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I'm 95% certain of the action I want to take, but since it would be rather vexing to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, I was hoping Nacho would still chime in without any input from me to go on first, to hopefully strengthen my resolve or make me rethink everything once again.

Since that doesn't seem likely to happen anytime soon, I figure one question for Trent at this point:
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trentonlf: I was hoping I would be the target last night, guess I don't get to use my 1 shot bulletproof. My stance has not changed, I still think Nacho is the last scum.
How certain are you that you didn't get to use your ability yet?

(Note, I don't intend to drag this out endlessly or needlessly, but figure it behooves me to consider all the angles one last time.)
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gogtrial34987: I'm 95% certain of the action I want to take, but since it would be rather vexing to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory, I was hoping Nacho would still chime in without any input from me to go on first, to hopefully strengthen my resolve or make me rethink everything once again.

Since that doesn't seem likely to happen anytime soon, I figure one question for Trent at this point:
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trentonlf: I was hoping I would be the target last night, guess I don't get to use my 1 shot bulletproof. My stance has not changed, I still think Nacho is the last scum.
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gogtrial34987: How certain are you that you didn't get to use your ability yet?

(Note, I don't intend to drag this out endlessly or needlessly, but figure it behooves me to consider all the angles one last time.)
My PM each night makes it clear that nothing has happened and I still set everything up to prevent anyone from harming me. I can't quote my PM directly, but there are all kinds of smurfy tricks I do to stay safe and I still do them every night. Bler makes it clear that my ability has not been used yet.
Trent is lying. I am the bulletproof.

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drealmer7: sure, but I'm not - can't blame you for keeping that in mind, of course

but now scum knows what they're up against and I'm dead tonight unless I can jail the person trying to kill me :|

I figure anyaway
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trentonlf: If this is the case I sure hope all the scum are just goons. If scum have a roleblocker then you can't prevent the kill with jailing.
If Trent actually was the bulletproof here, he would have known the setup; and while it's possible that he was trying to bluff and hide his role, I'm not sure why he would at this point.
And, for the record, I will return to the land of the living tomorrow.
Post edited November 27, 2016 by Nachomamma8
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Nachomamma8: Trent is lying. I am the bulletproof.

If Trent actually was the bulletproof here, he would have known the setup; and while it's possible that he was trying to bluff and hide his role, I'm not sure why he would at this point.
LOL, I was expecting this. Let me ask you a simple question, what is your role name and how do you go about protecting yourself.

As for setup, yes as soon as Brassas flipped the jailkeeper on Day 2 I knew the setup. The reason I unvoted Drealmer on Day 1 was because I believed his claim as Jailkeeper because at that point I knew we had a tracker or a jailkeeper,. And tell me why would I reveal that I knew the setup and was the bulletproof? The whole point to my role is to try and get a NK on me and that would not happen if it was known I was the bulletproof.
I guess my question was too hard to answer LOL
Trent & Nacho: Could you please both lay out why the other one must be scum? I want to make certain I'm not overlooking any arguments. (I can easily imagine an "Oh yeah, duh! That clinches it!" revelation.)

Also, I'm assuming at this point that you're both certain I'm town, right? Out of curiosity - and as far as you remember - what was the point you reached that conclusion?
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gogtrial34987: Trent & Nacho: Could you please both lay out why the other one must be scum? I want to make certain I'm not overlooking any arguments. (I can easily imagine an "Oh yeah, duh! That clinches it!" revelation.)

Also, I'm assuming at this point that you're both certain I'm town, right? Out of curiosity - and as far as you remember - what was the point you reached that conclusion?
If you were actually the last scum as soon as you got on this morning and saw I had voted Nacho you would have voted him to and won. But I had you as pretty solid town yesterday with Darko, you've been trying to do your best to find scum and figure out what is going on since Day 1.

As for Nacho, there is no Aha moment. For me it was clear yesterday by the way he tried to bus Drealmer but made a "mistake" in his vote and has been less active like he is trying to post less so he does not make any mistakes.

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Nachomamma8: Trent is lying. I am the bulletproof.

If Trent actually was the bulletproof here, he would have known the setup; and while it's possible that he was trying to bluff and hide his role, I'm not sure why he would at this point.
And, for the record, I will return to the land of the living tomorrow.
Still want answers to my questions.
The Now There's a Deadline Vote Count

Nacho (1): Trent

Not Voting (2): Trial, Nacho

Deadline is now set: Wed. 11/30 @ Noon pacific

Edit - deadline is subject to change.
Post edited November 27, 2016 by bler144
Bleh. Today is going to be an unexpectedly full day. Had hoped to make the decision tonight, but tomorrow is looking more likely, now.
Fellow townie: This means you have a more extensive opportunity to lay the heat on that scum to fully expose him and do my hard work for me, if you'd be so kind?! :)
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Nachomamma8: ...
I know you said your disappearances are RL interfering and I hope all is well, but you are doing exactly what you said you hate to do. Trying to lurk your way to victory as scum. I've been scum I know how hard it is to carefully word what you say and how much time it takes. I also know that very often because of how much time it takes that scum tend to lurk when RL intervenes because they can't focus like they need to. I answered your post yesterday within 12 minutes of you posting, and you have still not answered. You are not invested in playing and hope you can win by giving us as little time as possible to get any kind of response out of you.

I think gogtrial knows you are the scum, but if for some reason he chooses to side with you then you should be ashamed of your victory. Step up and play.
The Now There's a Sooner Deadline Vote Count

Nacho (1): Trent

Not Voting (2): Trial, Nacho

Deadline is now set: Wed. 11/30 @ roughly 7:30 am pacific: <48 hours

Edit: Additional note, all previously announced timelines/deadlines are subject to modification at mod's smurfiest discretion.
Post edited November 28, 2016 by bler144
Vote: Trentonlf

You should have read the matrix before you fakeclaimed because again, one-shot bulletproofs aren't informed of when they are hit or not. This leaves some ambiguity in when the night kill is missing N1 (so the JK doesn't know if they had anything to do with stopping the nightlkill), and whether the JK protected the bulletproof or not. I don't have a role name; I found a pet mouse that would throw a wrench in the plans of anyone attempting to harm me the first night. My nightly flavor is me going to sleep with my pet mouse by my side, there's not an update of whether I've been hit or not.

I understand (hope, at least) that this "you don't deserve the victory" piece is just a part of scum bravado; I wasn't aware that things were going to unfold in the way they did and I've been this gone in every site that I've played at. I don't think that one townie lurking means that the town deserves to lose and I don't think that you think that I've played particularly poorly considering that the entirety of the case you've managed to bring against me is "he's a lurker" and "he messed up a drealmer vote".
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drealmer7: The issue is that there is spectrum of balance for the variety of choices the setups entails. If each of us were to start speculating about what the 10th role might be, we very well could start revealing what we may or may not know about the matrix, and that is not something we want to do. Best to just scumhunt.

With that, I'm going to make a civil request.

We've got 10 players here, today. That is not many. Each of us should be participating. There should be no lurking.

There is trouble is smurfland, and we must all be smurfy to smurf out the unsmurfly.

Now, I know it's saturday and the game is just getting started, but come sayyyy, monday at some point, I'm going to start pushing on anyone I feel isn't giving enough in the hope to achieve a smurftopia. We even had a N0, so, yeh, monday. *looks at JMich and trent*
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trentonlf: Any particular reason you are trying to single out me and JMich? It's less than 24 hours since the game officially started and on a weekend. I'm sorry if I have other things to do and can't post every few hours to satisfy your desire of gabbing. Point of fact it is rare that I am inactive, and after Day 1 JMich gets more involved when there is actual info to go on. I don't appreciate the shade, and yes singling out me and JMich for possible lurking is shade when the game has only started.

My Darko vote was in jest, but shade casting already I find scummy.

Unvote DarkoD13
Vote drealmer7
Trent, can you explain the rationale behind this vote?

The reason why I think it's scum-motivated is because it seems like a vote that pretty luckily ended up on scum for something that really wasn't a good reason; Drealmer said that he's going to start pushing on lurkers in two days (while acknowledging that the game hadn't really gotten started); trent's response was to say that "you're singling out me and JMich, you're shading us, scum", and, to the best of my knowledge, that was his approach for the rest of the game. The number 1 thing that I look for as far as motivation is "does this seem like a genuine thought process? does this look like something someone would actually think?" and it doesn't really line up at all. I'll also note that it's pretty common for unexperienced scum to vote a partner far too early when they think they're flailing and here it makes sense; Drealmer is known for getting mislynched early a lot of the time, trent doesn't really have confidence in him to go the long game. It also makes sense because there wasn't really a counterwagon to drealmer for the entirety of the day and no real attempts to make one; this is a sign that scum was bussing or else during a day where no one was doing anything for the entire day it would have been trivial to jump on a townie's incorrect suspicion and get something started (Brasas's on Trial, mine on JMich).
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drealmer7: This totally feels like town trent. If I didn't know better, I'd be calling him scummy for these interactions (again, I wasn't throwing shade, I was pre-empting a potential issue - and normally I'd harp on him for this twisting and for being cold when I'm just trying to work together, but, no, this is town trent as I love him, pretty sure.)

And this is why I poke and push people. To get a read. And there I did. Weee! I love mafia!
Then there's this, which is drealmer's response to trent which also seems to be bending over backwards in order to townread him (and is also incidentally the first drealmer post that bothered me). The logic drealmer is presenting is that trent's approach towards him is wrong and misrepping but he's town as a result - as trent said, it's difficult to make up reasons to attack people, so if a townie is misrepresenting you and presenting the view of you completely out of whack, why would drealmer still townread him as a result?

I believe that all of drealmer's statement of "peace, here, let's have peace, calm down, let's be friends" is drealmer begging his buddy to stop bussing him; notice how his reaction to trent is completely different from his reaction to anyone else that's pushing him, can't really understand why it would be so... wanting to scumread him and not scumreading him unless it's coming from the perspective of scum who doesn't want to get stuck with him and his partner bussing each other for the entirety of Day 1.
Post edited November 28, 2016 by Nachomamma8
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trentonlf: Unless people actually start voting we are going to have a rushed lynch or no lynch happen and neither option is good for town, so vote for whoever you find to be scummiest!! Let's do this people!
And this is about the entirety of trent's play for the rest of Day 1. He found drealmer scummy, and yet I ended up doing more campaigning for drealmer than I did despite a weaker scumread there. He ignored Brasas's case on me and trial. He ignored drealmer OMGUS voting Lift and he ignored the exchange there, he even stopped his exchange with drealmer after drealmer said the "normally I'd call this scummy but you're town!" bit. He says that it's because he hates Day 1s, but, if you followed along with Oakwood Village at all (or if you do a little reviewing), he wasn't like that there; he was active, he contributed, he made theories, he commented on what was going on. There's no evidence of that here because he's scum and he didn't want to, he couldn't; when you're an active town player like trent is, you can't help but point out things that bother you, but somehow trent managed to spend the rest of his day talking about how he doesn't do drugs in video games and how everyone should vote but not so much of a suggestion on where they should vote.
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Nachomamma8: Vote: Trentonlf

You should have read the matrix before you fakeclaimed because again, one-shot bulletproofs aren't informed of when they are hit or not. This leaves some ambiguity in when the night kill is missing N1 (so the JK doesn't know if they had anything to do with stopping the nightlkill), and whether the JK protected the bulletproof or not. I don't have a role name; I found a pet mouse that would throw a wrench in the plans of anyone attempting to harm me the first night. My nightly flavor is me going to sleep with my pet mouse by my side, there's not an update of whether I've been hit or not.

I understand (hope, at least) that this "you don't deserve the victory" piece is just a part of scum bravado; I wasn't aware that things were going to unfold in the way they did and I've been this gone in every site that I've played at. I don't think that one townie lurking means that the town deserves to lose and I don't think that you think that I've played particularly poorly considering that the entirety of the case you've managed to bring against me is "he's a lurker" and "he messed up a drealmer vote".
I see you still don't want to attempt to say the role name, kind of hard when you don't know what it is. Smurf Village 1x Smurfproof, and there is no mouse for sure. I enjoy darting among the shadows and on occasion scaring others, and in my years of doing this I've acquired many tools and tricks to help me conceal myself and hide. Here's the key, I have a bunch of unspecified tools and tricks to survive one night assault. Doesn't matter what the assault is I can prevent it one time, and nothing has happened.

I've already explained my vote on drealmer, I found him trying to put me and JMich in a negative light early on as scummy. I would have voted anyone that did the same thing. Nice try trying to make a legitimate vote seem scummy, but it's a fail on your part.

Thank you for actually playing instead of lurking, I knew you had it in you.

Let me ask you a question, if you are the 1x bulletproof why would you vote for the person who claimed to be the jailer? On Day 1 all you know is there's a jailer or a tracker in the game, and then someone claims to jailer with no counter claim. At that point you have to remove your vote because the possibility is very high that he's telling the truth and is town, but you are insisting that you wanted to vote him. If you were the 1x bulletproof that vote makes no sense.

If you go back you'll notice I removed my vote on drealmer after he claimed jailer, I believed him at that time. If y'all had not killed Brasas I would have continued to believe drealmer. Your actions contradict what you are claiming.