It seems that you're using an outdated browser. Some things may not work as they should (or don't work at all).
We suggest you upgrade newer and better browser like: Chrome, Firefox, Internet Explorer or Opera

×
avatar
Lifthrasil: [...] But what about you? As usual, you ask a lot of questions but you don't share much of your own suspicions. So, who are your main suspects and why? [...]
avatar
HypersomniacLive: Almost sounds like it bothers you that I'm not more open so you can't adjust your play to get off my radar.
You're a smart person, Lifthrasil, does it really come as a surprise that you're my main suspect at the moment after the way I've questioned you since the start of D2?
No, that bothers me, like it bothers me in every game we play together, because you attack everyone for every perceived mistake they make without ever revealing anything of yourself. That is especially bothersome when you are scum. You hide behind walls of questions just like flubb hides behind being useless. And yes, I knew I would be your main suspect from the moment on you started questioning me. I always am, independent of the factions involved. But contrary to what you assume I'm not planning to get off your radar. Experience taught me, that that is impossible. So I decided even before the game started not to be bothered by your inquisition this time. I just play the game in my way and try to find scum in my way without worrying about pleasing you. That makes the game more fun than double checking every post wondering 'what could HSL take issue at this time'.


@all: I would vote SPF or Scene, but would put blotunga on the table too. I thought again about his last post and it really looks as if he just skimmed the thread or used adalia's fundamentals to see who was silent for an extended period of time. That gave him a seemingly valid target without having to bother to read everything. Not reading everything is understandable with the health problems and IRL stuff. However, wanting to have a seemingly valid target and voting, just to be voting, is scummy. I town player would not have to be worried about appearances so much.

@blotunga: please explain what else you find scummy about Pooka, apart from the posting frequency.
Until then:
vote blotunga
avatar
Lifthrasil: @all: I would vote SPF or Scene, but would put blotunga on the table too. I thought again about his last post and it really looks as if he just skimmed the thread or used adalia's fundamentals to see who was silent for an extended period of time. That gave him a seemingly valid target without having to bother to read everything. Not reading everything is understandable with the health problems and IRL stuff. However, wanting to have a seemingly valid target and voting, just to be voting, is scummy. I town player would not have to be worried about appearances so much.

@blotunga: please explain what else you find scummy about Pooka, apart from the posting frequency.
Until then:
vote blotunga
I don't like this Lift. You voted for Korotan and myself for voting for Blotunga and now you're voting for Blotunga yourself. It seems like you jumped on the most likely wagon from Day 1 (me). To the most lurky player everyones said they'd vote for in SPF. To Blotunga who you claimed made an innocent mistake and voted for 2 other players based on the fact they voted for him. Yet you Liftrasil are now voting for the same player now he has had 2 votes and has another player. To me it screams opportunistic jumping to easy lynch target rather than genuine scum hunting. If your reads were genuinely surely you wouldn't be on Blotungas wagon.

avatar
Lifthrasil: Yep. That's me. Always dodging your questions. Sorry if I have other suspect priorities than you. [...]
avatar
HypersomniacLive: You can have whatever suspects and related priorities you want. That's not the point. It's the way you've been going about things all Day long (trentonlf, PookaMustard, Korotan, supplementscene, and now SirPrimalform), and how you word/frame things (trentonlf/supplementscene, PookaMustard, Korotan, and now SirPrimalform further down); as I've said, your scum-hunting looks and feels superficial, like you're mimicking your established town-play to appear to be game-solving.

You never directly address the things I question/challenge you about, often going for the "oops" excuse which you then use to appear hard at game-solving and scum-hunting (like with PookaMustard and supplementscene), and straight out ignore my follow up when I lay out how you dance around and dodge my questions.

Take this for example:

avatar
Lifthrasil: [...] Korotan latching on to that flimsy reason looked over-eager. [...]
avatar
HypersomniacLive: It'd seem that you look at Korotan's (re)actions in a vacuum, and that's the good version of it. In context, it comes across as trying to find things to pick on the easiest target, the weakest player (no offence, Korotan) who can't defend themself well. And when attention is drawn to it, you find a reason to back-pedal.

A broader look at your votes, and assuming they are honestly your suspects, I definitely don't like how you frame things. Look at how you prefaced your current vote on SirPrimalform for example [emphasis added]:

avatar
Lifthrasil: [...] SPF is also still scummy. Either of these two would be a viable lynch for today in my eyes. Actually, I'll put them on equal footing for now. Then you all can decide which wagon to drive.

vote SPF [...]
avatar
HypersomniacLive: What's that supposed to mean? It reads to me like you're trying to create a dichotomy - "it's either SirPrimalform or supplementscene" - and at the same time, shift responsibility about the outcome on the rest of us.

avatar
Lifthrasil: [...] But what about you? As usual, you ask a lot of questions but you don't share much of your own suspicions. So, who are your main suspects and why? [...]
avatar
HypersomniacLive: Almost sounds like it bothers you that I'm not more open so you can't adjust your play to get off my radar.
You're a smart person, Lifthrasil, does it really come as a surprise that you're my main suspect at the moment after the way I've questioned you since the start of D2?

People say you've upped your game, and while that may be true, I look at your play, and a few too many things don't add up with you this game. I've wondered if I'm reading too much into them, hence I've asked others about it, but I haven't got much feedback (only trentonlf and somewhat ZFR chimed in).

Vote Lifthrasil

@all, asking again - am I reading too much into all of this?

I prefer Lifthrasil, but willing to go with supplementscene (indeed, dedoporno makes a good point, I think Lifthrasil made a similar one earlier) and SirPrimalform (even though Lifthrasl's voting him), not sure about anyone else even to avoid No-Lynch.

Also, meant to ask @ZFR - is Microfishd on the table for the same reasons as Yesterday, or has anything changed Today?
Agreed about Lift's analysis seeming superfiscial, he hasn't commited to any wagon and it feels like he's going after 'soft targets'. Here's a post I made earlier in the day noting that:

So a couple of reads. Liftrasil aside from his vote on me has been very none commital all game long. I get a feeling that he doesn't want to offend anyone. People have talked about SPF not posting, which he hasn't but Liftrasil is almost equally withdrawn with a lack of commitment to analysing players other than myself. I realise that contradicts his vote on me but after Day 1 I did look like a safe wagon.

Unvotes Blotunga

Votes Liftrasil
avatar
HypersomniacLive: With the context being blotunga's mafia and ZFR non-mafia, why would he feel guilty about targetting ZFR?
Hm. Would you check your question to make sure you asked what you intended to ask as I don't see what's unclear in this particular setup. Anyway, I meant that in the line of "a guilty conscience needs no accuser" (is that the correct idiom for this? It's worded a bit different in my own language) meaning that he knew what he/they had done so he was already looking for it subconsciously.

avatar
HypersomniacLive: The last (and only, if memory serves right) time someone accused me of trying to get on their good side, my accuser turned out to be a sly, conniving double-crosser in pretty sheep's clothes (game #55).
And that automatically means it can only happen under the exact same circumstances? Also, this is no accusation at all. It's a concern.

avatar
HypersomniacLive: Do I read this correctly that you don't see these other reasons as an act?
I sincerely hope all the issues they seem to have that would call for their psychiatrist to encourage them to play in such a game are not an act. So far I'm putting Koro's shortcomings mostly on that. I don't feel comfortable to inquire additionally if that is the case or not so I just assume it.

avatar
HypersomniacLive: Sounds more like you think they're town but dead weight than there may be something scummy here. If so, shouldn't they be a "to avoid No-Lynch" choice instead of "I'd be fine with him as well"? If the latter, what about them pings you as scummy?
It's the former. I should've made it clearer. Koro isn't my first choice and would serve more as a backup. Even though we're essentially on D1 I already gave them a pass Yesterday. I believe that was enough.

avatar
HypersomniacLive: Also, is Microfishd on the table, or just a note for now?
On the table, but again, not my prime choice, just acceptable.

To be honest I'm not really leaning to anyone as Today is very D1-y to me so it's a bunch of people who I'd be OK to go with, one that I'd rather not and a couple which I won't.

avatar
HypersomniacLive: @all, asking again - am I reading too much into all of this?
So far I've been playing by just going with the thread as it progresses and rarely going back to check particular posts for specific stuff. Like I said before Lift's posts usually resonate pretty well with me so they feel OK for the most part while going with the normal game flow. The first time when I frowned upon him was when he voted Koro and since then it's been less stable. I think it's probably about time for an ISO on him to see I'll actually see what you're seeing there.
Resting by a steaming crack in the rock, Captain Sapphire chats to the alien creature.
How are we going to get out of here then, Freddie? You must know a way - how did you get in? Or did those soldiers trick you down here too? I hope the-"
he suddenly stops, and holds up his hand for silence. The beast buzzes softly. Very faint, distant voices echo in the tunnels.

3 - ThrashSeal (Lifthrasil) - Trentonlf, HypersomniacLive, Supplementscene,
1 - Inkblot (blotunga) - Lifthrasil,
1 - The Supplement (Supplementscene) - ZFR,
1 - M. Moutard (PookaMustard) - blotunga,

0 - Serpent Rime (SirPrimalform) -
0 - Koro-Koro Tank (Korotan) -
0 - The Hypersomniac (HypersomniacLive) -
0 - The Canton Calf (Trentonlf) -
0 - Micro Fist (Microfishd) -
0 - DeadProng (Dedoporno) -
0 - Zephyr (ZFR) -

Not Voting - Dedoporno, PookaMustard, SirPrimalform, Microfishd, Korotan,

Lifthrasil currently holds the most votes at 4 away from majority.

deadline in 15ish hours
avatar
supplementscene: I don't like this Lift. You voted for Korotan and myself for voting for Blotunga and now you're voting for Blotunga yourself.
Well, the difference is in the reason. You and Korotan voted Blotunga because he confused two words. That was a weak reason and I voted Korotan and you for using a weak reason as excuse for a vote. Now blotunga did the same, on an even weaker and hypocritical reason. So maybe he's scum after all. But if it makes you feel better, I'll happily switch back to you.
avatar
supplementscene: I don't like this Lift. You voted for Korotan and myself for voting for Blotunga and now you're voting for Blotunga yourself.
avatar
Lifthrasil: Well, the difference is in the reason. You and Korotan voted Blotunga because he confused two words. That was a weak reason and I voted Korotan and you for using a weak reason as excuse for a vote. Now blotunga did the same, on an even weaker and hypocritical reason. So maybe he's scum after all. But if it makes you feel better, I'll happily switch back to you.
A potential slip of Mafia knowledge is a weaker reason than voting for a lurky player? Especially when you used the exact same logic in voting for SPF? This is another example of your analysis not sounding genuine.
avatar
Lifthrasil: Well, the difference is in the reason. You and Korotan voted Blotunga because he confused two words. That was a weak reason and I voted Korotan and you for using a weak reason as excuse for a vote. Now blotunga did the same, on an even weaker and hypocritical reason. So maybe he's scum after all. But if it makes you feel better, I'll happily switch back to you.
avatar
supplementscene: A potential slip of Mafia knowledge is a weaker reason than voting for a lurky player? Especially when you used the exact same logic in voting for SPF? This is another example of your analysis not sounding genuine.
I didn't see that as potential slip of Mafia knowledge and I think I made that clear. As did others. The only one sticking to that was you. And voting for a lurky player is a good fallback solution if there is no other candidate to be found. But blotunga didn't even try to find a scummy player. He just voted for a player, who is less lurky than himself, for being lurky. That is hypocritical and makes the accusation of lurkiness seem like pretense. I encourage you to compare blotunga and Pooka and then tell me who of those two is lurkier. All blotunga did today was defend against you accusation. Pooka at least made an effort.
@lift: What effort? I'm sorry if I had not much else to contribute, but between irl stuff and defending myself for a stupid mixup I had very little precious time for much else. Ok, the pooka vote is a bit fishing from my side, but I was trying to see reactions to it. You did at least react, though not the way I expected. Anyway, I'm not lurking, I just didn't had much else to add and was getting tired of monopolizing discussions with the same old issue. And since we are back on track, I don't understand whay voting a lurker would be a problem? Should I, in your oppionion vote for myself? As it looks I am the scummiest player because I made a mistake.

When I have no definite scum at hand, I try to go on the lurkers, to at least get them talking. Is that wrong? i have no idea. In SH it kinda fired backwards, there the active ones were the scum. Maybe I should start looking here in the active ones too...
So question for everyone: who looks most scummy so far:
Dedo, hsl, lift or scene. They seem the most active. Trent and zfr are much less present, spf and pooka are almost non existent, Korotan is lost in space.
And I almost completely forgot about microfishd...
avatar
blotunga: @lift: What effort? I'm sorry if I had not much else to contribute, but between irl stuff and defending myself for a stupid mixup I had very little precious time for much else. Ok, the pooka vote is a bit fishing from my side, but I was trying to see reactions to it. You did at least react, though not the way I expected. Anyway, I'm not lurking, I just didn't had much else to add and was getting tired of monopolizing discussions with the same old issue. And since we are back on track, I don't understand whay voting a lurker would be a problem? Should I, in your oppionion vote for myself? As it looks I am the scummiest player because I made a mistake.

When I have no definite scum at hand, I try to go on the lurkers, to at least get them talking. Is that wrong? i have no idea. In SH it kinda fired backwards, there the active ones were the scum. Maybe I should start looking here in the active ones too...
Yes, not disregarding the active ones is a good idea. And no, you should not vote yourself. Self-votes are almost never a good idea for town. I just said that to stress how hypocritical your reasoning looks. Of course going after lurkers in the absence of other clues is a valid strategy. But we do have other interactions and accusing others of not posting enough when you do the same looks, as I said, quite off. On top of that, if you decide to go after lurkers because you don't have time to analyze what the active players wrote, why then choose Pooka over SPF?
Most other players were fixated on me, that created noise, so I can't use my prejudices to cloud my judgment. I have to escape that noise to be able to form an oppinion. If I'd go after my accusers, I'd vote scene, but he could be just an overzealous townie. Still better than a lurker one. As for why Pooka instead of SPF, I have no definite answer there, I just went with my first gut feeling of where I should poke.
avatar
supplementscene: A potential slip of Mafia knowledge is a weaker reason than voting for a lurky player? Especially when you used the exact same logic in voting for SPF? This is another example of your analysis not sounding genuine.
avatar
Lifthrasil: I didn't see that as potential slip of Mafia knowledge and I think I made that clear. As did others. The only one sticking to that was you. And voting for a lurky player is a good fallback solution if there is no other candidate to be found. But blotunga didn't even try to find a scummy player. He just voted for a player, who is less lurky than himself, for being lurky. That is hypocritical and makes the accusation of lurkiness seem like pretense. I encourage you to compare blotunga and Pooka and then tell me who of those two is lurkier. All blotunga did today was defend against you accusation. Pooka at least made an effort.
Yes okay, I can aknowledge I maybe wrong and it may not be a slip. But both Korotan and ZFR have seen it as a potential slip. I obviously do see Blotunga as a viable lynch because of the potential slip. Although on re-reading the word maybe does sound when read aloud more similar that I first thought. But that in itself doesn't mean it wasn't a slip either, because a Mafia player with knowledge of the night kill might see what they believe as ZFRs name and make the error of thinking he's mentioned as a night kill. Although when after ZFR asked me if he was was the likely night kill, I thought probably not because he had plenty of Day 1 votes on him. So it may or may not be a slip and we won't know until we catch up at end game.

While your criticism of Blotunga's play is true this is his first Mafia game. So I can perhaps imagine being overwhelmed when being accused and focusing on that. I spent most of Day 1 defending myself too. During SecretHitler Blotunga focused on things from his individual perspective rather than looking at how others perceived him and interracted with one another. So he perceived players who voted against him as Scum players. That was his focus then and it kind of has been here too. IE what affects Blotunga directly. He did analyse whether my reasons for voting him were genuine of not. Thinking about it, maybe thats a good sign that he didn't vote for me then. So while he hasn't analysed other players interractions with each other, is this surprising or alignment indicative when he didn't when playing as a Liberal in Secret Hitler? I'd say no it isn't.

I also know Blotunga's out of game problems are real as I invited him to a live game of SH, which he declined to participate in because of his ill child.

At the moment I kind of have more of a problem with 5 players that haven't voted rather than 1 player voting for a lurky player. We have 12 hours to go and where are everyones votes? I wouldn't be surprised if Mafia players are avoiding voting until a convenient wagon presents itself. But there has to be Town players there who are playing against Town interests. Pooka, Korotan and Microfish have the excuse of being new. But SPF and Dedo really should have voted by now. Because we are at risk of not lynching today the way the votes are stacked.
Do we want a no-lynch? i think we rather not. I will try to be more active a bit later if we start to hear from others too.
more-or-less twelve hour-ishes til deadline
avatar
supplementscene: Yes okay, I can aknowledge I maybe wrong and it may not be a slip.
I thought you were locked on this being a slip. Does this mean you aren't that sure and just hoping it will work out?

avatar
supplementscene: But SPF and Dedo really should have voted by now. Because we are at risk of not lynching today the way the votes are stacked.
I will vote once I get back home from work as I want to go back and re-read your and Lift's posts.

The deadline is 12 hours as of this posts, I should be able to place my vote in about 6 hours (or earlier, if possible).

avatar
blotunga: Do we want a no-lynch? i think we rather not. I will try to be more active a bit later if we start to hear from others too.
We don't want a no-lynch.
avatar
blotunga: Do we want a no-lynch? i think we rather not.
No, definitely not. No-lynch is usually the worst for town that can happen, since it deprives town of information.

avatar
supplementscene: At the moment I kind of have more of a problem with 5 players that haven't voted rather than 1 player voting for a lurky player.
And yet you vote for a player that has voted and isn't lurky. Doing exactly what you accuse me of: hopping on the train that seemed most promising at the time.

But you know what, you're right in one point: with only 11 hours to go, there isn't much time left to secure a lynch. SPF seems to be protected by 'he always lurks like that'. Unfortunately. And I don't see anyone else following my reasoning for voting blotunga either. So, even though I'll be accused of vote hopping and OMGUS again, I'll put my vote back to where it might still be useful.

vote Scene