we supposed to do as town when we find something scummy? Ignore it? No, we are supposed to point it out and question it. So now if a townie gets lynched for acting scummy the people who pushed for the lynch that are town and doing what they are supposed to do all of a sudden are looked upon as scummy for lynching a townie, and all scum have to do this early is let town kill town and laugh their asses off about it.

If you are lynched and flip town then poor play on your part for making so more townies look bad for doing what a townie should do, and that is lynch someone who is acting scummy. There's a reason town is not supposed to do scummy things. I should have followed that lesson last game as I had almost everyone convinced I was scum when I was town and it allowed scum to win.

Day 1 sucks, and I don't think it will ever change from that no matter how much people want it too.

Admin first: Sage, I extend my sympathies as well, and I hope things work out well for you.

-----

Catching up on the thread, and I missed where Adalia said he made a scummy slip. Can you point it out?

I can empathize with feeling like Trent can latch on and blow something out of proportion. Adalia hasn't said that all that matters for town is killing and getting info from the slip. Maybe I'm being too nitpicky about wording.

Hey, I got 4 right out of 10 guesses (I'm not counting the ones I couldn't place). JMich might have been technically town aligned, but he wasn't town friendly so I'm claiming that one as true.

This is one of the big reasons I'm not willing to vote Adalia or CSPVG for their Day 1 attempts. I imagine I'd already be on Adalia's wagon if he pulled this out in later days, but Day 1 is a special case for me.

When he was giving his breakdown of how I was scum and said I latch on to any scummy slip and blow it out of proportion. If he is saying I'm latching onto a scummy slip and blowing it out of proportion, who did the scummy slip come from? If he is going to say there was no scummy slip by him then what exactly am I focusing on and blowing out of proportion?

As I already said last game you acted scummy on purpose and it caused more problems than it helped, and if adalibooks is lynched and is town it will do the same thing.

Don't you reach 4 only by counting your vote on your own alignment? Weak sauce, man. ;)

FWIW, I wasn't really trying to knock you in particular, just noting the challenge of guessing right out of the gate, esp. in a situation where you don't even really know the terrain yet.

So, I was contacted a couple days ago and started making a few notes...
For the most part, I seem to have come to the same conclusions as many of you...

Adalia is the top of my list. Pretty much for all the reasons already mentioned. Town just can't let people act in a scummy manner and ignore it. The biggest thing I have to add is from post 242. Where Adalia is trying to give town points to Lift for a good thought. Every time I see someone do this, I think scum...Its like saying, I'm your friend, be my friend. How's about a friend help me out.

Second is Flub for generally being not very helpful and aloof.

After that, well a lot less sure...no particular order here...think of this as my deserving a harder look list...
CSPVG and his 3 scummiest quip irked me but it came so early. I'm a little more concerned with his involvement. It feels like his playstyle is a little different...
I had Sage on my list for being unusually quiet....guess I can scratch that one off the list...
Bookwyrm raises a red flag to me as well. I've got post 178 highlighted. It comes off as possibly defending others. I've also never been too keen on people who refuse to vote (and announces as such) for anyone except one or two people on their list. It just reads to me as "Vote with me or good luck getting enough votes on your wagon" and I find it a little too easy for a scum to use this style to direct the lynches.
Then I have a comment circled with arrows..."Did Dedo just try to bus Adalia?" It looked kinda like that, but its one data point.

Beyond that...maybe I'm just a bit paranoid and distrusting, but I've got just one person I'm thinking is town and a second slightly leaning there based on my gut.

Nice and subtle. ;)

Every post needs a little humor, but it is true. I was asked a couple days ago if I was available. I was not told who I might be replacing. As I was making my notes the thought did pass my mind that I hope I wasn't replacing someone at the top of my scum list.

With RW on board, and the lay of the land seemingly set, I'm curious if there's anything else to be gained from D1. Hard to see anyone on the wagon getting off, and at least a few others who've lined themselves up to get on.

Unless Lift is going to return and say he's seen the light, I think at this point the end is predestined. I tend to think it's unlikely Lift doesn't get back on - the reveal was more or less what had to be expected from the lead-up. No offense, but it was underwhelming. ;) (Man, I've been kind of a jerk in my last 4-5 posts. Hopefully no one noticed. Did I say that out loud?)

The only questions remaining would seem to be
1) who fills the last two spots. RW and...CSP? Can't even entirely rule myself out. I mean, it was odd to unvote flub and then not bother to vote anyone else, and I'm in agreement with Trent in #320, even if I would have phrased it more as "not helpful" than outright "scummy" to keep the gambit running that long. Nitpicking, perhaps.
2) What adalia claims. Stats and flavor may ultimately mean crap but it would be nice to have them JIC.

RWarehall has stated his intent to jump on so that certainly wouldn't surprise me. If CSPVG is scum I find it slightly unlikely he'd hammer (though having said that he might just to prove me wrong) but I have to say I did have you down as hammering, mainly cause I feel that's the kind of player you are.

I can full claim if anyone cares, but I'm fairly sure it will all come out with my flip anyway (cristi's role, race and stats were in the OP)


As for trent, the jumping on a scummy slip bit was meant to be from your perspective. You saw it as scummy and a slip, therefore you jumped on it.

As for everyone else, my intention was never to actually appear scummy. Just to be controversial enough to give something for people to go "OMG you so scummy!" too, as I find that this tends to come from scum looking to push for a lynch.
And not everyone actually seems to have found it scummy, just some the most suspicious players in the game plus Lift and JMich (who I seem to frequently clash with over play style)
Just as interesting is HijacKs lack of any major reaction (ie a vote) as he is another player I always clash with.

Cute but no.


Wasn't that not an RVS vote anymore or did I misunderstand you at some point?