Just wondering because since theres no quest log and no ingame map for most of these, how do you guys remember where stuff is/where to go/what to do?

im really bad at these old hardcore rpgs seeing as i didnt start playing em till recently

anyways at the moment im just using notepad and maps ive found on the internet to mark stuff, wondering if anyone had any better ideas

I used to play next to a Notebook on my old days. Now you can do the same or play windowed with some of the awesome notetaking software around.

Also, pressing N into Ultima VII brings a notebook (at least using exult) I'm not sure about the plain version.

Salut!

Plain U7 doesn't have a notebook. I use windows notepad for U4-6. It's ugly, but it gets the job done. I haven't had trouble remembering anything important in U7 yet.

In Ultima 7, you can find (in-game) a map and a sextant (there are many of these around).

If you double-click on the map when you also have a sextant in your inventory, your position will be marked on the map with a yellow cross.

As far as geography goes though, the world of Britannia changes very little over the course of Ultima 4 to Ultima 7, generally getting smaller though. After a while, you may even find it rather familiar.

When I first played these games though, I spent a lot of time wandering around, finding places and dying a lot. It took quite a long time before I actually got around to doing the main quests for any of them (and even then, I've only completed a few).

Keep in mind the sextant only works outdoors though.

I actually found my original Ultima VII notebook when my parents cleaned out their house and sent me all my stuff. Found memories of writing things down to follow up on. Had lots of graph paper too that I used for mapping dungeons and towns. Those were the days!

Funny. Lots of paper and pens. I never started any rpg without a pad and pencil ready in those days. I remember when some games further turtured the Player by having magic dungeons that randomised the layout every now and then so you couldn`t map. That was frustrating, dunno what people would`ve made of that today. Probabaly would`ve given up.

Take copious and detailed notes. My father had a binder full of every conversation that he ever had in Ultima IV, and a list of every single question that he would ask every single townsperson he came across. I was not so diligent, but a notepad and pen (or a similar program to do the job) are invaluable additions to your quest.

I truly shudder to think what today's gamers would have made of Wizardry IV: The Return of Werdna, nigh-universally acknowledged as the most challenging CRPG ever made. Unless you were already familiar with the Wizardry magic system you probably weren't even going to get out of the first room of the game! Luckily Sir-Tech at least addressed the issue by including (in a sealed envelope with every box) a walkthrough for getting past this first puzzle. But beyond that, there was Trebor's Ghost, teleports, traps, no-magic zones, and that wonderful "minefield" level you could only map through trial and error... Not to sound like a crotchety old-timer, but today's gamers don't know how good they've got it!

Back in the day, when computers could do less than they can now, the player was expected to do more to keep up with everything going on in a complex RPG like an Ultima or a Wizardry; the early Might & Magic games are also fine examples. At least today you can run these games windowed while perusing GameFAQs if need be, or just take notes yourself using Notepad or another tool. (I've found that a spreadsheet such as OpenOffice.org Calc actually makes for a very effective dungeon-mapping utility if graph paper's scarce.) Today's gamers have been spoiled, I think, by having in-game maps, quest logs, pop-up tutorial boxes, and waypoints that all but lead you by the hand through whatever you're doing at any given moment. To play an old-school Ultima is to rediscover the roots of RPGs, in a sense.

lol. Very true, the kid965

Ahh old games, taking notes on old fashion wood based paper. It's what you did.
And how about those old games, when they didn't have an arrow pointing exactly where you needed to go.
And no quest log to say "Oh you forgot who you were supposed to talk to? Here's a recap"
Tbh I like games that don't lead you by the hand and basically play for you.

I remember those days. Nowadays, with things like GameFAQs, gamers are spoiled. I remember a time where there were only three ways to get a puzzle solved:

1. You actually sat back and thought about it. Most gamers are too lazy to do this anymore. "Who cares about a puzzle?" They say, "I just want to see what happens next!" Pathetic.

2. Log onto a BBS. Remember the days before Broadband? Yeah, if you wanted to load something online, you had to wait for it to load.

3. Buy a strategy guide/hint book and be tempted to play the whole game with it open next to you. I did this with Legend of Zelda: Ocarina of Time, and have regretted ever since.

What ever happened to good old fashioned brainpower? It is so rewarding to figure these things out yourself, and yet, few are willing to do it anymore. Now they just open GameFAQs and play the game with it open. It's really sad.

I agree, but I only dislike the implementation of journals in role-playing games and not the journals themselves. They usually reveal meta-game information and/or give my character a belief that I don't believe they should hold. Otherwise, I'd rather keep the modern convenience of the in-game journal. I'm going to be writing one if none is provided anyways, so I'd rather that be automated to save me time.

Play Zork. A completely text based adventure game. Not only do you have to keep track of items, locations and puzzles but you have to figure out what commands to use in the first place. And puzzles had to be solved using items. Many of which had very limited usage so you might break the solution just figuring out how to use the item in the first place.

Once you have figured all that out, games that came later are much easier.

Zorks actually very forgiving for a text based adventure since it accepts a variety of sentences rather than two word commands. Hitchhiker's Guide is probably the hardest one I've played, though I'm not too familiar with the genre.