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joelandsonja: I agree that this could have been a good solution, but I doubt that China would agree to such an arrangement. They probably told GOG flat out that if they sold that product they would be banned in China, so GOG [likely] made the right choice.
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GamezRanker: Since when does it matter if china agreed to it? Isn't gog a private polish company?

Also: removing the game for everyone and bowing to china is a good choice as long as they get more money?

(and it wouldn't matter if china blocked out GOG.....chinese could "move temporarily to the grand country of VeePheEhn" and still buy the game, meaning GOG would still have access to that market)
So you're suggesting that the people of China should just move to another country if they want to buy a game from GOG? That seems a lot more mean spirited to the people of China than simply refusing to sell one game. This decision has allowed the people of China to continue buying games from GOG, which seems like the much more humane way of doing business. Personally I hate the government of China, but I see nothing wrong with what GOG did ... but I am willing to be convinced otherwise.
Post edited December 17, 2020 by joelandsonja
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joelandsonja: So you're suggesting that the people of China should just move to another country if they want to buy a game from GOG?
I'm pretty sure most Chinese use VPN's now for obvious related reasons:-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_websites_blocked_in_mainland_China
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joelandsonja: So you're suggesting that the people of China should just move to another country if they want to buy a game from GOG?
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AB2012: I'm pretty sure most Chinese use VPN's now for obvious related reasons:-
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_websites_blocked_in_mainland_China
Yikes. That is one long list! It's a good thing GOG isn't on it.
Post edited December 17, 2020 by joelandsonja
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I have zero interest in buying or playing Devotion, but censoring a game because of politics is wrong. You might avoid a nation-state ban in the short term, but it will just make GOG more and more corrupt until its brand becomes irrelevant.

Please reverse this unethical decision immediately..

Thank you.
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I'm very disappointed at GOG and CDProjekt for this decision and it's very clear here and on other social medias that most people find this decision reprehensible as well.

I may not have hundreds of games in here but have long made the decision of buying here instead of at Steam when possible and have always recommended people to shop here for games. Companies are companies and all that but CDPR put forth the message of being different from Valve, EA, Activision and other companies, and all the good will they've nurtered over the years just crumbles in a week over bad decisions.

It would have been better to never know Devotion was trying to get on GOG over this embarrassing backtracking followed by a blatant lie.
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SmashManiac: I have zero interest in buying or playing Devotion, but censoring a game because of politics is wrong. You might avoid a nation-state ban in the short term, but it will just make GOG more and more corrupt until its brand becomes irrelevant.

Please reverse this unethical decision immediately..

Thank you.
I understand the sentiment with this statement, but wouldn't a national ban of GOG in China not only be bad for GOG, but also bad for the people of China? It seems to me that GOG actually did the right thing by not selling this game, because that's one less website that get's restricted in China. Why should the people of China have to suffer as a result of GOG's political protest?
Post edited December 17, 2020 by joelandsonja
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GOG/CDP would have been far better off leaving out the "after many messages from gamers" and just say that the CCP would ban GOG if Devotion were released here. That is, after all, true.

It's completely obvious spin, utterly counter productive and makes it look like they think we're morons who'd believe anything. China has a load of leverage, everyone knows it, and a leader whose fragile ego can't cope with being compared to a certain ursine resident of the 100 acre wood. The game being made in Taiwan is just icing on the cake. It being pulled for any other reason than that- such as actual gamer complaints- is laughable.
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joelandsonja: So you're suggesting that the people of China should just move to another country if they want to buy a game from GOG?
That's not what I meant.....though Post 77 seems to have gotten what I was (totally not) trying to say. ;)

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joelandsonja: That seems a lot more mean spirited to the people of China than simply refusing to sell one game.
Many people in china can get access to banned products and services easily, by "moving temporarily" as I said before....so even if china denied GOG from selling there, chinese people could still buy from GOG by "moving".

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joelandsonja: This decision has allowed the people of China to continue buying games from GOG, which seems like the much more humane way of doing business.
So it's humane to deny a game to everyone else?

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joelandsonja: Personally I see nothing wrong with what GOG did ... but I am willing to be convinced otherwise.
It's called standing up for one's principles.....the creators of south park did it when they made an episode mocking a "certain chinese person that I cannot name".

They then got banned in china, but chinese people can still watch their episodes and buy their stuff.....but with a different end result than the one GOG is getting: they still get money from chinese customers anyways, and didn't upset their other fans in the process.
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joelandsonja: I understand the sentiment with this statement, but wouldn't a national ban of GOG in China not only be bad for GOG, but also bad for the people of China?
As I said, before: they can get the goods and services anyways, even with national bans by their country.
Post edited December 17, 2020 by GamezRanker
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GOG submitting to the demands of the CCP? What fresh hell is this?

I thought to myself, "Surely GOG has more backbone than Steam, which already caved into the demands of the CCP?"

The Winged Hussars would not be scared of Winnie the Pooh and neither should GOG. Make your Polish ancestors proud, GOG!

Strike a blow against the oppressive forces of Winnie the Pooh and the CCP!

Release Devotion on GOG!
Post edited December 17, 2020 by StationaryNomad
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StationaryNomad: GOG submitting in to the demands of the CCP? What fresh hell is this?

I thought to myself, "Surely GOG has more backbone than Steam, which already caved into the demands of the CCP?"

The Winged Hussars would not be scared of Winnie the Pooh and neither should GOG. Make your Polish ancestors proud, GOG!

Strike a blow against the oppressive forces of Winnie the Pooh and the CCP!

Release Devotion on GOG!
I'm sorry, but I'm calling hypocrisy on this one. There are so many people who are upset about GOG's stance on selling this game, yet they think nothing of buying their slave made goods from China. Why is GOG expected to make some kind of political statement regarding this game when the general public has been supporting slave labour in China for decades. It makes zero sense.
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From all the people in the world, it have to be you, gOg, who performed the most pathetic colonoscopy with your tongue to your Chi-knees overlords.

I hope you choke with it.
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joelandsonja: I totally get that there are sensitive subjects when it comes to political matters, but when it comes down to it these companies should only be making decisions that are in the best interest of a company. I do agree that there's a lot of hypocrisy with the decisions made by some of these companies (like Disney), but it really isn't the responsibility of a company to get involved in political matters in the first place. It's GOG's primary responsibility to provide a product or service to their customers, but they really shouldn't have a say when it comes to making political statements.
From a purely logical point of view, that is what bending to China is.

Consider the userbase of say 100 million people worldwide who would buy from you, and then add a Billion people of which maybe a third (so, 300 million) would be buying games, that greatly increases potential profits.

Key word being 'Potential'. Honestly i doubt what appeals to western people would go towards Chinese audiences, and vice versa. So you either try to be everything for everyone and thus make bland content that might get more people, try to go for what the largest audience wants, or you make products for a userbase you know you can sell to.

Tough choice. Disney making their live action 'Mulan' failed with the Chinese (their target audience), and most western countries hate how they destroyed what they loved in the classic, so they failed everyone.

Eventually they will have to learn, what made them big and become a player, is what they should stick with and their audiance and not trying to be everything for everyone. Square Enix was totally surprised when small budget games that were heavily RPG based on their old titles did so well, and CapCom returning to the roots of remaking horror games in the vein of Resident Evil and good fighting games rather than adding more fluff, so the company that almost destroyed itself might be getting back to where it should be. (might).

If you look at it also, in Japan a movie came out, anime, Demon Slayer. I almost finished watching the anime series it's based on (and it's really good). And you know what? I see why it sells 100 million copies of the manga this year. It's true to itself, has no hidden agendas and is an excellent story. Then you look at DC/Marvel who are trying to be more and more woke and can't sell anything except classics, and are putting out reboot after reboot of their characters meanwhile destroying comicbook stores with copies of books they can't sell because most of the content is crap.

All these companies, need to grow a spine and stick with what works. The big numbers don't mean anything if the people reject your products. And twitter does not represent the majority of people, it represents a tiny fraction of people so absorbed in their own bubble of leftist propaganda that no one cares for, and if you try to add a hint of realism (men are not women tweet for example) you get banned.
Post edited December 17, 2020 by rtcvb32
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joelandsonja: I'm sorry, but I'm calling hypocrisy on this one. There are so many people who are upset about GOG's stance on selling this game, yet they think nothing of buying their slave made goods from China.
Some people have little choice and must buy the cheapest goods.....and usually they come from that part of the world.

Also what you said doesn't change the fact that this was likely a very poor move on GOG's part.
(to appease one country while upsetting many others, likely losing GOG more money than they would've lost if blocked in china)
Post edited December 17, 2020 by GamezRanker
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StationaryNomad: GOG submitting in to the demands of the CCP? What fresh hell is this?

I thought to myself, "Surely GOG has more backbone than Steam, which already caved into the demands of the CCP?"

The Winged Hussars would not be scared of Winnie the Pooh and neither should GOG. Make your Polish ancestors proud, GOG!

Strike a blow against the oppressive forces of Winnie the Pooh and the CCP!

Release Devotion on GOG!
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joelandsonja: I'm sorry, but I'm calling hypocrisy on this one. There are so many people who are upset about GOG's stance on selling this game, yet they think nothing of buying their slave made goods from China. Why is GOG expected to make some kind of political statement regarding this game when the general public has been supporting slave labour in China for decades. It makes zero sense.
It makes absolutely sense, if you look at the situation. Exhibit A: Someone gets something, possibly cheap, from China. Exhibit B: Someone doesn't get somenthing, due to China.
Still having difficulties to understand the dissimilarity between the two situations you seem to equate?

(On a side note, i agree with way many people being too eager to overlook and ignore exploitative labor practices if it means getting something for cheap. And that's not just specific to China, but basically global economy...)
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If this game is not available on steam then why would it be here? Can some explain this to me? I think it was their mistake that hey announce it in the first place.