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General discussionForum Mafia #51 - The Greater Good(534 posts)(534 posts)
(534 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted October 05, 2017
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mchack: Also for you, is this the recruit you'd take when you are HSL CL? really? really really?
I've seen all sorts of things happen so nothing should be discarded just like that. WIFOM is one of the strongest scum tools, so yes, I wouldn't put it past anyone. And how should I know who I would take when I'm neither HSL nor the CL?! Considering how outrageous and insane that path seems for anyone to take it it becomes one of the best hiding places exactly because others would throw away the possibility.

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mchack: First HSL then me then maybe wyrm? and with all of them dead there's no way to get to you anymore because we already lost.
That line was clearly a swing at an extremely similar statement that came from HSL himself - I even asking him the very same question you are now asking me.
Posted October 05, 2017
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Lifthrasil: So, to summarize: you are torn between bookwyrm and dedo, I am torn between dedo and HSL. ... Maybe it is dedo after all. There is no single tell that is strong enough to convict him, but he may very well be the CL skating by on a reasonably towny looking act...
since I need to go to work now, but don't want to stall anything....
unvote
vote dedoporno

I have thought about it a bit in the shower, and let's assume CL actually is either dedo or wyrm and we don't start lynching someone else entirely, then we already won:
a) we lynch dedo and he's cl: it's game over, we won, pats on the back all around
a) we lynch dedo and he's town: you give a result tomorrow about wyrm which is bound to be scum (if our assumption is correct) and we lynch him but game isn't over yet (because cl won't have tried to recruit you because trent protects you). But then we can safely follow the cop because the CL will be dead and it's just voting no-lynch from then on until you give us a positive result. Win

so you have to ask yourselves: is me or HSL (or trent or lift) really more likely to be CL than either dedo or wyrm?
Posted October 05, 2017
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Lifthrasil: So, to summarize: you are torn between bookwyrm and dedo, I am torn between dedo and HSL. ... Maybe it is dedo after all. There is no single tell that is strong enough to convict him, but he may very well be the CL skating by on a reasonably towny looking act...
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mchack: since I need to go to work now, but don't want to stall anything....
unvote
vote dedoporno

I have thought about it a bit in the shower, and let's assume CL actually is either dedo or wyrm and we don't start lynching someone else entirely, then we already won:
a) we lynch dedo and he's cl: it's game over, we won, pats on the back all around
a) we lynch dedo and he's town: you give a result tomorrow about wyrm which is bound to be scum (if our assumption is correct) and we lynch him but game isn't over yet (because cl won't have tried to recruit you because trent protects you). But then we can safely follow the cop because the CL will be dead and it's just voting no-lynch from then on until you give us a positive result. Win

so you have to ask yourselves: is me or HSL (or trent or lift) really more likely to be CL than either dedo or wyrm?
Actually that reasoning isn't bad and I even extend it a bit. If we stick with the assumption that you and trent (and me) aren't the CL, that leaves three candidates for CL. We lynch one (dedo). If he's a mislynch, I investigate one. If that one is scum --> lynch + win. If that one is town --> lynch the other and win. IF the assumption, that the CL is among these three is true. I know that I'm town and I'm reasonably sure about trent. In your case, the assumption that you are not CL is actually pure instinct - so if you managed to fool both me and trent, congratulations.

But for now let's start the elimination process of one of the three main suspects (especially since I will also be away for half a day).

vote dedoporno
Posted October 05, 2017
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trentonlf: ...
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Lifthrasil: Gah. My head hurts. I have been trying to go over the posts of everyone again and I still get a slight scum feeling for HSL. But that may be our basic differences. It's not the first time that we find each other scummy when actually we're both town. So I'm not the best judge of HSL. Also there is some thought that struck me: whoever is the CL seems to be thinking somewhat similar to me, at least in respect to flubb being the best recruit, in spite of my pointing this fact out on D1. HSL usually thinks quite differently from me, so I doubt he would have converted flubb. That is of course WIFOM, but since WIFOM is swingy, I find it sometimes useful to go back to the basics before the application of WIFOM. And if I look for players who seem to follow tought patterns similar to mine the two that spring to mind are dedo and you. Both Bookwyrm and HSL play very differently from me. So I wonder whether either of them really would have recruited flubb.

I will exclude the possibility that you are the CL yourself, since your claim would have been just a too brazen gamble without any need to take that risk. I also agree with you on the feeling that mchack is genuinely playing for town. Both today and Yesterday - and we know that none of the players currently alive changed their alignment last night, so we can include Yesterday's play in our analysises.

So, to summarize: you are torn between bookwyrm and dedo, I am torn between dedo and HSL. ... Maybe it is dedo after all. There is no single tell that is strong enough to convict him, but he may very well be the CL skating by on a reasonably towny looking act...
This is what makes Mafia stressful and fun at the same time. I keep going over the game and posts trying to figure out who is lying or stretching the truth just a little and what motive they would have for doing so. I must even sadly admit I dream of th game too LOL.

I think we are going to end the game today with a dedo lynch, and if I’m wrong then as mchack pointed out we should have it in the bag tomorrow.

Vote dedoporno
Posted October 05, 2017
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trentonlf: I think we are going to end the game today with a dedo lynch, and if I’m wrong then as mchack pointed out we should have it in the bag tomorrow.
I think so, too ;)

vote dedoporno

At last :)
Posted October 05, 2017
The Greater Good! The Greater Good prevailed!

@dedoporno, y u stole my hammer? You did this on purpose, didn't you? Didn't you?!
Posted October 05, 2017
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HypersomniacLive: @dedoporno, y u stole my hammer? You did this on purpose, didn't you? Didn't you?!
I've been wanting to close the game on my own terms for a couple of days now and the final decision was made yesterday. I just wanted to not spoil it for everyone and let you do your plays until the end of the Day. Even if a mislynch was going to happen I intended to come out anyway :)
Posted October 05, 2017
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dedoporno: I've been wanting to close the game on my own terms for a couple of days now and the final decision was made yesterday. I just wanted to not spoil it for everyone and let you do your plays until the end of the Day. Even if a mislynch was going to happen I intended to come out anyway :)
Don't follow - what do you mean by "my own terms", and why would have come out in the case of a mislynch?
Posted October 05, 2017
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HypersomniacLive: Don't follow - what do you mean by "my own terms", and why would have come out in the case of a mislynch?
The game was all but over once the decision to distinguish the CL flip was made. That along with a couple of other things that disappointed me made me lose interest in trying harder since it was going to be mostly a waste of everybody's time. Initially I though about just dropping off right then and there but later on I came to my senses and figured that would be disrespectful to both the mods and all the players. So I rolled with it until the Town finally made their minds :)
Posted October 05, 2017
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trentonlf: I think we are going to end the game today with a dedo lynch, and if I’m wrong then as mchack pointed out we should have it in the bag tomorrow.
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dedoporno: I think so, too ;)

vote dedoporno

At last :)
I was really stressing that I had read you all wrong, your town and scum game are not far off from each other so it’s tough reading you. If you had been town I would have felt like a heel. Out of curiosity who would you have tried to convert if we had not lynched you? I was thinking of protecting mchack tonight if it was necessary.
Posted October 05, 2017
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trentonlf: I was really stressing that I had read you all wrong, your town and scum game are not far off from each other so it’s tough reading you. If you had been town I would have felt like a heel.
Yeah, that's was one of the reasons I wouldn't allow another lynch to move forward. I felt especially guilty for Wyrm :D

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trentonlf: Out of curiosity who would you have tried to convert if we had not lynched you? I was thinking of protecting mchack tonight if it was necessary.
LOL, I actually expected you to do exactly that and I was going to target Lift for a get rich or die trying final move :D

My original idea was to mislynch mchack or Wyrm and convert HSL. No knowing if the CL was actually removed would have prolonged the game and given the cult time and breathing room. HSL may have been able to turn things towards mchack/wyrm from then on and finish with you as the obvious recruit.

Anyway, once thing went in the other direction I figured that even if I make it through the day I'll be most likely denying someone the victory which didn't make sense.
Posted October 05, 2017
Wait, you guys beat the game without me? Everything happens after I go to bed!! :-O

Man, and I was all set with this clever plan that someone else apparently already came up with. :(

Go team?
Posted October 05, 2017
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mchack: And why would HSL if he was the CL recruit exactly the one player that is on about him being scum all the time? You talked about putting yourself in a corner by making your stances known and if recruited being lynched for that change. How do you think HSL wouldn't consider exactly this? and then tell flub to go for you at the start of this day for flimsy reasons?
This is a good point. The rest I wasn't planning to respond to.

-----

Yep, in post 482 Mchack came up with the exact same plan that I did, though I was going to put Dedo and HSL in the Thunderdome. I don't feel quite as clever now. Oh well.

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dedoporno: Anyway, once thing went in the other direction I figured that even if I make it through the day I'll be most likely denying someone the victory which didn't make sense.
I was thinking about asking Trent and Lift that if they were the CL to recruit me for the win. ;)

For The Greater Good!
Posted October 05, 2017
Fun fact: @Wyrm, you were my original choice before the game was even started but you did what you did so I had to consider other options. One of which was HSL (dodged a bullet there :D).

Oh yeah, @Trent and @Lift - special commends to the two of you of hiding your abilities like you did. Especially Trent, who threw me away with a single line of text saying that the vote is his only tool (not sure if that was intentional or not but it felt so genuine and unscritped that I didn't think twice about it).
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Bookwyrm627: Yep, in post 482 Mchack came up with the exact same plan that I did, though I was going to put Dedo and HSL in the Thunderdome. I don't feel quite as clever now. Oh well. !
Well, yeah, I expected basically the same flow once it became clear there is no way to hide the CL is dead, hence why I considered the game as lost right then and there. Nothing too clever about it, it was the only reasnoable path to take.
Post edited October 05, 2017 by dedoporno
Posted October 05, 2017
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trentonlf: I was really stressing that I had read you all wrong, your town and scum game are not far off from each other so it’s tough reading you. If you had been town I would have felt like a heel.
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dedoporno: Yeah, that's was one of the reasons I wouldn't allow another lynch to move forward. I felt especially guilty for Wyrm :D

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trentonlf: Out of curiosity who would you have tried to convert if we had not lynched you? I was thinking of protecting mchack tonight if it was necessary.
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dedoporno: LOL, I actually expected you to do exactly that and I was going to target Lift for a get rich or die trying final move :D

My original idea was to mislynch mchack or Wyrm and convert HSL. No knowing if the CL was actually removed would have prolonged the game and given the cult time and breathing room. HSL may have been able to turn things towards mchack/wyrm from then on and finish with you as the obvious recruit.

Anyway, once thing went in the other direction I figured that even if I make it through the day I'll be most likely denying someone the victory which didn't make sense.
I was afraid you were going to say that LOL
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionForum Mafia #51 - The Greater Good(534 posts)(534 posts)
(534 posts)