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hedwards: They released the update at the end of the workday on Friday, so I'm not aware of anybody that's been given a response at all.

Personally, I'll be doing so later today as I'm pissed about being lied to. It was even in the FAQ section on the original KS page that they would be offering it for sale as a DRM free download on their site and that Steam was a possibility.

As I've said before I don't fund Steam developers and I certainly don't want to give the various rights holders the idea that they can expect this sort of concession. But,either way I won't be buying any more HBS games, no matter how good they are.
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jackalKnight: So why didn't you just demand the refund instead of repeating this post to us 5 billion times? "I don't fund Steam developers" means you don't fund about 95 percent of PC/Mac/Linux game development now, so you'll have plenty of extra money.
I'm beginning to think that there is something very wrong with your head.
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hedwards: They released the update at the end of the workday on Friday, so I'm not aware of anybody that's been given a response at all.

Personally, I'll be doing so later today as I'm pissed about being lied to. It was even in the FAQ section on the original KS page that they would be offering it for sale as a DRM free download on their site and that Steam was a possibility.

As I've said before I don't fund Steam developers and I certainly don't want to give the various rights holders the idea that they can expect this sort of concession. But,either way I won't be buying any more HBS games, no matter how good they are.
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jackalKnight: So why didn't you just demand the refund instead of repeating this post to us 5 billion times? "I don't fund Steam developers" means you don't fund about 95 percent of PC/Mac/Linux game development now, so you'll have plenty of extra money.
He said he wouldn't fund a Steam only release. Something that was confirmed to have both a Steam and GOG release he wouldn't have an issue with, as long as he gets to choose DRM free support for it.
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JAAHAS: I can't speak for others, but I myself would be a hypocrite if I sold or gave away keys for a service that I do not wish to support. HBS actually managed to piss me off even more by offering 3 + 3 Steam keys for my pledge as if that somehow makes up for not disclosing properly during the kickstarter run that the game might not be available to purchase DRM-free afterwards.
Well, the GOG DRM free hypocrite club certainly isn't small, considering the amount of Steam/Desura keys from HIBs are being traded here.

Anyway, I was only stopping by here because Firefox has a new feature where the private mode doesn't close the original window and I can type really well with one hand.

I will leave you all to your little discussion again.
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jackalKnight: So why didn't you just demand the refund instead of repeating this post to us 5 billion times? "I don't fund Steam developers" means you don't fund about 95 percent of PC/Mac/Linux game development now, so you'll have plenty of extra money.
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hedwards: I'm beginning to think that there is something very wrong with your head.
Hey, I'm not the one who plunked down 125 bucks for a DRM free Shadowrun game and then complained when THEY (not the rest of the world, THEY) got every single feature THEY as an individual were promised in the letter of the agreement but didn't get hypothetical features that WEREN'T INCLUDED IN THE KICKSTARTER and weren't promised to anyone (post-Berlin DLC).
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SimonG: They are fun, because they are consequence free. Not for me (which is kinda reassuring, of course), but for the industry.

I wasn't part of it, just a lurker. But it was awesome. In a sad way. As much as I have my beef with CDP, I still like and respect GOG. Seeing how they ran into a corner with their marketing, is rather saddening. Let's just hope the forum is only a fraction of the actual customers.
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jackalKnight: If you want to see something really hilarious, go to the thread where people are whining about GOG having "poor" pre-order bonuses compared to Steam.
Places in that thread where Steam was mentioned:

"Steam recently launched the pre-order unlocks where more rewards are offered the more people pre-order a game. GOG's pre-order offers have been...very weak to be honest, no actual special deals, no exclusive offers, no free bonuses, this is true for almost every pre-order that has been on the site so far."

Someone named Siannah making the baffling point that ".... and now pre-orders being weak.... from guys known to have spoken against Steam, comparing it with Steam pre-order unlocks..." (baffling because the only person to complain about the pre-orders being weak is Roman5, who I do not think is against Steam.)

One person commenting that Steam is a bigger service, and therefore can get developers to offer better deals.

Me, saying "I don't understand pre-ordering games in the digital age; it's not like GOG or Steam is going to run out."

Someone acknowledging that "if it comes down to pre-ordering a game from GOG or pre-ordering a game from Steam with extra bonuses and free games that are actually good, it would become a really tough choice. One one hand there would be a cool company I admire and on the other there would be a cool company I admire a bit less + bonus shit."

"The actual proble is that majority of people don't really care about DRM, and so if they can either pre-order Steam version with some goodies or GOG version with nothing at all, they're quite likely to grab the Steam version."

HiPhish, who thinks that Steams's pre-order system is "despicable."

Seriously, what are you doing and why are you doing it?
Post edited April 14, 2013 by BadDecissions
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I pointed out that people in that thread claimed that GOG's pre-order bonuses weren't generous enough. The fact that people would set up a thread complaining that GOG's preorder bonuses were weak compared to the PC industry standard that is Steam pre-order shows how most of the people on this forum react at the threat of being "ripped off".
It's one thing to demand a good product for money, it's another to react solely out of spite and greed.
Post edited April 14, 2013 by jackalKnight
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jackalKnight: snip
It only takes one person to make a thread, you know.

You can't use thread topics to gauge the opinions of GOG users, as that's subject to a whole host of biases.
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jackalKnight: I pointed out that people in that thread claimed that GOG's pre-order bonuses weren't generous enough. The fact that people would set up a thread complaining that GOG's preorder bonuses were weak compared to the PC industry standard that is Steam pre-order shows how most of the people on this forum react.
Interesting, so if I were to create a thread on Steam's forum saying that all kitten must die that would show that most peoples on Steam forum (heck even most Steam users) are evil kitten killers.
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jackalKnight: snip
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bevinator: It only takes one person to make a thread, you know.

You can't use thread topics to gauge the opinions of GOG users, as that's subject to a whole host of biases.
It wasn't just the TC that claimed GOG's pre-order bonuses weren't generous enough. Granted, a counter-argument was also made that new CD Projekt games like Witcher 2 had excellent pre-order bonuses on GOG, but that's CD Projekt's own game.
I'd personally argue that GOG does as good a job as expected with the publisher support that it has, but expecting GOG to have the level of industry support Steam has is extremely unlikely.
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All right, I need to make a comment anyway. Because some hobo trolls (people who feel the need to visit GOG boards only to say how retarded the community is) don't understand what's going on. I don't know why some of you felt the need to turn this discussion into steam haters vs. steam lovers debate, because it has nothing to do with it.

The discussed issue is about an indie dev that acted disloyally to a portion of customers, no matter how small. I am not surprised people were expecting some sort of good will from an indie dev and especially not expected they will need to read the fine print.

Seriously, I really thought "legends of video game design" to be better than that. And yes, people were expecting, that DRM Free promise means DRM Free , not crippled, full experience, for everybody who has allergy on any form of platform dependance.

Just like people are expecting "avaible on PC" means on Windows 7, 8 and not Windows 95 only. Some old fart would write here "well, they never said Windows 7, so..." probably.

Every sane person sees that makers of Shadowrun Returns backed off from DRM Free offer as far as it was possible to not be sued for fraud or simply for refunds. And every sane person knows now, that they used DRM Free phrase only as a buzzword to gain even more attention (it doesn't matter if drm free crowd is significant enough, they did it to lure them, it's all that matters).

It's only significant they disclosed steam dependency and the fact DRM free version will not be sold to anybody after pulling back he money easily wasn't avaible, to notice this kind of behaviour is not cool.

As much as I don't care about non-invasive DRM, I fully understand why many backers are upset over this.
Post edited April 14, 2013 by keeveek
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jackalKnight: I pointed out that people in that thread claimed that GOG's pre-order bonuses weren't generous enough. The fact that people would set up a thread complaining that GOG's preorder bonuses were weak compared to the PC industry standard that is Steam pre-order shows how most of the people on this forum react at the threat of being "ripped off".
It's one thing to demand a good product for money, it's another to react solely out of spite and greed.
IMHO, biased sample. Most of the time, most people just don't give a *<piece of fecal matter>* about the forums. Well, maybe except for lurking on excellent advice threads concerning specific games.

Plus a case of "the same thing we do every night, Pinky - troll the forums fast and hard !".
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jackalKnight: I pointed out that people in that thread claimed that GOG's pre-order bonuses weren't generous enough. The fact that people would set up a thread complaining that GOG's preorder bonuses were weak compared to the PC industry standard that is Steam pre-order shows how most of the people on this forum react at the threat of being "ripped off".
It's one thing to demand a good product for money, it's another to react solely out of spite and greed.
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gkoczyk: IMHO, biased sample. Most of the time, most people just don't give a *<piece of fecal matter>* about the forums. Well, maybe except for lurking on excellent advice threads concerning specific games.

Plus a case of "the same thing we do every night, Pinky - troll the forums fast and hard !".
Good point. Most GOG users don't actually use the forums. I don't see how threads like this would encourage people to do so, given the blatant hostility in it. The game-specific subforums are really useful though, especially for things like Eador where some form of help/spoilers is almost mandatory.
Post edited April 14, 2013 by jackalKnight
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SimonG: Well, the GOG DRM free hypocrite club certainly isn't small, considering the amount of Steam/Desura keys from HIBs are being traded here.
Because there's no chance that people might actually end up with more than one copy of a game, right? Especially considering Humble's habit of adding in games from previous bundles as bonuses? Right? Right?
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jackalKnight: Good point. Most GOG users don't actually use the forums. I don't see how threads like this would encourage people to do so, given the blatant hostility in it. The game-specific subforums are really useful though, especially for things like Eador where some form of help/spoilers is almost mandatory.
Well there are some interesting POVs from both sides of the debate (e.g. Siannah, yours, Immoli) and overall it does not seem that hostile. Compared to some very vitriolic posts from both sides on Harebrained KS, I would even say GoG is almost Versailles-level diplomacy :)

Except the "typing with one hand" quip. Shame on you, SimonG - you nasty, nasty Internet person. ;P
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darkangelz: This fellow at the ks page at least seems to have received a reply regarding a refund:

mbpopolano24 about 18 hours ago
Hi guys, this is my last message here. I just want to let you know that in response to my email, HBS offered to refund my contribution. I declined and just asked to be removed from the database. In light of this response, I am now convinced that HBS did not take their decisions on DRM and game features with a malicious intent. So, have fun with the game and good-bye.

So those complaining, go ask for your refund if youre so agravated about it and move on. Continuing to complain just for the sake of complaining just looks ...
This.
For the TLTR guys: <span class="bold">HBS offering refund confirmed</span>.

Now take the actions you feel is appropriate, be it getting back the money you feel cheated on or beating the dead horse even further....