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General discussionPre-order: Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number(270 posts)(270 posts)
(270 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted February 25, 2015
A haze of neon carnage.



<span class="bold">Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number</span>, a conclusion to the psychotic saga, is now available to pre-order for Windows, Mac OS X and Linux, DRM-free on GOG.com with a 10% discount.

Limbs strewn everywhere, pulsating to the rhythmic thumping of a haunting (hauntingly good) mixtape. <span class="bold">Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number</span> is a conclusion to the maddeningly good saga that's conquered so many of our hearts, then left them bleeding out in the corner of a musty motel room. A quiet end, we should count ourselves lucky. Should have, because Hotline Miami is back with a thick, bloody vengeance. If there is one thing to love about the series (other than than the incredible soundtrack and gritty neon-laced setting), it's the precise, fast-paced gameplay which just got better and a bit more varied. There are new unique mask abilities like dual wielding or chainsaws (maybe dual-wielding chainsaws, if we're lucky), and seven new playable characters to make up this twisted part-prequel, part-sequel story of Jacket's aftermath.

If there was ever a good reason to pick up the bigger package, the <span class="bold">Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number Digital Special Edition</span> comes with the Remix EP and 6 unique tracks. An absolute treat, if you're into the Hotline musical stylings. Nothing's lost if you don't want to make the commitment just yet. You can always get the standard edition, and get the upgrade pack when it becomes available later on.

Once it's complete, all versions of the game will also come with a DRM-free Custom Level Editor to create your own maps and share them with friends. While you're waiting, make sure to grab the Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number Digital Comics for free!



Ring ring. It's <span class="bold">Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number</span>. Will you pick up? The pre-order is available now on GOG.com, with a 10% discount.











Why is Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number not available for pre-order in Australia?
Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number was refused classification by the Australian Classification Board - the classification and censorship body formed by the Australian Government - this means that we are legally unable to sell the game to our Australian customers. We hated to hear it as much as you do, but after thoughtful consideration we felt that by refusing to sell the game worldwide, we would effectively apply the Australian censorship to 190+ other countries in the world. That would be unfairly punishing not just to our customers, but also the developers who took a stand against censoring their game.
By preventing purchases from IP's located within the borders of Australia, we make sure that the smallest number of people are affected by the ban. It sucks, but we believe it's the least of all evils.
Post edited February 25, 2015 by Konrad
Posted February 25, 2015
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GOG.com: Why is Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number not available for pre-order in Australia?
Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number was refused classification by the Australian Classification Board - the classification and censorship body formed by the Australian Government - this means that we are legally unable to sell the game to our Australian customers. We hated to hear it as much as you do, but after thoughtful consideration we felt that by refusing to sell the game worldwide, we would effectively apply the Australian censorship to 190+ other countries in the world. That would be unfairly punishing not just to our customers, but also the developers who took a stand against censoring their game.
By preventing purchases from IP's located within the borders of Australia, we make sure that the smallest number of people are affected by the ban. It sucks, but we believe it's the least of all evils.
Wth? How's this different from the very loud and clear "we don't want region-locked movies" message the userbase sent? Does that really need an asterisk there with a "also applies to games" note at the bottom?
Posted February 25, 2015
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Gilozard: The problem with that point of view is that there are children online. Who purchase games. Good online age verification is not workable yet, and with DRM-free setups may not ever be. The argument of 'let adults choose' is reasonable as far as it goes, but it doesn't address the real world situation.

Yeah, laws get passed that treat people like children. Because a significant fraction of people online actually are children and need protection from their actual and biological inability to process life and make choices like rational adults.

In-person verification is a lot better for these kinds of games. If there was a law saying 'To get these games, you have to actually show up and purchase them in-store with ID', that would be OK. It won't prevent bad parents from failing their kids, but nothing will, and it would neatly address the protect kids / let adults choose dichotomy.
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CarrionCrow: Sounds like the problem of those with kids.

There are people, myself absolutely included, who don't want to have to deal with all the garbage associated with the "we need to protect the kids" perspective.

If I wanted to be concerned with that, I'd probably have had one of the crotchspawn by this point. ;)
Funnily enough, people who have kids, are related to kids, work with kids, or simply want all kids to grow up appropriately regardless of blood relationship don't want to deal with all the garbage associated with people who get mad about laws that protect people who are weaker and less capable.

If a society that doesn't make protecting children one of its goals is that important to you, I sincerely wish you good luck in founding and moving to a colony of like-minded childless people.

EDIT: FYI, almost all US old-age-related program funding is founded on using the younger working population to support the older, non-working population. Since you don't believe that protecting and nurturing kids is a societal issue, do you also plan on opting out of all the societal benefits that a stable younger generation brings such as Social Security, Medicare/Medicaid, a functioning economy and public services, etc, once you're not working? If not, I'm afraid that I have to inform you that you're likely a raging hypocrite.
Post edited February 26, 2015 by Gilozard
Posted February 26, 2015
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/424642/anger-over-rape-scene-in-hotline-miami-2/

http://wegotthiscovered.com/gaming/hotline-miami-2-dev-responds-australian-ban/

“How would you, as the developer, most like me to obtain your game?”
the fan asks in his email to Söderström.

“I was thinking that maybe I could torrent it and donate to you directly, but I’m not a fan of torrenting games and I don’t want to get in legal trouble.”

Söderström responded:
“If it ends up not being released in Australia, just pirate it after release. No need to send us money, just enjoy the game!”
Post edited February 26, 2015 by Klumpen0815
Posted February 26, 2015
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CarrionCrow: Sounds like the problem of those with kids.

There are people, myself absolutely included, who don't want to have to deal with all the garbage associated with the "we need to protect the kids" perspective.

If I wanted to be concerned with that, I'd probably have had one of the crotchspawn by this point. ;)
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Gilozard: Funnily enough, people who have kids, are related to kids, work with kids, or simply want all kids to grow up appropriately regardless of blood relationship don't want to deal with all the garbage associated with people who get mad about laws that protect people who are weaker and less capable.

If a society that doesn't make protecting children one of its goals is that important to you, I sincerely wish you good luck in founding and moving to a colony of like-minded childless people.

EDIT: FYI, almost all US old-age-related program funding is founded on using the younger working population to support the older, non-working population. Since you don't believe that protecting and nurturing kids is a societal issue, do you also plan on opting out of all the societal benefits that a stable younger generation brings such as Social Security, Medicare/Medicaid, firefighting services and police protection, once you're not working? If not, I'm afraid that I have to inform you that you're likely a raging hypocrite.
If people who have kids can't take care of those kids properly?

They shouldn't have them.

People's kids are their problem. If I was dumb enough to have one, it'd be my problem.

But I didn't. Thank the gods.

I can tell this is something you're very passionate about. You view the whole thing as something important and valuable to the whole of society.

I, on the other hand, am losing the ability to give a shit with each letter I type.

And so, before you get really, really wound up, let's take a second and agree to disagree. =)
Posted February 26, 2015
Hats off to the developer, who clearly have a vision. They did not remove the offending scene to satisfy critics nor alter it to better suit Australia’s rating board, and the email giving an Australian fan their blessing to outright pirate it tells me this is truly the game they wanted to make. I look forward to its release.
Posted February 26, 2015
What's the legal difference between Hotline Miami 2 and say Postal 1+2? Both Postal games are banned (RC refused classification) in Australia too, yet GOG decided to sell them to their Austrailan customers. Why start with HM2?
Posted February 26, 2015
considering the developer is actually condoning us to pirate the game, someone should shove this in the ratings boards collective faces. Who knows, I probably will soon if I want the game bad enough.
Posted February 26, 2015
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Gilozard: The problem with that point of view is that there are children online. Who purchase games. Good online age verification is not workable yet, and with DRM-free setups may not ever be.

Yeah, laws get passed that treat people like children. Because a significant fraction of people online actually are children and need protection from their actual and biological inability to process life and make choices like rational adults.
avatar
Gilozard: Funnily enough, people who have kids, are related to kids, work with kids, or simply want all kids to grow up appropriately regardless of blood relationship don't want to deal with all the garbage associated with people who get mad about laws that protect people who are weaker and less capable.

If a society that doesn't make protecting children one of its goals is that important to you, I sincerely wish you good luck in founding and moving to a colony of like-minded childless people.
How do children purchase games? with what/whose money? Don't they require a legal guardian consent to make a payment?
It's a parent responsibility of what his children does and how he educates him. Because otherwise we get to a horrenduos point in which our society is governed by a "protect the children" policy and almost all would be prohibited, we wouldnt have our freedom anymore.
That's a totalitarian society not a free one. And you, as a responsibile and concerned parent, shouldn't want to raise your children in a totalitarian society.

oh and by the way, those kids that murdered their colleagues didn't do it because they were playing some video game or watched some movie and got the inspiration from there. They did it because they had dysfunctional families/parenting and become sick in the head. They would have done it no matter what.
And also, no matter how much you try to prohibit some things by the power of law, in the end you cant eradicate death, sickness, killing and all that bad stuff, it's gonna happen no matter what. Remember, the humans as a specie is just another animal at its core, and that "civilization" is only a gloss.
Post edited February 26, 2015 by mobutu
Posted February 26, 2015
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Gilozard: Funnily enough, people who have kids, are related to kids, work with kids, or simply want all kids to grow up appropriately regardless of blood relationship don't want to deal with all the garbage associated with people who get mad about laws that protect people who are weaker and less capable.

If a society that doesn't make protecting children one of its goals is that important to you, I sincerely wish you good luck in founding and moving to a colony of like-minded childless people.

EDIT: FYI, almost all US old-age-related program funding is founded on using the younger working population to support the older, non-working population. Since you don't believe that protecting and nurturing kids is a societal issue, do you also plan on opting out of all the societal benefits that a stable younger generation brings such as Social Security, Medicare/Medicaid, firefighting services and police protection, once you're not working? If not, I'm afraid that I have to inform you that you're likely a raging hypocrite.
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CarrionCrow: If people who have kids can't take care of those kids properly?

They shouldn't have them.

People's kids are their problem. If I was dumb enough to have one, it'd be my problem.

But I didn't. Thank the gods.

I can tell this is something you're very passionate about. You view the whole thing as something important and valuable to the whole of society.

I, on the other hand, am losing the ability to give a shit with each letter I type.

And so, before you get really, really wound up, let's take a second and agree to disagree. =)
Don't worry, I'm not getting wound up.

The thing is - either raising kids is a societal issue, or it isn't. There are no 2 ways around this . It's a yes/no question. If you don't think it's a societal issue, are you planning to follow through with that, and not take part in the societal benefits that come from the kids other people raised? Or are you opting out of investing time and effort into something that you're planning on reaping the benefits of later?
Posted February 26, 2015
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GOG.com: By preventing purchases from IP's located within the borders of Australia, we make sure that the smallest number of people are affected by the ban. It sucks, but we believe it's the least of all evils.
And what about if someone gifted a copy to their Aussie friend? Would they be blocked from activating/running it? Or is the lock on purchasing it only?
Posted February 26, 2015
avatar
Gilozard: The problem with that point of view is that there are children online. Who purchase games. Good online age verification is not workable yet, and with DRM-free setups may not ever be.

Yeah, laws get passed that treat people like children. Because a significant fraction of people online actually are children and need protection from their actual and biological inability to process life and make choices like rational adults.
avatar
mobutu:
avatar
Gilozard: Funnily enough, people who have kids, are related to kids, work with kids, or simply want all kids to grow up appropriately regardless of blood relationship don't want to deal with all the garbage associated with people who get mad about laws that protect people who are weaker and less capable.

If a society that doesn't make protecting children one of its goals is that important to you, I sincerely wish you good luck in founding and moving to a colony of like-minded childless people.
avatar
mobutu: How do children purchase games? with what/whose money? Don't they require a legal guardian consent to make a payment?
It's a parent responsibility of what his children does and how he educates him. Because otherwise we get to a horrenduos point in which our society is governed by a "protect the children" policy and almost all would be prohibited, we wouldnt have our freedom anymore.
That's a totalitarian society not a free one. And you, as a responsibile and concerned parent, shouldn't want to raise your children in a totalitarian society.

oh and by the way, those kids that murdered their colleagues didn't do it because they were playing some video game or watched some movie and got the inspiration from there. They did it because they had dysfunctional families/parenting and become sick in the head. They would have done it no matter what.
And also, no matter how much you try to prohibit some things by the power of law, in the end you cant eradicate death, sickness, killing and all that bad stuff, it's gonna happen no matter what. Remember, the humans as a specie is just another animal at its core, and that "civilization" is only a gloss.
Most online shops don't require a guardian to consent, no. Because there's no way to know if the purchaser is who they say they are. The few app stores that do require some kind of permission only did so after massive outcry, and even then the parental permissions need to be setup to enforce it.

I have no idea what you're going on about with the rest of your post. I certainly didn't talk about kids murdering people for playing videos games.
Posted February 26, 2015
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GOG.com:
All right, after the initial reaction earlier, now read the whole thread and have a few very serious questions:

1. As others have asked, what is the difference between this game and the others already in the catalog that are also refused classification in Australia? Why can those be sold and this can't be? Later edit: And are there really no other countries in the world where selling this or any other game in the catalog is illegal? Why's it different in those cases then?

2. If you would sell the game there, what could the Australian authorities do to you? Block the site completely? Well, even if they'd do that, just imagine the backlash and the publicity worldwide!

3. If you can't legally sell the game, how about giving it away? You're not losing anything either way, so AU regional price = $0.00. Sure, there's the issue of VPNs, but that can already be said for RU too, so...

4. Going past all that, and if you won't do any of those and have solid reasons why not, which you'll detail here, will you at least mirror the developer's stance and officially encourage Australians to pirate the game, possibly by actually having a text saying so show up when people from there try to access the gamecard?

5. Since you have a significant number of users, a large visibility and can get some things moving, will you send some formal complaints regarding the matter to the Australian authorities and either write a petition about it or endorse an existing one, asking users to sign it?

Not that I care about a game that's regionally-priced anyway, but here we're talking of principles.
Post edited February 26, 2015 by Cavalary
Posted February 26, 2015
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GOG.com: Why is Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number not available for pre-order in Australia?
Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number was refused classification by the Australian Classification Board - the classification and censorship body formed by the Australian Government - this means that we are legally unable to sell the game to our Australian customers. We hated to hear it as much as you do, but after thoughtful consideration we felt that by refusing to sell the game worldwide, we would effectively apply the Australian censorship to 190+ other countries in the world. That would be unfairly punishing not just to our customers, but also the developers who took a stand against censoring their game.
By preventing purchases from IP's located within the borders of Australia, we make sure that the smallest number of people are affected by the ban. It sucks, but we believe it's the least of all evils.
avatar
Cavalary: Wth? How's this different from the very loud and clear "we don't want region-locked movies" message the userbase sent? Does that really need an asterisk there with a "also applies to games" note at the bottom?
Well, you can never tell until you ask: But I´m pretty sure that the result of an open voting dealing with "do you wanna have a game/ movie banned in one country but not banned in any other on GOG or not" would be a pretty clear "we want"
Posted February 26, 2015
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DarthCruciare: May I say for the record: fuck Australia's bullshit, fascist rating system. Makes me glad I live in Canada, where the ESRB is not the law, merely a suggestion. Who the fuck are these arrogant pricks to say "Oh, I find this objectionable, so the rest of you can't have it." Fuck that shit. This is the freedom that my grandparents fought in the war to protect? Bullshit. Their rating system needs to die in a fire. The ESRB for the most part is not the morals police, with the exception of the so-called controversy of the game Hatred, which is a rant for another time. The ESRB, unlike the Australian system, understands that people can make their own decisions as to whether or not content in a game is too intense for them or their children. Making this shit illegal is just going to encourage piracy if people are not allowed to purchase the game legitimately. If I was the creator of this game, I wouldn't care if gamers in Australia pirated my works if they weren't allowed to obtain it legitimately because at least my work is being seen.

That being said, soon as I saw this on the main page, this was an instant purchase for me, and having the option to upgrade later on is a huge breath of fresh air. Great job, GoG.
Down here in the states the ESRB tries like mad to give their voice the force of law.
Posted February 26, 2015
To get back to the original impending game release topic thing, a suggestion for GOG - putting the names of the artists on the special edition EP on the gamecard.
It'd be a quick and easy way for possible buyers to see what the extra money's for.
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Community
General discussionPre-order: Hotline Miami 2: Wrong Number(270 posts)(270 posts)
(270 posts)