Small recap. So far we had 3 role claims (one of them a flip), and 6 people who claim to have been targets. At least one target flavor does not match the action claimed to be taken. 4 actions appear to be investigative, though they also seem like double actions.

Now to start making the night timeline.

I believe Trent is on the brink now. Do we need more time? I think pretty much everyone except HijacK had a chance to make an appearance, so it seems he is the only potential for a flash vote.

I don't there is a need to resort to that just yet.

Side note - Leonard's vote moves us to L-1 by my count.

While Trent may well be where we should end the day, he's already claimed and I think we're moving a bit fast to actually end it.

Can we get someone to volunteer to step off the wagon while debate/discussion continues?

First, I'd like to address the twisted game statement.
As screwy as a townie being assigned to support the SK was, that was about the only real problem I see with last game's setup. JMich probably should have been a third party alignment instead of town. It still did have some logic, when the setup as a whole is viewed; most of town didn't need to kill JMich, just Flub and Mafia. JMich needed to kill Mafia but NOT Flub.

As for this game: do you seriously think Yog was out to screw town out of any chance of victory? Also recall that Cristigale reviewed the setup, and presumably signed off on it. There is probably logic here too, even if it isn't immediately apparent from our view of maybe half the setup (if that). Yog is smart enough to know we won't let him forget it if he bitches endlessly about seemingly unfair setups and then goes off and makes a massively skewed setup himself.

Now, as for people lying their asses off about last night:
-We have a dead vanilla, so this game isn't straight role madness. Of course, maybe he is just THE town vanilla.
-We've apparently got a role blocker running around. Since Leonard's flavor seems to have left him vulnerable, then the dart thrower probably isn't a jailer. One Night Action (NA).
-We've got two claims of packs being searched, with minor theft in one case. Three NA total.
-We've got two claims of mind reading, with no knowledge on what was actually read. Five NA total.
-We've got a dead role cop. He might have been a pack searcher, or he (as cleric) might have been a mind reader.
-We've got a tracker claim, and the trackee has claimed to have heard some of the same events the tracker initially reported. Six NA total.
-We've got a claim of noticed protection. This is probably a doctor, possibly a jailer (if Lift couldn't do anything). I'm not asking for clarification here; I think enough damage has been done if we aren't going to mass claim. If scum have a role cop (as has been speculated), then they've already got a big head start on sniffing out the possibilities; don't make it worse. Seven NA total.

-And we've got a bodyguard claim. He claimed to take a night action, but his target apparently didn't see it. 8 NA total.

With 8 different claims about night actions that have been taken (9 if you include NK), I don't see how all of them can be lying. If RW's target knew they were targeted and have already revealed such, then that leaves 7-8 people that are scum or lying townies (unless scum can take lots of actions in one night). How's THAT for a bastard game? Town would have been virtually guaranteed a loss, especially with at least one vanilla on their side.
Maybe people are lying their asses off. Who is doing so, and why? You can only credit up to 4 with actively lying because they are scum before I'll laugh at you.

So Trent, here we are. Assuming you are telling the truth about your role and night action, and assuming your bodyguard role works like this one, Dedo might not have been informed about your "protection" because you aren't actually doing anything to him; if someone went to drop a rock on his head, presumably you'd jump in the way or something and die for him. Maybe there is some other reason Dedo didn't see it (some kind of bus driver).

When looking at all of the claims, however, yours is the one that is not like the others; every other claim so far indicates the target notices they've been targeted (including a protection claim). After Dedo challenged you, your account of flavor events matches up to his with two exceptions. 1) You say you didn't see anyone (he isn't sure if you actually saw a person), and 2) You name the role that allowed you to visit him. Maybe you're telling the truth about your action not being detected by the target. How are the rest of us supposed to know the difference? It will break the rule "all night actions are detected by the target" if your action isn't detected, and that seems like useful information to know if we can confirm it without yet another player claiming.

Since you first said "Nothing at all happened last night for me", then later admit to taking a night action as well as saying "I did hear a stone crash last night and drew my knife, but nothing happened" it appears to me you've been caught in an active lie. So I'm bringing up Lynch All Liars.

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Side note: One interesting thing I noticed is that Leonard's claim seems to be supported by the Day 2 daybreak post. I don't know if Yog threw that in for fun, or if Leonard saw that and decided to capitalize. Something to consider in future days, if there is time.

Ignore my previous post's numbers, I had forgotten about Leonard's claim to have been targeted. Wyrm has a much better account of what seems to have happened.

Your friendly neighborhood LAMIST is on the way ;)

unvote trentonlf

I think Wyrm's analysis is quite on point.

How many times have you threatened some sort of "I will keep my eye on you!" to me this game. This is at least #3. I find it a bit odd you keep announcing I'm setting off major alarm bells and then don't follow up with an actual case. You should do what JMich did last game in response to my posts, either a:

/headdesk, or
"Really? AAARGGGH!"

Those are more or less actual quotes. That would be the entirety of his post, even. 'Twas quite amusing. Anyway you can make it clear my differing views on strategy are infuriating without consistently suggesting FoS. Otherwise, please make an actual case against me and stop just throwing shade. It just seems like you want to keep dangling me in FoS for some future time when it will be useful to you. Few minor notes:

1) I didn't say we "needed" it nor have I asked anyone else to claim, I just suggested we discuss the merits of the strategy while we wait for the remaining silent voices to weigh in on dedo and trent. FWIW, I think you would have liked the suggestion I edited out even less, but there's enough on the table that I'll leave that option on the side for now.
2) While I agree that we probably end D2 settling the Dedo/Trent issue one way or other, I think it's risky just to rush through it, and at least discussing alternative options to "lynch Trent OR dedo" may give us some perspective.
3) Step back and look at the field. There are as many as 4 cops given the claims, at least one of which is almost certainly non-town. In addition there seems to be a role-blocker in play. If one assumes the role blocker is scum, in conjunction with the fact that investigators leave a calling card, the role blocker is effectively also a lightweight investigator.

With dedo/trent both on the table, at least one of whom is telling the truth, scum have at least one target for N2 already. Decent chance they ID 1-2 more tonight or at least thin the pool enough they have no lack of viable targets going forward. If one assumes Trent might flip town and dedo eats the NK, town could be down 4 votes and votes start to weigh as much as power roles anyway.

FWIW, I wouldn't have suggested this but for the fact that we already have two claims of power roles on the table and the likelihood that scum know quite a bit going into D3 anyway. I won't go as far as the situation being dire, but at this point the game seems to hinge on which way Trent flips.

Personally from a town perspective I'd like to add some insurance rather than risk the house on that, no matter how much my gut tells me he's lying.

Final note: The "creating a laundry list" for scum works if you assume town has a few power roles clearly worth more than others. The evidence on the table tends to me suggest town has a larger number of less valuable roles, and that at this point the safer play is to use the number advantage. The fact that night actions leave calling cards will also make it harder to bluff.

The party marched onward, guided by the wizard’s gently glowing staff. Deeper and deeper they went into the murk, pausing only occasionally to do battle with the odd goblin scout that crossed their path, enjoy a light snack, and relieve themselves when needed. The wizard was mostly silent as he concentrated on finding the right path through this most evil and dangerous of demonic strongholds.

The adventurers kept at the wary, but the days of having a cohesive party were over. They turned on each other, flinging accusations of nighttime spying and larceny and skullduggery. Already, trentonlf was under strong suspicion, arguing vehemently and protesting his innocence, as a group of his fellow adventurers angrily demanded explanation.

The wizard observed, but continued to say little.

Still, there were other conversations that occurred. One such was this:

Lifthrasil: Hey, did you notice something?
Bler144: What’s that?
L: Well, when the dwarf died… I mean… did you notice how short he was, and how long that beard was?
B: Sure, I mean, of course. He was a dwarf. He was just dwarfin’, you know, how dwarves do.
L: Yeah, of course, but I mean… did you notice that… before? I mean, before he died?
B: Notice what? The beard?
L: Yeah, the beard, the stature… the whole package really.
B: Hmmmm. I’m not sure where you’re going with this.
L: What I’m saying is, did you or did you not notice Doradon was a dwarf before he died?
B: Now that you mention it… hey! I had no idea! Like, none, none at all! No clue!
L: That’s what I’m saying! Me neither! Like, how is that possible?
B: I dunno… I mean I can clearly see that you’re… you’re… actually, what are you?
L: What am I? What are YOU? I can’t even… I can’t even…
B: Wait, what’s your PER stat?
L: Oh, well, it’s… it’s… uh. Ahhhh. Uh, that’s funny, let me check my character sheet…
B: Oh, good idea, let’s see, what did I roll… let’s see…
L: Holy shit. I don’t have a PER stat.
B: Oh my god, I don’t either. Hey, flubbucket, what’s your PER stat?
F: Rrrr GrR ara raA Rrrrrr UurrR!!
L: So… NONE of us have a PER stat?

Despondently, bler leaned against the dungeon wall, resting his hand only inches from a hidden switch, that had it been pushed, would have opened into a chamber containing unimaginable wealth. “How is that even possible?” he moaned.

Lift patted him on the shoulder, and they continued onward.

_____

OFFICIAL “START OF DAY TWO, END OF DAY TWO?” VOTE COUNT

trentonlf – 4 (Lifthrasil, flubbucket, Bookwyrm627, Leonard03)

Not voting – HijacK, JMich, CSPVG, QuadrAlien, dedoporno, bler144, trentonlf

With 11 alive, it takes 6 to lynch

Closest to lynch is trentonlf at L-2

There is not yet a deadline.
_____

And what insurance might that be?

I noticed a few minutes later that flavor indicated QuadrAlien stunk especially bad, and later he reported about troll droppings, so flavor might be indicative of things going on. I'm not sure if we'll be able to do anything but figure it out after the fact though; Yog had some serious fun with my PM related flavor (no, I'm not sharing specifics at this point).

It's been 11 minutes so this should be ok.

I wanted to be clear that I'm not against discussion. But I don't think we should move away from this, it needs to be resolved. If something else comes up, well yes, but I don't think we should just go around randomly looking for something to talk about when we have this.

Last game we lynched CSP on D4. Had we lynched Yog on D5 as you suggest here, the SK would have won. So...technically true it would have nailed a scum, but still would have been a town loss.

On the L-1 issue, sure, if Trent is scum there's no issue sitting at L-1. If, however, Trent is town, then hovering at L-1 makes it easy for scum to slip in a hammer and take a commanding lead. Then you do a "whoops, didn't know I was the hammer - sorry!"

Sitting at L-1 is risky, especially quite this early in discussion. I think he's scum, but don't "know" it, so personally I'd prefer to not have my toes dangling over the edge.

The only thing I'm concerned about in terms of someone hammering hastily is that we still may want to discuss something else. I'm not moving away from this wagon (ultimately that is) and I suggest we go through with it. More time for us has the negative side effect for scum having more time to try and wiggle their buddy out in the process. Or at least set up for better trades during the upcoming night. And we don't want that. So, once again, what was that insurance you mentioned?

I wasn't ignoring you, I was locked out of responding by the clock initially and went off to do actual work.

The notion of 'insurance' is that if Trent does flip town, you're the NK and town starts D3 basically with nothing more than they had on D2. Sharing roles potentially gives us something concrete that can be verified N2.

I also do tend to think there are 3-4 cops of some shape or other. Not sure what else to make of those visits, and I think it was risky for people to make those claims before the tracker came forward. For example, I'd initially considered it possible Leonard was bluffing (would make a good cover if he were the role blocker), but on further consideration I tend to think most if not all the claims of being visited are true.

Now, I think there's a good chance Trent is one of the cops, but if he's not then someone else visited you. Personally I think there's insurance in knowing now. Of course, you are correct that if Trent IS scum, then a mass claim probably would be better on D3 since scum would likely be down an investigator. My point is that if he's not, town is going to be on the brink when D3 dawns.

TLDR: If Trent flips scum, I think town loses a little by claiming on D2, but not much, and potentially gains quite a bit. If Trent flips town and we didn't claim on D2, I think we're up against it.

Thus, insurance. Of course, y'all are welcome to disagree, but from my perspective I think it's the stronger play in the net. I don't particularly want to claim, I just think it's the strategic move.