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TL;DR? I wanna :
1 - Be able to be a silver/white/green/etc dragon disciple
2 - Change your race to half dragon at lv 10
3 - Gain caster level
4 - Have dragonform and breath weapon in dragon form

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Now why this is important for DD.

1 - Red Dragons are chaotic evil and don't interact well with humans, are the mostly unlike dragonkind to any dragon disciple have in his bloodline, they see humans as livestock. Metalic dragons are an exemption. Mainly silver, since silver dragons can be all time in human form, enjoy human food and don't eat "smart creatures", so
2 - When you reach lv 10, your race should be "half dragon". When you use shapechange to a golem for example, your race becomes "construct", so why when you reach lv 10 DD you don't become a half dragon? Also, a lv 20 monk and warlock should be an outsider
3 - Gain no caster level is the main reason to make this class useless for casters. A sorc 10/DD 10 have no change against a sorc 20
4 - An Epic Druid can chapechange to a dragon form and use breath weapon and even choose what dragon he will be. Also, he can use breath weapon while in dragon form. I don't see any reason to not follow the rules and give DD to use breath weapons and spells while in dragon form

Also, the current DD state limits the roleplay. i can't make a character based on Kall-Su for example. So anyone knows a hakpak that fix this prestige class?
This question / problem has been solved by Valkinazimage
In both PrC for nwn1 and Kaedrin PrC pack you can be any color you want. But there are no ways to get other dnd stuff. Especially since it pretty mich impossible tor this two game engines to seamlessly switch race on the fly
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Valkinaz: In both PrC for nwn1 and Kaedrin PrC pack you can be any color you want. But there are no ways to get other dnd stuff. Especially since it pretty mich impossible tor this two game engines to seamlessly switch race on the fly
Thanks, i will download but this give more caster level? Dragon form? About change race on the fly, if you use shape change, your race is changed in character sheet;;;
Post edited October 02, 2017 by darthvictorbr
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Valkinaz: In both PrC for nwn1 and Kaedrin PrC pack you can be any color you want. But there are no ways to get other dnd stuff. Especially since it pretty mich impossible tor this two game engines to seamlessly switch race on the fly
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darthvictorbr: Thanks, i will download but this give more caster level? Dragon form? About change race on the fly, if you use shape change, your race is changed in character sheet;;;
As I said - only colored dragons with different breaths. Dynamic race switching for pc/npc is kinda impossible/ And polimorth is not a good way yo do it

problem is - original DnD dragon disciple is harder to qualify for then nwn counterpart since it require you to know draconic language(so you need to explane where the hell your character learned it). So in pnp it was much harder to build something like F28/Brd2/RDD10 or even F14/B1/RDD10/FB5(and good DM could ban such combo outright as breaking class logic)
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darthvictorbr: Thanks, i will download but this give more caster level? Dragon form? About change race on the fly, if you use shape change, your race is changed in character sheet;;;
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Valkinaz: As I said - only colored dragons with different breaths. Dynamic race switching for pc/npc is kinda impossible/ And polimorth is not a good way yo do it

problem is - original DnD dragon disciple is harder to qualify for then nwn counterpart since it require you to know draconic language(so you need to explane where the hell your character learned it). So in pnp it was much harder to build something like F28/Brd2/RDD10 or even F14/B1/RDD10/FB5(and good DM could ban such combo outright as breaking class logic)
Thanks, you are right about race. in nwn1 this is more easy since the races are more "similar", but in nwn2, remove all racial bonus and give another bonuses with a complete different ECL... Maybe only change the race name and give some bonuses is more easy since you don't lose your racial bonus with Dragon Apotheosis...

About Dragon disciple in PnP, Kobolds, troglodytes, lizardfolk and dragons probably can teach you draconic language, a lv 15 sor probably can purchase a dictionary or pay for someone to teach he, also if you start the game with a sorcerer with draconic heritage, learn draconic language isn't that hard. In PnP since you can cast spells in dragon form and the most important. Gain caster level from DD class, is a pretty useful class for casters. In NWN1 is useless for casters, except if we are talking about SOR 30/RDD 10 VS SOR 40, but until lv 27~30 take level from this class is a waste of XP. Epic spells are pretty strong in nwn1, you can get 50/+20 DR, 35D6 damage spells, summon a dragon... In a lv 30 max setting, trade this spells and have a 20 caster level is ridiculous.

In PnP a SOR 20/DD 10 will have a "caster level" of 27 ( http://www.d20srd.org/srd/prestigeClasses/dragonDisciple.htm ), since the majority of conjuration spells bypass SR in PnP, trade 3 CL for AC, much more HP, Blindsense, more attributes, a elemental immunity, immunity to sleep and paralysis and wings isn't a bad deal. Dragonform can make you stop being an "glass cannon" and make you a "main battle tank" since you can cast spells and use dragonlike abilities in dragon form. Of course, you can only use this ability once per day and rest in D&D isn't like in nwn, survivability in PnP is very important since you can't simple reload the old save in case of death.

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Imagine how silly will be if clerics can only have the fire domain and get only abilities that make clerics useful in melee. This is the "dragon disciple" implementation in nwn1/nwn2.


EDIT : Maybe i will play nwn2 again with this https://neverwintervault.org/project/nwn2/hakpak/original-hakpak/races-faerun-pack-v23

Apparently there are no hakpak who gives dragonform and more caster level for nwn1 or nwn2(at least i've found no one in any place)...
Post edited October 02, 2017 by darthvictorbr
RDD suffered from inability to stop it abuse by fighters. Thing about classic F28/B2/RDD10 in nwn. Now this guy can use bardic spell up to 4th level. So he for example can extend haste. Or use warcry or buff himself with bull strengh. Or look at cassic nwn2 F14/B1/RDD10/FB5. Now this guy also can use warcry, haste, displacement, heroism and mirror image.

P.S. https://www.nexusmods.com/neverwinter2/mods/200/?
This one gives different dragon disciples for nwn2.
Post edited October 02, 2017 by Valkinaz
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Valkinaz: RDD suffered from inability to stop it abuse by fighters. Thing about classic F28/B2/RDD10 in nwn. Now this guy can use bardic spell up to 4th level. So he for example can extend haste. Or use warcry or buff himself with bull strengh. Or look at cassic nwn2 F14/B1/RDD10/FB5. Now this guy also can use warcry, haste, displacement, heroism and mirror image.

P.S. https://www.nexusmods.com/neverwinter2/mods/200/?
This one gives different dragon disciples for nwn2.
IMHO, DD should receive a "DEX penalty" for leveling up, or lose BAB when level up DD to make this class not good for melee characters but thanks for the recommendation . Only one question. This mod increases caster level? I don't know why in nwn2 Arcane Scholar of Candlekeep, Arcane Trickster, Eldritch Knight, Harper Agent, Pale Master, and Red Wizard of Thay increases your caster level, but DD not...

And according to you, the spells "save or die" are better for arcane casters in nwn2 than "raw damage spells", so you need a high caster level in order to use this spells.
Post edited October 02, 2017 by darthvictorbr
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Valkinaz: RDD suffered from inability to stop it abuse by fighters. Thing about classic F28/B2/RDD10 in nwn. Now this guy can use bardic spell up to 4th level. So he for example can extend haste. Or use warcry or buff himself with bull strengh. Or look at cassic nwn2 F14/B1/RDD10/FB5. Now this guy also can use warcry, haste, displacement, heroism and mirror image.

P.S. https://www.nexusmods.com/neverwinter2/mods/200/?
This one gives different dragon disciples for nwn2.
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darthvictorbr: IMHO, DD should receive a "DEX penalty" for leveling up, or lose BAB when level up DD to make this class not good for melee characters but thanks for the recommendation . Only one question. This mod increases caster level? I don't know why in nwn2 Arcane Scholar of Candlekeep, Arcane Trickster, Eldritch Knight, Harper Agent, Pale Master, and Red Wizard of Thay increases your caster level, but DD not...

And according to you, the spells "save or die" are better for arcane casters in nwn2 than "raw damage spells", so you need a high caster level in order to use this spells.
I already told you twice - no spellcasting progression.
Thanks. Only one more question(since you have more experience in nwn2). Pale master worth a pick in nwn2? I haven't used in nwn1 since my alignment was good an no caster level gain...
Depends. PM in SoZ is utter rubbish. Maybe worth one level for that armor increase, but arcane casters have "must have" ASoC and good Eldrich Knight. And PM immunities do not wotrth 5 CL lost.

PM after installation of Kpack is pretty decent since he has 9/10 CL progression and require almost nothing to get. But few additional PrC from K'pack outshine him. Outshine hard

And If you didn't noticed I mentioned that here
http://www.athasreborn.com/prc/manual/
you can also get different colored dragon disciples but for nwn1(Also epic DD)
Post edited October 02, 2017 by Valkinaz

In PnP since you can cast spells in dragon form and the most important. Gain caster level from DD class,
no, you got that wrong

Dragon Disciple doesn't increase spell progression like Eldritch Knight or Pale Master. Dragon Disciple only add bonus spells.

DD get only 1 extra bonus spell slot or in case of spontaneous spellcasters spell level use. He can choose to grant this bonus on any spell level he can cast.

He doesn't increase spell progression and thus doesn't increase caster level either.
Post edited October 05, 2017 by shadooow

In PnP since you can cast spells in dragon form and the most important. Gain caster level from DD class,
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shadooow: no, you got that wrong

Dragon Disciple doesn't increase spell progression like Eldritch Knight or Pale Master. Dragon Disciple only add bonus spells.

DD get only 1 extra bonus spell slot or in case of spontaneous spellcasters spell level use. He can choose to grant this bonus on any spell level he can cast.

He doesn't increase spell progression and thus doesn't increase caster level either.
You will learn no spells, but you will get more caster level for spontaneous caster. According to paizo "+1 level of existing arcane spellcasting class" http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/coreRulebook/prestigeClasses/dragonDisciple.html Except in lv 1, 7 and 9.

" At the indicated levels, a dragon disciple gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in an arcane spellcasting class he belonged to before adding the prestige class. He does not, however, gain other benefits a character of that class would have gained, except for additional spells per day, spells known" http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/coreRulebook/prestigeClasses/dragonDisciple.html

So, a sor 30 will have a CL of 30. A SOR 20/DD 10 will have a CL of 27
Thats pathfinder. And not 3.0/3.5 ruleset. There are differences. Pretty big in some parts
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/prestigeClasses/dragonDisciple.htm
Post edited October 05, 2017 by Valkinaz
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Valkinaz: Thats pathfinder. And not 3.0/3.5 ruleset. There are differences. Pretty big in some parts
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/prestigeClasses/dragonDisciple.htm
In 3.5e angel disciple gets more caster level
[url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Angel_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)]http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Angel_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)[/url])

Same for Cyst Disciple_
[url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Cyst_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class]http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Cyst_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class[/url])

Death
[url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Death_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)]http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Death_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)[/url])

Divine
[url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Divine_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)]http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Divine_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)[/url])

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Even titans get spell-like abilities
[url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Titan_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)]http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Titan_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)[/url])

I've found no information about getting no caster level for DD in 3.5e and read 5 different forums.
Post edited October 06, 2017 by darthvictorbr
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darthvictorbr: In 3.5e angel disciple gets more caster level
[url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Angel_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class_]http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Angel_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)[/url]
Thats homebrew class. Non-official

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darthvictorbr: Same for Cyst Disciple_
[url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Cyst_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)]http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Cyst_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)[/url]
Homebrew class again

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darthvictorbr: Death
[url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Death_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)]http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Death_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)[/url]
Homebrew

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darthvictorbr: Divine [url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Divine_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)]http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Divine_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)[/url]
Homebrew once again

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darthvictorbr: Even titans get spell-like abilities
[url=http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Titan_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)]http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Titan_Disciple_(3.5e_Prestige_Class)[/url]
Guess what! Homebrew!

As you might noticed, none of classes you posted here are official so cant be used as reference. In case you do not know - homebrew is unofficial class made using basic dnd mechanics

And if you still do not believe me, you can check it yourself - its in Dungeon Master's Guide on p183. No spellcasting progression, only bonus spell slots
Post edited October 06, 2017 by Valkinaz