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Pookina: Fine, let's do this thing.
Is that a reply to the above options?
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my name is sadde catte: Is that a reply to the above options?
No. But you know what:

Option 1 it is.
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Pookina: No. But you know what:

Option 1 it is.
Well we kind of have two votes for option 3, but it would be nice if we didn't have to drag it out.
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nmillar: Interesting how Joppo jumps to Pookina's defence here.
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Pookina: Alternative interpretation: Joppo is not jumping to my defense; rather, he held on to a solid lead against Microfish (evidenced by the fact he immediately voted him). That I was Micro's point of contention is coincidental.
A completely fictional lead, as we know Joppo was scum.
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nmillar: A completely fictional lead, as we know Joppo was scum.
Completely fictional lead in the sense that he knew Micro is Town? Yes. But to Townies, Micro did give a solid reason to be voted. A reason so good, that even scum latched on to it. And that's really my point: he was attacking Micro more so than defending me.

More than halfway through dedo's ISO now...
OK, I finished reading the great and almighty bat, dedoporno.

He's clean. No scratches, no dents, no grime or mud.

On to nmillar.
The first thing that catches my eyes about nmillar is that in this post,
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nmillar: I am quite disappointed that nobody has yet called me out for lurking. If I was scum, then you'll all have given me an easy ride to victory. Luckily for you, I'm not (you'll just have to take my word for it).

On that note, I'm calling out my fellow lurker.

Vote Micro
he complains that he wasn't given flak as lurking, and that if he was scum he would've been coasting his way to victory. Besides the fact he's manufacturing towniness (actually that's what the LAMIST abbreviation is for, right?) by calling himself out for a shortcoming, but he didn't just stop here, he went for everyone who didn't catch his shortcoming.

The next bit might be mental gymnastics but here goes: it might read like he's simply not wanting an easy scum game where Town obliterates each other, even if he's putting barely any effort in? So that's a thought.

----

Hmmm, interesting.
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ZFR: Did you guys not read joppo's post?

He knew he was hammering. He specifically wanted to end the day earlier so that dedo break takes place at Night and he doesnt get swamped with tons of posts while he's away. And since it was between him and Micro anyway, he preferred Micro.
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nmillar: Even Micro himself doesn't appear to have noticed that he's been lynched ...
If you go ISO nmillar, that's literally the second time you can find the word "Joppo" in his posts, and pretty much gives a lot more points to ZFR's theory that he didn't pay any attention to Joppo's whole thing. No wonder that next day, he talks about Joppo's hammer and not the whole thing with how he reacted to trent's flip.

----

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dedoporno: OK, one more finding that stands out and seems to supports the theory it's nmillar - he took part in every single mislynch that happened in the game and failed to join Joppo's wagon twice (on two separate days).
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nmillar: Oh, come on, give me some credit. I'm not that poor a player when I'm scum. I nearly always throw at least one of my scum buddies under the bus whenever I'm scum. Even a complete beginner would have seen that his scum buddy lynch was inevitable and make sure he was on the wagon.
From this Day. It sounds like he's been caught on his mistake, so he made an assertion that he wouldn't have hesitated as scum. The problem is...I don't have enough context to verify this assertion. I only remember playing twice with nmillar, the Kalunga game and this one, and he was scum in Kalunga; definitely not enough for me to relate to his playstyle. At best, it sounds like he's distancing himself from his play this game, and how he failed to take any sort of meaningful action on Joppo.

Earlier on, he points out the fact that he's the sole person not to vote Joppo either. Not sure what this case is usually called, but I'm feeling iffy about it now. Sounds like pointing out his mistake before anybody else does?

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Lifthrasil: Pooka: scummy. The statement 'I am myself' is strange. Since I am not. My PM says otherwise. His solid Town-reading of ZFR is a bit strange too, because 'scum ZFR wouldn't risk such a discussion.' We all have learned in the past, that scum do risky thing precisely to appear Towny because 'scum wouldn't do that'.
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nmillar: Okay, I'm about a third of the way through, and this sticks out, as reading through the early part of D1, there's a little bit of back and forth between Pookina and Joppo, which on the surface looks like fairly standard for D1 / RVS, but knowing Joppo's alignment now means this could be an attempt at reverse psychology by interacting with a fellow scum buddy.

The other thing that stands out is Pookina mentioning at the end of page 1 about wagon analysis, but I don't think I've seen any wagon analysis from him in this game?

Still 10 or 11 pages to go.
Lift is quoted in this post instead of Joppo, so I can't grasp what nmillar is up to. Not AI - I would like you to point to the correct post, nmillar.

----

With the blessing of being this late in the game and with most of the distractions removed: I'm more than likely going to vote nmillar at tomorrow noon. He doesn't really jive with me as a person who earned his Town cred; instead he's trying to make up for it by means that just feel forced rather than natural. Like he's trying too hard to appear Townie. Ironically, this would fit the theme of his character in this game: his continued absences making him feel utterly lacking, and his decisions as Mafioso (nightkilling Joe as pointed out by ZFR's theory, not bussing Joppo) firing back at him.

I just need to do one more read before I officially call it...Joppo.
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my name is sadde catte: Something seems amiss, there's... negative energy or perhaps a bad smell. Everything was pleasant until a moment ago, but now you feel sick.
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joppo: Joe? That was your doing, wasn't it?
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Pookina: Hi. I am myself.
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joppo: Nice to meet you, myself. I am Joppo

You look remarkably alike to a friend called Pooka. Is he a relative, by any chance?
This was what I was referring to by early interactions. The Lift quote was the correct one, as he pointed out the weird, "Hi. I am myself" post. It's difficult to quote multiple posts when using a mobile phone, so I stuck with the most pertinent one, and mentioned quite clearly about interactions between Joppo and Pookina early on page 1.
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nmillar: This was what I was referring to by early interactions. The Lift quote was the correct one, as he pointed out the weird, "Hi. I am myself" post. It's difficult to quote multiple posts when using a mobile phone, so I stuck with the most pertinent one, and mentioned quite clearly about interactions between Joppo and Pookina early on page 1.
OK, I see now. And you really think this is the breakthrough that would implicate me? It is as you admit yourself, D1 banter. How many times have you had D1 banter as a Townie with a Mafioso? I'm going to bet, and I knew that that's forbidden: a fucking lot.

But I'll play your game and focus on Joppo. You want a breakthrough? You've asked for it.

----

Huh. I think I struck gold.
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joppo: Hmm I see that Nmillar has called himself out on his and Micro's lurkiness. That is good and gives him a few townpoints.

But it doesn't make him Town. He even says how disappointed he was that no one had called him out yet. A scum!Nmillar would know that he could only ride that wave for so long, and if he had taken too long to surface then Town would be pretty critical of him.
There are two things to unpack about this post, from confirmed mafioso Joppo:
1. He gave townpoints for nmillar calling himself out.
2. He also says these townpoints aren't enough to make him Town.

Does this sound familiar? It sounds like a Mafioso who is praising their scumbuddy for something ("That is good and gives him a few townpoints") while also being cautious about it ("But it doesn't make him Town.").

In that post, he also mentions bucktooth, but this time he's not holding back the townpoints with a disclaimer similar to the one he had for nmillar:
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joppo: Bucktooth got a few townpoints for me due to his #335. It may look like "reverse OMGUS", but a scum!BTG could just not say anything and let ZFR continue focused on me. It would be an easy way to keep both of us from concentrating on the Mafia members (unless he is scum with ZFR, which also makes less sense to me than other theories)
Also before praising nmillar, there was this part of a previous post:
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joppo: Lastly, I wanna point out that we're totally not looking at Nmillar and Micro. Lurkers are dangerous if Mafia. We'd better not forget about them.
So for Joppo, it's really easy to gain townpoints as a lurker if you call yourself out on it...but they're also, and I quote, "dangerous." How does one go from "dangerous" to "gives him a few townpoints" with such ease? I'd expect it to be like going from "dangerous" to "neutral," honestly.
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nmillar: This was what I was referring to by early interactions. The Lift quote was the correct one, as he pointed out the weird, "Hi. I am myself" post. It's difficult to quote multiple posts when using a mobile phone, so I stuck with the most pertinent one, and mentioned quite clearly about interactions between Joppo and Pookina early on page 1.
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Pookina: OK, I see now. And you really think this is the breakthrough that would implicate me? It is as you admit yourself, D1 banter. How many times have you had D1 banter as a Townie with a Mafioso? I'm going to bet, and I knew that that's forbidden: a fucking lot.

But I'll play your game and focus on Joppo. You want a breakthrough? You've asked for it.

----

Huh. I think I struck gold.
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joppo: Hmm I see that Nmillar has called himself out on his and Micro's lurkiness. That is good and gives him a few townpoints.

But it doesn't make him Town. He even says how disappointed he was that no one had called him out yet. A scum!Nmillar would know that he could only ride that wave for so long, and if he had taken too long to surface then Town would be pretty critical of him.
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Pookina: There are two things to unpack about this post, from confirmed mafioso Joppo:
1. He gave townpoints for nmillar calling himself out.
2. He also says these townpoints aren't enough to make him Town.

Does this sound familiar? It sounds like a Mafioso who is praising their scumbuddy for something ("That is good and gives him a few townpoints") while also being cautious about it ("But it doesn't make him Town.").

In that post, he also mentions bucktooth, but this time he's not holding back the townpoints with a disclaimer similar to the one he had for nmillar:
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joppo: Bucktooth got a few townpoints for me due to his #335. It may look like "reverse OMGUS", but a scum!BTG could just not say anything and let ZFR continue focused on me. It would be an easy way to keep both of us from concentrating on the Mafia members (unless he is scum with ZFR, which also makes less sense to me than other theories)
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Pookina: Also before praising nmillar, there was this part of a previous post:
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joppo: Lastly, I wanna point out that we're totally not looking at Nmillar and Micro. Lurkers are dangerous if Mafia. We'd better not forget about them.
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Pookina: So for Joppo, it's really easy to gain townpoints as a lurker if you call yourself out on it...but they're also, and I quote, "dangerous." How does one go from "dangerous" to "gives him a few townpoints" with such ease? I'd expect it to be like going from "dangerous" to "neutral," honestly.
No, not the sole reason. I've pointed out a few suspect things in today's posts.

In your latest post you're using as evidence, the same kind of stuff you dismissed me using earlier. How is this any different from Joppo defending you?
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nmillar: No, not the sole reason. I've pointed out a few suspect things in today's posts.

In your latest post you're using as evidence, the same kind of stuff you dismissed me using earlier. How is this any different from Joppo defending you?
Good question.

Look at the Joppo post that I quoted, and the one that you quoted. If you're attentive enough, you will notice that one post has something that the other doesn't.

That's right. The one you quoted has a vote - meant for Microfish's faulty reasoning. So while he said that he agreed with my reasoning in that post, it was merely an aside to the big ordeal of that post: voting Microfish.

Meanwhile, the post I quoted? It doesn't have any of that noise. None. Zilch. Nada. He's not confronting anyone's faulty logic. He's putting down his "reads" without any interference.

Here, I'll do you all a favor. This is the post nmillar uses against me:
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Microfish_1: You say you can't townread him, but you don't say anything about scum reading him.
vote pooka
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joppo: What? I don't know what you consider it, but for me townreading and scumreading are just two sides of the same coin. In past games I always said "I scumread player Y like this" and after that I listed where in the town-mafia scale they fell. Sometimes fiercely in the towny side.

So I have to say that Pooka's explanation makes sense and your jump on him feels like a half-assed attempt to shade.

I don't like voting on D1 because we don't have any certainty. But I'm feeling bold, so
Vote Micro
This is the post I'm using against nmillar:
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joppo: Hmm I see that Nmillar has called himself out on his and Micro's lurkiness. That is good and gives him a few townpoints.

But it doesn't make him Town. He even says how disappointed he was that no one had called him out yet. A scum!Nmillar would know that he could only ride that wave for so long, and if he had taken too long to surface then Town would be pretty critical of him.

Bucktooth got a few townpoints for me due to his #335. It may look like "reverse OMGUS", but a scum!BTG could just not say anything and let ZFR continue focused on me. It would be an easy way to keep both of us from concentrating on the Mafia members (unless he is scum with ZFR, which also makes less sense to me than other theories)
Pay attention to the differences between them.
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Pookina: On a quick read, it's dedo who first caught Joppo's slip. Knowing that he is alive right now even after nearly every one else has been kicked off, kind of gives me some bad thoughts. That maybe the reason he caught the slip as smoothly as he did was because he and Joppo discussed it during the Night, and planned a course of action so dedo may look Townier.

On the other hand, we have nmillar who showed how clueless he was about the reason for lynching Joppo. But if he's scumbuddies with Joppo, would he be that clueless about what his scumbuddy is up to? It could be WIFOM, and it could be that he was so busy he didn't even talk with him in the scum chats when he had the chance.

Gotta say, both of you are just fishy at this point, but only one of you isn't a delicious tunabeef.
This is the final nail in the coffin for me. You have suspicions of both myself and dedo at this stage, but in your ISO you find nothing?

No reason to drag this out, as it's only.going to go one of two ways, and if dedo is scum, then we'll played. A very brave move outing your scum buddy so early if true.

Vote Pookina
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nmillar: This is the final nail in the coffin for me. You have suspicions of both myself and dedo at this stage, but in your ISO you find nothing?
You're not really trying hard, aren't you? Yes, I was suspicious of dedo staying alive at the beginning of the Day. By the time I made the ISO, I couldn't find a single thing to fault him for, and thus my suspicions of him have poofed.

I...don't really think I need to say this? Isn't it obvious that if I find nothing incriminating in an ISO, then my earlier suspicions are canceled out? Isn't that common sense, or did I miss something critical here?

Either way, I see that a card was played. I don't think I have anything more to contribute, so I think I can do this with a good conscience, now.

Vote nmillar
Oh wow, this escalated quckly.

I still haven't made my mind up and I'm wrapping the final presents right now, almost finished, I'll be back shortly.
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nmillar: This is the final nail in the coffin for me. You have suspicions of both myself and dedo at this stage, but in your ISO you find nothing?
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Pookina: You're not really trying hard, aren't you? Yes, I was suspicious of dedo staying alive at the beginning of the Day. By the time I made the ISO, I couldn't find a single thing to fault him for, and thus my suspicions of him have poofed.

I...don't really think I need to say this? Isn't it obvious that if I find nothing incriminating in an ISO, then my earlier suspicions are canceled out? Isn't that common sense, or did I miss something critical here?

Either way, I see that a card was played. I don't think I have anything more to contribute, so I think I can do this with a good conscience, now.

Vote nmillar
My point is that you didn't validate either why you thought dedo would be the subject of the NK, and subsequently haven't provided any reasons for dropping your suspicions entirely. That coupled with the Joppo defence, and the weird posts that Lift highlighted from D1 are enough for me.

Also, the comment about Joppo casting a vote for another player making the whole defence thing null and void seems very odd. You pointed out yourself that Trent was targeting you at the time, which you've put down to pure coincidence, and I hadn't even considered that until you mentioned it.

So thats you using the "pointing out your own mistakes before anyone notices" strategy too. Well, Joppo's mistake here rather than yours, and it's not like he hasn't slipped up already.