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So I wonder.. Now I'm on my second playthrough, forcing myself to side with Iorveth-and while I would support Saskia over Henselt easily I can't stand the Scoia'tael..

They are terrorist without any realistic goal except maybe revenge.. whatever they do it will not help them nor their race at all.
In an analogy I think they are like the native north-americans-and while I can sympathise with them-not with their methods- I just can't see how could a human fight on their side?
I mean they keep trying to kill me just because i'm human.. they are the most racist group in the whole universe..
Roche's unit isn't too moral, but they are not racists-they fight for temeria, angainst the elven bandits defending their own people.
So yes it is a bad thing that the non-humans treated like second class, but why would a human help them in their futile war agains innocent /and not so innocent humans?
Post edited June 08, 2011 by mzprox
I find it more morally repulsive to join Roche (not due to Roche himself, but due to what happens on his side of the chapter).

Your question is pointless.

And P.S. - Geralt says all the time that he isn't human.
Post edited May 30, 2011 by anticitizen101
that's the point of the game. there isn't a "good guys" you can join. just complex characters with flaws.
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mzprox: So I wonder.. Now I'm on my second playthrough, forcing myself to side with Iorveth-and while I would support Saskia over Henselt easily I can't stand the Scoia'tael..

They are terrorist without any realistic goal except maybe revenge.. whatever they do it will not help them nor their race at all.
In an analogy I think they are like the native north-americans-and while I can sympathise with them-not with their methods- I just can't see how could a human fight on their side?
I mean they keep trying to kill me just because i'm human.. they are the most racist group in the whole universe..
Roche unti isn1t too moral, but they are not racists-they fight for temeria, angainst the elven bandits defending their own people.
So yes it is a bad thing that the non-humans treated like second class, but why would a human help them in their futile war agains innocent /and not so innocent humans?
Geralt, being a mutant, isn't considered human by many/most people. So, he has to fear being a victim of that same racism one day, as well. And, considering them terrorists is only one side of the medal. On the other side, there's humans who destroyed most of elven culture and civilization and a bunch of young elves who struggle for both survival and freedom.
And you should not forget that Geralt struck a deal with Roche and is pursued as being the king's murderer throughout Temeria. So, the Scoia'tael offer him a chance to get out of his duty towards Roche and a certain degree of protection from those pursuing him.
I am in the exact opposite situation. I am doing my second playthrough with Roche, and hate everyone except Ves. I want to punch all of them.

I have no idea how you can say Roche and his group aren't racists. When you sided with Roche, did you not hear his men say how they'd never touch an elf-girl after freeing the woman Loredo was holding prisoner? I was so glad they gave you the opportunity to punch the guy in his face. There were some other comments from Roche and/or his men, but that was the biggest one for me. the elves may be bigoted, but they have a perfectly good reason to be after being nearly wiped out by the humans.

I will not deny that the Scoia'tael's fight is not exactly in their favor, but the other option they have is not really any better. And you will see they do actually have a plan this time. And a good one, at that.

As for how in character it is for either side. Remember that a Witcher isn't strictly human. He kind of walks the line between both sides, and thus can gain acceptance of the elves a bit more easily. Also, you have just helped Iorveth, that goes a long way. And Geralt does have a history of helping out non-humans in the book. he died in a riot against non-humans, trying to defend them, so I think it is in character for him to be sympathetic to their cause.
Post edited May 30, 2011 by Raye
Geralt is Human, and in the eye of the Scoia'tael definately. In conversations with Iorveth it becomes quite clear that He would work with humans only if he can use them for his goals which is to kill humans.
If I would be an elf I might consider joinning them, but as for Gearlt, even if he is a "freak" the Scoia'tael only harms those he wants to protect- his human friends, his non-violent nonhuman friends,. .

Ok, so there might have been a racist comment from Roche's man, but still they are at least not murderers of innocents.
and again: I can sympathise with the elves, I just don't see what is the point helping them in a pointless "war" which brings noothing but suffering while they hate us just for being human (sort of)
Post edited May 30, 2011 by mzprox
As much as the other side likes to paint them as mindless murderers, they are not. They are perfectly willing to side with humans as long as those humans treat them fairly. If you read the journal about Lobinden, for instance, it mentions that because the humans in the village treat the elves well, they have nothing to fear from the Scoia'tael, that's why they are safe with no walls. This becomes very apparent once you get to the second act as well. Remember, everything you hear (from both sides) is incredibly biased, never take a character's word about the other side at face value.
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Raye: As much as the other side likes to paint them as mindless murderers, they are not. They are perfectly willing to side with humans as long as those humans treat them fairly. If you read the journal about Lobinden, for instance, it mentions that because the humans in the village treat the elves well, they have nothing to fear from the Scoia'tael, that's why they are safe with no walls. This becomes very apparent once you get to the second act as well. Remember, everything you hear (from both sides) is incredibly biased, never take a character's word about the other side at face value.
We have enough experiance on our own about the Scoia'tael. That side quest for example where we can help Melana(?) the elf girl. I lied for her though I don't think she should get away w/o punishment, but still she lured me into a trap-which is again might be understandable-but why would I still wanted to help them?
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Raye: And Geralt does have a history of helping out non-humans in the book. he died in a riot against non-humans, trying to defend them, so I think it is in character for him to be sympathetic to their cause.
Not quite precise. He helped innocent non-humans when being slaughtered by a riotting mob.
But, he also makes clear that he does not approve one bit of most Scoia'tael's mindless and 'juvenile' efforts - e.g. making up 'bandit' gangs and slaughtering innocents in return.
So, unless, there is anything more to it, I highly doubt he would join them.

Loredo being a racist asshole who was about to hang Dandelion and Zoltan might be good arguments for Geralt as well as Zoltan's approval of Iorveth's efforts (even though Zoltan, generally, is against the Scoia'tael's way of doing things as well).
I said sympathetic to their cause, not their methods. There are other reasons he could go with him, like Triss etc.

One person is not necessarily indicative of the group as a whole. There is no evidence Iorveth knew of or supported what Malena did. Even if he did... well, it WAS Loredo's guards, not random townsfolk. That seems to be a perfectly logical target for a group like that. And besides, there are examples of humans behaving badly. Loredo keeping an elf girl hostage in his house for like a year. Are you going to say all the humans are bad because of what he did?

And I just have to say the 'hopeless battle' thing is really not cutting it for me. You are essentially suggesting that any oppressed group just roll over and give up. While less costly in terms of lives, all this ensures is that the situation continues, and they lose all dignity and honor. The only way to get change is to fight for it, no matter how hopeless the odds may seem, the chances of changing things are still better than doing nothing. In out modern times that is usually done in court with no blood spilled. But back then, you had to resort to violence.
Post edited May 30, 2011 by Raye
The wither's world just like ours is not perfect, unfoprtunately.. the Scoia'tael's fight not just hopeless but contra productive, it actually makes their lifes worse (not just theirs, but those non-humans' who try to assimilate.- they might fight for honor and other ideals, I can not judge them from the other side, but joining them is an other thing, that i can1t see how and why..
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mzprox: The wither's world just like ours is not perfect, unfoprtunately.. the Scoia'tael's fight not just hopeless but contra productive, it actually makes their lifes worse (not just theirs, but those non-humans' who try to assimilate.- they might fight for honor and other ideals, I can not judge them from the other side, but joining them is an other thing, that i can1t see how and why..
/opinion
/thread
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anticitizen101: /opinion
/thread
If you don't have any then that way please---> (nice she-troll waiting for ya)
If you don't realize that what you're saying is an opinion or that the replies you're getting are opinions, you're either trolling (consciously or unconsciously), or you don't realize what an opinion is. I gave mine at the start of the thread.

You're basically going against every viewpoint that isn't compatible with your own. You're not looking for explanations. You're looking for validations for your own opinion.
Anything more is an insult to everybody who bothered replying.
You're not joining the Scoiatel, you are using them. They have given you an inside track to capturing the Kingslayer, and if not for Roche's meddling, you might have already had him.

I don't think it is ever implied that you are supporting Iorveth anymore than it's implied you are supporting Henselt by following Roche.