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General discussionUh, yeah, when PC-idiocy goes too far...(238 posts) (238 posts) 
(238 posts) 
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This is my favourite topic
Posted June 27, 2020
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BigBobsBeepers: Essentially I don't feel ANY company should bend the knee to any small group of such people(even if it benefitted me).
Why?
Posted June 27, 2020
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dtgreene: That relies on there being something else that:
* Is worth playing
There are plenty of games and media out there. And that includes things made by those who are like minded.

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dtgreene: * That the player is aware of
They can search for such. It shouldn't be too hard.

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dtgreene: * That doesn't also suffer from the same issues
Read reply 1 again in this post.

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dtgreene: * That other people in the area want to play
That is an issue that plagues ALL games of such type.

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dtgreene: Given how well known D&D is in comparison to other TTRPGs, it can be hard for all of these criteria to be met.
Then they adapt somehting to meet their needs. Shouldn't be too hard.

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dtgreene: People who are not into TTRPGs often aren't aware of TTRPGs other than D&D, and if D&D in particular is hostile to them, they likely won't bother with the hobby at all.
If such things in games are so hostile that it turns them off of such then they have bigger problems than content in games.

(And to be frank I find calling such in games and media hostile to be making a mockery of things that are actually worthy of the label)

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dtgreene: (One way to tell if someone is really into TTRPGs is if the person mentions something other than D&D.)
True
Posted June 27, 2020
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BigBobsBeepers: If such things in games are so hostile that it turns them off of such then they have bigger problems than content in games.
I agree if somebody really felt that D&D was hostile toward them because Orcs and Drows were considered evil or because some races had some specific stats bonuses then they have much bigger issues than deciding which TTRPG to play.
Posted June 27, 2020
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babark: Why?
After seeing how you reply to people after they answer these 'harmless' questions of yours in other threads I am wisely going to choose (beyond this part) to not reply to this or any of your questions in this topic.
Post edited June 27, 2020 by BigBobsBeepers
Posted June 27, 2020
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dtgreene: That relies on there being something else that:
* Is worth playing
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BigBobsBeepers: There are plenty of games and media out there. And that includes things made by those who are like minded.

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dtgreene: * That the player is aware of
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BigBobsBeepers: They can search for such. It shouldn't be too hard.

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dtgreene: * That doesn't also suffer from the same issues
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BigBobsBeepers: Read reply 1 again in this post.

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dtgreene: * That other people in the area want to play
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BigBobsBeepers: That is an issue that plagues ALL games of such type.

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dtgreene: Given how well known D&D is in comparison to other TTRPGs, it can be hard for all of these criteria to be met.
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BigBobsBeepers: Then they adapt somehting to meet their needs. Shouldn't be too hard.

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dtgreene: People who are not into TTRPGs often aren't aware of TTRPGs other than D&D, and if D&D in particular is hostile to them, they likely won't bother with the hobby at all.
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BigBobsBeepers: If such things in games are so hostile that it turns them off of such then they have bigger problems than content in games.

(And to be frank I find calling such in games and media hostile to be making a mockery of things that are actually worthy of the label)

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dtgreene: (One way to tell if someone is really into TTRPGs is if the person mentions something other than D&D.)
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BigBobsBeepers: True
Your points work for those who are already involved in the hobby, but those who are potentially interested in or just getting into it won't likely think of these things. They may just look at the most prominent example, see that it's not something they're comfortable playing, and look for a different hobby.

Edit: Again, why the low rating?
Post edited June 27, 2020 by dtgreene
Posted June 27, 2020
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dtgreene: Your points work for those who are already involved in the hobby, but those who are potentially interested in or just getting into it won't likely think of these things. They may just look at the most prominent example, see that it's not something they're comfortable playing, and look for a different hobby.
Then they're lazy, or likely to be lazy. And I don't encourage lazy behavior.

If people want something they need to put effort into it, and not just expect a company or the like to hand it to them on a silver platter. This works in both this case and beyond.

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Gersen: I agree if somebody really felt that D&D was hostile toward them because Orcs and Drows were considered evil or because some races had some specific stats bonuses then they have much bigger issues than deciding which TTRPG to play.
Yes, and to be frank I think it's parents of prior generations (now grown) that are in part to blame(overprotective and such parents and the like).

(Many of them likely made their children grow up to expect everything handed to them when asked for or to see them not getting their way as bad or unfair and this is in part the result of that I feel)
Post edited June 27, 2020 by BigBobsBeepers
Posted June 27, 2020
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dtgreene: Your points work for those who are already involved in the hobby, but those who are potentially interested in or just getting into it won't likely think of these things. They may just look at the most prominent example, see that it's not something they're comfortable playing, and look for a different hobby.
And that's perfectly fine. If it's not something for them it's not something for them, they better find a hobby that they like and are comfortable with. And even among a specific hobby, you might not like everything in it, again perfectly normal.

If you have severe chapodiphobia don't play Call of Cthulhu TTRPG, don't go ask its publisher to get rid of Cthulhu or any other tentacle-ish entity because it makes you "uncomfortable".

Just because D&D might be the most well known TTRPG doesn't mean that it must necessarily appeal to everybody.
Posted June 27, 2020
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PetrusOctavianus: How is it a stereotype when males really are stronger than females, both on average and world records.
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teceem: You might want to look up what "stereotype" means.
OK, fair enough. I thought a stereotype was somehow a misrepresentation, like vikings being portrayed with horned helmets.
But since it's not I don't see what the big problem with stereotypes are, at least when the stereotype is actually correct.

In the case of D&D it actually reduces diversity when the sexes have the same stats. Why would I as a male play a female if there is no difference?
Post edited June 27, 2020 by PetrusOctavianus
Posted June 27, 2020
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PetrusOctavianus: at least when the stereotype is actually correct.
Where did you look it up? A stereotype is by definition incorrect. (I'm not saying that I have a problem with the use of stereotypes in games.)

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PetrusOctavianus: In the case of D&D it actually reduces diversity when the sexes have the same stats. Why would I as a male play a female if there is no difference?
Because you can pick a different avatar / character model / voice / .... Don't care about that? That's ok, people are different.
Post edited June 27, 2020 by teceem
Posted June 27, 2020
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From the blog post:
We present orcs and drow in a new light in two of our most recent books, Eberron: Rising from the Last War and Explorer's Guide to Wildemount. In those books, orcs and drow are just as morally and culturally complex as other peoples. We will continue that approach in future books, portraying all the peoples of D&D in relatable ways and making it clear that they are as free as humans to decide who they are and what they do.

Later this year, we will release a product (not yet announced) that offers a way for a player to customize their character’s origin, including the option to change the ability score increases that come from being an elf, a dwarf, or one of D&D's many other playable folk. This option emphasizes that each person in the game is an individual with capabilities all their own.

Curse of Strahd included a people known as the Vistani and featured the Vistani heroine Ezmerelda. Regrettably, their depiction echoes some stereotypes associated with the Romani people in the real world. To rectify that, we’ve not only made changes to Curse of Strahd, but in two upcoming books, we will also show—working with a Romani consultant—the Vistani in a way that doesn’t rely on reductive tropes.
So basically moving away from stereotypes and making each race more complex than the sum of its racial genes.

Sounds good to me.
Posted June 27, 2020
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PetrusOctavianus: at least when the stereotype is actually correct.
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teceem: Where did you look it up? A stereotype is by definition incorrect. (I'm not saying that I have a problem with the use of stereotypes in games.)
Wiktionary https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/stereotype:
"A conventional, formulaic, and often oversimplified or exaggerated conception, opinion, or image of (a person)."
Posted June 27, 2020
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teceem: Where did you look it up? A stereotype is by definition incorrect. (I'm not saying that I have a problem with the use of stereotypes in games.)
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PetrusOctavianus: Wiktionary https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/stereotype:
"A conventional, formulaic, and often oversimplified or exaggerated conception, opinion, or image of (a person)."
Do you consider "oversimplified or exaggerated"... correct? (why else are you quoting wikipedia as a reply to what I said)
Posted June 27, 2020
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teceem: Where did you look it up? A stereotype is by definition incorrect. (I'm not saying that I have a problem with the use of stereotypes in games.)
Stereotypes are oft grounded in some(good or bad) aspect of a group though.

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teceem: Because you can pick a different avatar / character model / voice / .... Don't care about that? That's ok, people are different.
In games and media and beyond we are told to praise and desire diversity, and this is good. But then why do they try to make everyone in media the same in every way they can?
Posted June 27, 2020
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PetrusOctavianus: Wiktionary https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/stereotype:
"A conventional, formulaic, and often oversimplified or exaggerated conception, opinion, or image of (a person)."
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teceem: Do you consider "oversimplified or exaggerated"... correct? (why else are you quoting wikipedia as a reply to what I said)
I could swear you asked "Where did you look it up?" So I quoted the place I looked up.
Posted June 27, 2020
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rojimboo: So basically moving away from stereotypes and making each race more complex than the sum of its racial genes.

Sounds good to me.
People could do that already by modifying the rules and the like of their own games.

And it is good in a few aspects.

The problem a portion of people have is more with why it is being done and less about what is being done.
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This is my favourite topic
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General discussionUh, yeah, when PC-idiocy goes too far...(238 posts) (238 posts) 
(238 posts)