I don't chop up people, but I do practice sword fighting. And I can tell you that the combat moves in neither game are very realistic. However, dieing quickly when you get surrounded is very realistic. Group style in TW1 was incredibly convenient, but not terribly plausible.

Personally , i like TW2 combat system , but IMO one way to make the combat more realistic would have been :


1) the "parry" button should be clicked at the right time to parry an incoming blow , currently you can hold the "parry" button and block everything which is arcadish

2) you should be able to "thrust " an opponent and leave the sword stuck in his body ( by holding the "strong attack" button ) this way the enemy would bleed to death with a sword stuck in his belly (and geralt would draw his second sword ) , would be awesome

3) you should be able to cut heads with special attacks during ripostes , and riposte excecuted quickly should have a chance of cutting limbs /hands

4) silver sword should break or bend when used against shield or humans with steel armour and it should be possible to "disarm" an opponent during a fight (and be disarmed ) , making him lose his sword in hand after a series of 3 successful parries for instance

5) bleeding must be more fatal , pommel attack with European sword designs should be possible at close range (say for instance : hold "light attack" and "strong attack" at the same time to produce pommel hit )


6) you should be able to perform a few "unarmed " wrestling stuff like any medieval swordsman could , i mean sort of ju-jutsu projections when at close range or after having "disarmed" an opponent or if you got disarmed yourself

Well just some ideas , maybe some won't like it , but since my dream is an RPG set in medieval Europe or Japan (without monsters and magic crap , just raw realism in medieval scenery with maybe a bit of fantasy but not much ) with the emphasis on sword /polearms /unarmed combat , and "magic" being replaced by "concentration" , fast sword drawing etc

Holding up a block and waiting for an opponent to hit straight into your block is indeed extremely silly from a real sword fighting viewpoint, but at the same time I think making combat even more dynamic than it already is will also make it unplayable.

What could be really cool, and right up CDPR's alley, while making combat a lot less clicky, is if the game handled the attacks and parries for you, continuing to fight and block intelligently even when you don't do anything, and as a player you only get to make the strategic decisions: who to attack, how much priority you give to blocking over attacking, speed over damage, etc. And then the game uses that info to determine whether to block/counter/sidestep an incoming attack.

You could put a lot of real fencing moves into that. Program several different counters for several different kind of strikes, each with a certain cost in time, stamina and defense, possibly dependent on various external factors too. Done well, it could make combat really realistic, beautiful, and different every time. Looks cool, but is only really a smart move if it's impossible or dangerous to retrieve your sword. I believe you bleed faster if you pull the sword out. Though the sword would still hinder the guy stuck with it, of course. Ringen am Schwert (wrestling with sword) would be amazingly cool. Go from a parry to an arm lock, throw, disarm, punch, etc.

Though if you go that way, it might also be cool to include half-swording techniques.

But if you want the player to control all these combat options in detail, you're really looking at a very detailed Streetfighter/Mortal Kombat style fighting game, I think (I have no experience with any of those, mind you). But for an RPG, it would be cool if your character could apply these techniques automatically, and you get to decide which to focus on.

The could be very cool in a different game, but I don't think the Witcher gives you enough strategic things to think about to make it good gameplay. That level of automation seems more appropriate for an RPG where you control a 4 man party or something.

I recommend checking out Dark Messiah of Might and Magic.
It's a mediocre game, but the combat system is still my favourite. Ever.

Here's just one video from my walkthrough
(my build isn't very creative, either. It's just bow & sword with a bit of healing. Magic builds can get a lot more complicated with the physics)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anlwdm0HhH0

From what he is saying.. i felt he's clearly a troll in trying to thrash down the game and how much it was about a game of click-fest.. which is unfounded and not true. If spamming left click more that 3 times your attack would have been blocked and countered.

Very clearly he is unhappy about the combat and he doesnt likes it and wanted CDPR to make the game how he wanted to be.

The combat in TW2 is awesome and it did gave me a sense of challenge where other games failed to do so. If the game was designed to be a Diablo hack and slash, it would even be better as hack and slash games do not need to rely on 'player' skill but character skills, attributes and gears.

Hence folks will be happy standing on the same spot, click fest and kill everything in sight with the correct skillbuild. If that's the game was designed, then i had agree it was click fest.

Its obvious this guy is a complete troll. We all know spam left clicking does not work as your attack will be blocked and you will get surrounded and you will die. The funny part here is that asia keeps saying how good he is yet he only plays on easy? good try though

Regarding WC2 combat: I say it has one the BEST COMBAT mechanism I ever played.

Combat games such as Prince of Persia 2, Assassin Creed stands on the top. Awesome martial arts, wonderful finishing moves, and mover over: blocking. NPCs knows to block and actually block.

Down the scales stand traditional RPGs such as Neverwinter Nights, Dragon Age, Final Fantasy, Elder Scrolls. The combat are just horrible flashing feast

WC2 combat incoorporates real-time combat and RPGs. Thought it is not perfect, it is a start.

It is different from other familliar RPGs one may play.

To all: if you complain the game, would you mind compare the game to some other games you already play ?

Depends on how you look at it though. Your suggestion would take the "action" out of the action RPG (which by all accounts seems like what TW2 aim to be) but it would be more like a traditional (mostly party-based) RPG.

I like how it is in TW2 though. I admit there are frantic key pressing at times, but at least I can dodge when I want to and my hit never misses (barring the occasional glitches). This reduces the reliance on luck. For stats-heavy RPGs, You can have 80% attack but you can still miss 3 out of your 5 attacks and lose a battle - the thing is the statistics works out when you have a large sample but you are susceptible to the occasional lousy streak.

Btw if you have tried fighting unarmed in TW2, forget about it. He can't dodge, or execute a stunned enemy and takes extra damage, or as Zoltan puts it, a "limp prick". I was expecting some cool bare-fist action (like wrestling the sword yeah) but I guess the devs totally forgot about it.

No reason why it'd have to be party-based, but yes, I'd like to take the action out of it. I don't like action games. And taking the action out of it means I can focus on the strategy, which is much more interesting to me.

Of course if you prefer action games, then my idea isn't going to work for you. We want completely opposite things. That doesn't mean that what I want is invalid, however. There are more people who share my taste. And you can't fuck up if you do everything yourself? Despite my ability to dodge, I still get hit plenty of times. It does look like missing isn't really possible in TW2, but I don't think that's a good thing. In any case, the action-heavy focus means that the entire game can be one big lousy streak for people who suck at action games but enjoy RPGs. I'd rather take my chances with stats and luck. Those are risks I can manage.

I want TW3 to be a shooter.. Geralt will be able to use all sorts of range weapons be it SMG, Sniper Rifle, Rocket Launcher, Double Barrel shotgun and Pistol.

Of course if you prefer turn based games, then my idea isn't going to work for you. We want completely opposite things. That doesn't mean that what I want is invalid, however. There are EVEN more people who share my taste which is the COD/BF crowd and CDPR can sell 20M copies.

:D

Ps. If i'm branded as a troll for posting this then i can equivalently brand you as one too. All said, you are expecting a different gameplay out from Witcher 2. Which is the same i wanted a turn-based game out of a shooter. My 2 cents.

I did not say what you want is invalid. I merely pointed out that what you want is different from how TW2 is developed to be. As to which type of RPG more people prefer, that is arguable but I have nothing to prove which way or another.

I didn't say I can't fuck up when I do things (blocking / attacking / positioning / dodging) myself. It's hard not to fuck up when you have 19 nekkers taking turns at you. I am merely saying that there is less reliance on luck / stats.

Plus given the stats of TW2 enemies (significantly higher damage, higher hitpoints, less flashy but faster attack speed) it wouldn't work out that well.

While I agree with you that it is very action-heavy, there are various things one can do about it (lowering difficulty / mod / bombs / potions / quen) to reduce the reliance on one's "button-mashing" or "twitch-based combat" abilities. Thus theoretically everyone can still enjoy the RPG even without racking his/her brain or breaking his/her mouse or keyboard. Unless by reason of pride, one refuses to resort to the methods mentioned above...

You mean you honestly think that SMGs and rocket launchers are equally suitable to The Witcher as more strategic and less twitchy combat that focuses on realistic and cool combat moves?

I just don't know what to say to that.

What i really meant sums up clearly by vAddiccatedGamer. You are only looking at the game on how YOU want it which is different from how TW2 was developed to be.

Honestly everyone has their own preference on how the game SHOULD be for themselves. The developers can't possible satisfy everyone.

If a game was developed NOT the way I like to play it then it simply means i'm the one to be blamed for buying a game that i did not LIKE in the first place or have any idea what is all about before buying it rather than whining and flaming the developers how the game suxs badly.