Pretty sure all my questions are amazing.

You make an interesting argument.

For the sake of clarity, are you expecting Trent to up and tell us a) whether he mussed with the wagon and if so how he did it, or b) are you banking on discerning it from his flip?

Pffff. So modest. :P

Don't I always?

That would be an interesting claim. Honestly, no I was not even aiming for that since it makes little sense for him to even claim such a thing. You see, if he claims that I'm calling his fate sealed. Regardless of alignment dabbling with flips in such a way to confuse town is inexcusable. People would be all over him.

I'm trying to discern it from his flip. Of course there may be someone else out there who tampered with flips, and if that one tampers with trent's flip as well it will make me either look bad since they did it really incognito, or they'll unravel themselves by providing us with more info (i.e. trent's wagon, reasons for voting, day interactions).

Ok. It seems optimistic (I already made the corrupt PR agent joke), since I think best case scenario is probably something vague like "utility droid" (or whatever the equivalent is in this flavor) rather than "He who changed just that one particular flip."

Thus, I'm not sure I hold the same optimism, but by the same token I don't really see how his flip would make you look bad, esp. given that he hasn't even claimed yet and you're just voting on a theory. Barring other evidence, I also tend to believe all the flips except adalia's.

I think the better rational argument for Trent over Ix is something else entirely that has little to do with flips, but I'll keep it in my pocket until everyone has checked in and it's more clear what we're doing today.

My preference would still be Ix today and Trent tomorrow. But I could also be pretty easily swayed to making them both claim and then making a decision from there.

We focus on different aspects of the game. I find the mystery around mechanics a lot more enticing. Ix is just weird, but then again a lot of stuff and people are weird this game. Trent as well.

Oh, I find the mechanics enticing. Given what we've seen so far I'm just not sure there's a single play that's going to make it all apparent.

If I learned any lesson from yogs' game it's that I shouldn't let my theories about mechanics, no matter how much I may like them, get in the way of putting one foot in front of the other.

This

Curious if you'll answer two questions.

#1 ) At the moment we have 2 jailer/blockers. Is this a slip that you're aware of a 3rd? That's certainly what it looks like. What's your alternative explanation for whatever it is you're trying to argue here.

#2) The bolded part is quite curious. Between the two wagons, all 12 surviving players were on one or the other. Why are you saying there are only a few townies? What evidence is on the table or what do you know that would suggest that? Were there townies on one wagon or other that were not somehow "swept up in it"?


Ix isn't just weird, people.

Uhhhh, what? Yogsloth is dead and SCUM?!?! (and not "apparently", I like that detail pickup, HijacK, and will re-evaluate the things thinking with that detail distinguisher and see if I think it actually means something.) This is...interesting...and quite a bit disconcerting, as, now I feel totally lost and before I was feeling pretty good about things.

I think I need to go back and read the entirety of the game from the beginning to get my bearings at this point. You are all on a clean slate with me currently. Which of course in my book means: you're all SUSPECT. *paranoia abundant*

I think I'm ready to

VOTE #3

and get the national guard up in here to sort this mess out. Can we do that, please?

Give me like, a day to re-read all of this shite.

Possible, but the more I think about it it seems unlikely, at least if the assumption is that it's a way to explain how we just have 1 team. You'd still need to account for other mechanics/issues:

1) It it's a single 4 person team, yogs bussed not just 1 but 2 teammates, and that team has 2 jailers, a vanilla, and a ??. Weird comp is the issue more than whether yogs would bus half his team.
2) If it's a single 5 person team wth does town have to offset that?

The other thing that would seem to make a 5 person team unlikely is the scaling - remember Lift's design was "12 or 16."
Seems unlikely the 12 person design would have had 4 scum (full 1/3), or that moving from 12 to 16 would have added 2.

Two seems more likely than one 5 person team, and if it's a 4 person team it's an odd one.

And REALLY curious for Ix to address the questions above where it really looks like he slipped out actual awareness of a 3rd team. I really don't know how else to read his post.

In re-reading him I also noticed something else curious - today in D4 he called me out for "bailing on adalia's wagon." Aside from how that's factually wrong, he actually responded to me on that issue in post #994 where he didn't seem to have any problem with me stepping off temporarily at the time, whereas now he's spinning it as scummy.

Seems...opportunistic rather than honest.

Just as an FYI, my schedule tomorrow is a bit weird. I may get a quick check-in in the a.m., and then probably not til my layover closer to dinner time. And even that assumes I don't run into colleagues at the airport.

How likely do you find a third team to exist? Also, how does the possibility of 3 jailers existing indicate there are 3 scum teams? He never actually said 3 scum teams. He said 2. How do you know the role is an indication of faction?

Talk about slips.

unvote trent
vote bler

Care to elaborate? Your nit picking isn't any less opportunistic. Read his post in correlation to his older posts where he argued against the existence of 2 teams where (booky?) said there have been more roleblockers in past games and that never correlated to multiple scum teams.

Also, I'm still waiting for a decent defense from trent. I think I may have nailed 2 scum in one go.

A decent defense for what? I was all over yogs on day 1 for his play but most of everyone else was like "it's just yogs being yogs", the only other person who really found it as scummy as me was flubbucket. So of course yogs got a pass for several days because of it. Then on day 1 P1na slipped up with his Mafia joke and I voted for him right off and we lynched scum.

Adaliabooks and Leonard both tried to say we were doing a bad lynch and I found that odd. So when day 2 started they were my top two suspects. When Leonard claimed town jailer I thought adaliabooks was a better option for lynch. If adaliabooks flipped scum then Leonard was scum too. Then adaliabooks claimed an odd neutral role and was the policy lynch. After he flipped town vanilla it was obvious someone tampered with his flip.

So when day 3 started I voted Leonard since he was the one under most suspicion after day 2. Then Bookwyrm started to see the inconsistencies from yogs and started pushing for his lynch. I still felt yogs was scummy, especially after he made the comment he made of "trust no flips", a comment that was made before we had any reason to doubt flips. He had knowledge no one else did and so I switched my vote to him. He then claimed town jailer, but he waited until Leinard was lynched to claim it. I would guess to make sure Leonard really wasn't the town jailer and it was safe to claim it.

So when day 3 started I was unsure who to look at after yogs was the night kill, then Ix started a campaign against me using knowledge no one else seems to have and I found hat scummy and voted him.

I have been trying to find scum this whole game, and will continue to do my best to find whoever the scum is. So exactly what I need to defend I have no idea as I don't see anything I've done wrong.

Aware of a 3rd? No (I just soft-unclaimed LOL ;) ). But initially I had commented that I thought I would have found 2 to be a high number if I hadn't just played in a game with 2 and 3 or more I thought would be absurd. However knowing we've had 2 scum jailers / roleblockers already, I'd HOPE there's a counter for that out there somewhere.

And the "few townies" comment is from the nature of the wagons yesterday. It's sort of summed up in the quote of mine above.

Yog was scum hunting other scum. As soon as leonard was in serious danger and trenton was mentioned as the next target we had a clear break in the wagons. The timing of it was crazy. We COULD go looking for the scum voting along with yog but it's much easier to see that one faction broke off and turned on yog pretty suddenly. And then night killed him because he was going to have the numbers today to do serious damage.

I mentioned what I thought was the previous slip of trenton and so he's my "most likely" on the even more likely wagon (in this case, the wagon that formed AFTER trenton was mentioned as "next up").

I also really want to do trenton today because of my top suspects he was the only one on adalia's wagon - IF scum have the ability to muck with flips (and it wasn't just adalia having a neutral role false flip) I'm assuming it comes from being on the wagon / hammering and I REALLY don't want to try and lynch another suspect when trenton is still alive and he can potentially alter the flip.

That's very thin logic on your part. I don't know that there are 3 jailers, nor did I say there are 3 jailers. Ix is the one who talked about 3 jailers. I said what he said looks like a slip. You're now saying me saying it looks like he made a slip is scummy, but you saying me saying he made a slip is not scummy?

It also appears possible you have some relationship to Ix and are coming to his defense.

Consider the end of D3. You waffled on which way to vote for what, 36-48 hours? Then I make a post about how we should discuss whether to conclude the day, or see if Ix gets mod-killed (and in my belief, flips scum).

Without commenting on that issue, less than an hour later you post to hammer Leonard. Question of Ix's alignment or whether we should let him be mod-killed avoided. Is that thin? Sure, but not as thin as what you're throwing out.

When in doubt, go for obfuscation and non-answers.

All of this is fine as far as it goes, but it doesn't at all answer why you said you brought up 3 jailers as non-insane, rather than 2, nor why you said "a few townies" were caught up.

Yes, I get that yogs could be scum and be scum hunting. Great. Why only a few townies given that everyone was on one wagon or the other. Was your point that there are only a few towniers, or that, of all the townies, only a few of them were "caught up"? And if so, what were the other townies doing?