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So, I'm finally making my way through the first Fallout. I've attempted it many times, but usually get distracted by something else and end up stopping. Every time I've played before, I've usually gone with small guns and stopped once I reached the Hub. I decided to roll with Unarmed combat since that's the way I did it in Fallout 3 and NV. Now, I've finally reached the Boneyard at level 12 and I'm grinding on Deathclaws for XP, partially because they're easy to kill, and partially because I want to get the God of all Unarmed perks, Slayer. That said, with the power armor I currently have and the Power Fist I got from the Brotherhood, I'm finding that I'm doing extraordinary amounts of damage to begin with. I'm punching Deathclaws in the eyes for upwards of 100 damage, and they're barely scratching me (3-4 damage, 20 if they knock me down, my Endurance is 10). On top of that, I have Ian and Tycho helping me out with the .223 pistol and sniper rifle, respectively. Prior to this, I've been taking out groups of Super Mutants with metal armor and spiked knuckles.

So, I've really got to ask, is there any point in my grinding?
I thought that maybe I was a bit underleveled for where I'm at (after this, I'm going to take care of the mutant problem), but that doesn't seem to be an issue.
Is it normal to be around 12-15 when you beat the game?

Also, apologies if this has been asked before.
I did a search for the word "level", but didn't notice a thread with a similar theme to what I'm asking.
Post edited December 31, 2012 by saldite
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saldite: So, I've really got to ask, is there any point in my grinding?
...
Is it normal to be around 12-15 when you beat the game?
Like you probably guessed, no particular point, no.
I'd say 15 more likely than 12, but yeah, that's about the range.

Mutants and stuff, you won't be seeing anything harder.
The ending isn't crazy hard, though might be a bit tough,
if you decide to take the straight road of killing everything in your path.
The game becomes trivial once you get power armour. Only a lucky crit will kill you.
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Jarmo: Like you probably guessed, no particular point, no.
I'd say 15 more likely than 12, but yeah, that's about the range.

Mutants and stuff, you won't be seeing anything harder.
The ending isn't crazy hard, though might be a bit tough,
if you decide to take the straight road of killing everything in your path.
Alright. A friend of mine and my cousin were both telling me that, with an unarmed character, the ending of the game would be really difficult. Considering I'm taking on two to three Deathclaws at a time, I just wasn't seeing it, so I thought maybe there was a sharp difficulty spike at the end. I also messed up making my character a little bit, so I don't think my critical hit rate is as high as it should be, but if all I have worry about is more mutants, I think I'll be fine.

Thank you for the information.
Grinding on Deathclaws was getting a bit tedious.
Considering I'm now 14, I think I can make it to 15 by the end of the game.
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H2IWclassic: The game becomes trivial once you get power armour. Only a lucky crit will kill you.
I noticed that myself. I've been critically hit several times for no damage. Even before this, though, I was running through most of the game with Metal Armor and Brass Knuckles, and I was still not getting a whole lot of resistance.
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saldite: Alright. A friend of mine and my cousin were both telling me that, with an unarmed character, the ending of the game would be really difficult.
Well yeah, there is that.

Trying to not spoil anything...

The end is in two places and depending on stuff, you may face the end boss which can be a bit tricky.
But not worth grinding over anyway. And if he turns out to be a tough, I think you can just skip the fight.
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saldite: I noticed that myself. I've been critically hit several times for no damage. Even before this, though, I was running through most of the game with Metal Armor and Brass Knuckles, and I was still not getting a whole lot of resistance.
You could probably solo it with just those to be honest. The combat challenge really starts to drop after the Raider\Khan camp in FO1. Initially you're running scared from packs of radscorpions, raiders and mantii, but after picking up 3 companions and some decent equipment...
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saldite: I noticed that myself. I've been critically hit several times for no damage. Even before this, though, I was running through most of the game with Metal Armor and Brass Knuckles, and I was still not getting a whole lot of resistance.
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H2IWclassic: You could probably solo it with just those to be honest. The combat challenge really starts to drop after the Raider\Khan camp in FO1. Initially you're running scared from packs of radscorpions, raiders and mantii, but after picking up 3 companions and some decent equipment...
I've done a few Unarmed Specialist runs through Fallout (both 1 and 2, it's way better in 2) and I've done it solo. Having the Slayer perk is nice but not strictly necessary. The "final boss" can be a challenge if you choose to go the Violent Combat route, more so if you shun ranged combat, but there are other ways to complete the game that utilize non combat skills. If you really want to level up first make sure you have visited each town multiple times and have done all the quests. There are quite a few that can be missed if you do the typical RPG thing of talking to key people in town once and leaving.
So...

-SPOILERS-

I managed to get to level 18 right before the Cathedral, giving me slayer. And, I have to say, but that perk almost broke the game for me. 1-hit kill, no problem. I hit the master four times and he was dead (thanks to my NPC's providing back up fire). Even before that, though, the mutants were going down like flies. I'm planning on going through the second game (unarmed, just the same), and I doubt I'll actively try to go for slayer or grind because, if FO2 is anything like the first, actually getting it would make the game almost too easy. That's not to say I won't take it if I get there, but I doubt I'll be running to and fro grinding for more EXP. That said, I've heard from people that the second game is more of a challenge, though, so maybe I'll need it.

Either way, thanks for the help and answering my questions.
I think if I go through Fallout again, I'll probably roll a lower-level, gun-based fighter without the NPCs. Just so I don't feel like I'm almost cheating.

EDIT: I did like the alternative means to take out the Master, though.
I made a save right before the fight and tried a few other things.
I found at least two other ways aside from killing him directly, but I did like that you could "kill him" without actually killing him.
If that makes sense.

I'm looking forward to the second because all I hear is bigger, better things about it.
Post edited January 03, 2013 by saldite
That is one of the great things about Fallout. Many of the quests have multiple solutions that are actually varied enough to justify trying completely different builds. The replay value is incredible. Fallout 1 is the better game in terms of story and atmosphere, but Fallout 2 is a whole lot more fun to play. If you like playing unarmed characters there is a lot more for you in Fallout 2.
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Stevedog13: That is one of the great things about Fallout. Many of the quests have multiple solutions that are actually varied enough to justify trying completely different builds. The replay value is incredible. Fallout 1 is the better game in terms of story and atmosphere, but Fallout 2 is a whole lot more fun to play. If you like playing unarmed characters there is a lot more for you in Fallout 2.
I'm not too far in (just got through the temple and called it quits to do something else), but I'm already noticing this.
My "Punch" and "Kick" are now both strong.
On top of that, I heard that you can actually learn special martial arts attacks, giving unarmed even more variation.

I'm pretty pumped to actually sit down and give this game a full shot eventually.

I generally don't play as such, but I can definitely see how one could diplomatically get through these games.
FO2 has wilder variance in difficulty.

The beginning is painstakingly slow, though a fair bit easier to swallow if you're unarmed or melee expert.

Once you're pretty well geared up, most of the combat is trivial. But then there are a few spots that are dead hard. Fighting your way through the final area can be a real pain.

But the first time you kill a supermutant with a barehand strike is real rewarding. A warm fuzzy feeling. :D

....

Dammit. Now I have the urge to replay FO2 myself... :)

PS. Tactics is also pretty neat. Story is a bit weaker but the combat is best in the series.
Post edited January 03, 2013 by Jarmo
There are 4 seperate unarmed attacks in Fallout 2. Standard Punch, Special Punch, Standard Kick and Special Kick. Each of these has 3 levels that are tied to your Unarmed skill, for example the Standard Punch goes from Punch to Strong Punch to Haymaker. Each successive level increases in damage. The Special strikes cost more AP but also have a chance to ignore armor. The Piercing Strike is a punch that costs 8 AP and has a 10% chance to ignore armor. Scoring an unprotected hit to a Super Mutants eyes is impressive, but is it better than multiple standard punches? That's up to your playstyle and wether or not you can get a Mega Power Fist. There is also a perk called Hand to Hand Evade that increases your Armor Class by 1/12th of your Unarmed Skill. That's an easy +10AC for having Unarmed at 120% and the skill limit is 300%! Interplay showed a lot of love to unarmed fighters the second time around, I just wish that throwing weapons got some added benefit as well to compliment this.


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Jarmo: Dammit. Now I have the urge to replay FO2 myself... :)
You and me both. I think I'll be running through the Temple of Trials tonight.
Fallout 2 is much harder than Fallout, especially for unarmed characters so you definitely want to get Slayer. The Fast Shot trait doesn't work for melee any more (restart if you have it).
FWIW, it's possible to do the end of Fallout 1 without fighting at all. The traditional level-up-to-become-an-unstoppable-killing-machine method is just the most obvious way to finish the game.
Post edited January 25, 2013 by UniversalWolf
I like being able to grind like I am currently doing in Eschalon book 2. I will finish Fallout 2 someday but not likely the 1st fallout. I tried getting into it but with a time limit I cannot enjoy the game.