I've got my refund.

The monsters!!!

Anyway, it would now be interesting to see how many will actually care enough to get refunded. To all your moaners out there, put your money where your mouth is.... in kind of a reverse order, that is. and skip this game. That should be the end of it, I hope.

You have missed the point again. You ignore the fact that have always been discussions over DRM on this forum. Actually, it's probably the most discussed subject here. But all of these used to be more or less civil in the past, without the constant name calling and downrepping. Now it's different. If you express a different opinion than the majority you get:
A) downrepped
B) insulted
C) called a troll
D) called a fanboy (actually, it's the most used word around here)

Quite a few posts in this thread here corroborate with what i'm saying. You're either not reading carefully or just purposely ignoring that for your convenience.

I'm sorry, but that's not true. How were my posts, Amok's or Jackal's offensive or insulting? The insulting comes exactly from the majority of DRM-free defenders. Even SimonG's posts were pretty civil initially.

Not true. Please, show me one of my posts that's insulting. Please, i beg you. Neither were Amok's posts or Jackal's offensive. But guess what? They don't agree with the majority, so they must be either fanboys or trolls. Fuck them and their opinion.

You're making false accusations here. That's not nice.

In fact, quite a few posts in past pages are MUCH more insulting to SimonG than anything he has ever said. Yet they are there, and no one gives a fuck, while SimonG is "a troll". This is the kind of double standards that go beyond my comprehension. SimonG's posts were considered offensive, while explicit offensive posts weren't.

Again, show me one of my posts labeling anyone. Or from Amok, Jackal or orcish.

Anyway, for all of those complaining, they're offering refunds. Problem solved.
/endthread

No, I get the last word.

Ummm.... ostentatious!

/thread

This thread has been most educational.

I'll show more empathy towards major publishers like EA now when I see them making decisions I don't understand.

It's amazing how, with a little bit of money, us as individuals can start acting just like those publishers. Making demands, forcing our will, arguing among each other, enacting punishments upon one another, all because it's our dime funding the developers.

I'm not going to say whether one side is right or wrong, but all this bickering in this thread and many other places just like it, that's precisely why I don't back kickstarters. I'd rather be without the temptation/illusion of power.

From what the devs said, I don't believe this was their fault at all, so folks can stop blaming them. The way I understand it, they did intend in good faith to sell the game DRM free but when the final negotiations went through (they probably needed the kickstarter funds to fully acquire the license and just had an preliminary agreement there) they were told to either accept the must have DRM requirement or lose the license. They were able to get a one time exception only because they had already promised DRM free copies to backers and it sounds like they only just managed to get that through.

You can certainly blame the property owner here, but don't blame the developer unless more details come out that contradicts what I just said.

Bullshit. If they were not sure about that, they didn't get into terms with Microsoft prior, why the fuck they made such promises?

It's even worse for them in that case - because they promised something they have not secured. They just dropped DRM Free there and hoped it will work out. It's not only dishonesty, but pure stupidity.

Are these statements backed by something or is it assumptions. Could it also be that they knew right from the beginning of the KS campaign that they would only get some restricted DRM free rights but they wanted to have the money so badly they ignored the inconsistency with what they published during the campaign.

At the least they could have stated that the rights are still not negotiated and that in case that DRM free isn't going through they will offer simple refunds to every backer with DRM free. I guess it's all about displaying the situation like it is, not like they would like it to be. This is honest behavior.

But since it seems they offer refunds, everything is fine. And I also believe them that the rights holder is the one to blame most for this crappy "DLC must have DRM" move. It's really bad that such things still exist.

*shrug* DRM free is an ideology. And like all ideologies there are no absolute right or wrong answers. You either believe in it or don't.

Having only the DLC with DRM is a bit peculiar though. Maybe they are kind of semi-believing.

I would prefer if every customer just had the choice but then who would choose DRM if it would be purely optional. In this case I also don't care because I'm not interested in the game. I only want to know if they promised too much.

I requested a refund from their site by using the "Contact Us" form yesterday and since I did not get a reply yet I sent a mail directly to the address they mentioned in the kickstarter update. Let's see if that gets a reply.

While I have plenty of games with DRM, I don't think I purchased any of them at full price and I don't intend to fund such a game. It's too bad cause I probably would have liked the game, now I might get it when it drops under $5 including DLC.

Really? I'm still waiting for them to respond to my request and it's been several days.
People say that they're being offered refunds, but I'm still waiting on mine and it's been several days at this point. Not to mention the fact that they've had an interest free loan on all of this money for a year.

So, everything is not fine.
I sent mine on Sunday and have yet to hear a response from them. I think it's a bit suspicious that other people are claiming to have their refund already when they sent in the request after I did.

HBS failed to respond to my message as well. I'm not sure what to think; I've heard some people got refunds but I've also heard from more than one person that HBS hasn't responded to them at all, or only responded with a form message.

I'm really curious whether this is down to incompetence or stupidity, though I doubt they will tell us. I'd like to believe it was amateur hour and they didn't deliberately mislead us.

Well, if I haven't heard back from them by tomorrow morning, I'll send another email and hopefully they respond. It's probably possible for some of them to have gotten lost in the mail, but I won't be buying anything from HBS or anything that Jordan does ever again if I don't receive a refund.

I'm personally of the feeling that they should have known that the platforms would be subject to a sign off if that's the case and that should have been made clear at the time. When we backed the game it wasn't even clear IF they would be able to get greenlit, so to go from that to having Steam be the only way to get it on PC seems a bit extreme.

Respect works both way; there is nothing wrong with having a different opinion but it also depends on how you express it. (I am not taking about you in particular, at least not in this thread)

Saying "I personally don't have any problem with what HBS is doing" is called having an opinion, saying "There is nothing wrong with what HBS is doing, all those saying otherwise are self entitled whiners that luckily nobody cares about anymore" is called being a douche.

There will always be "extremists" on both side, but if there was less condescending remarks, less "just do ... and STFU", less calling peoples "moaners", "elitist", whatever, less passing fallacies for facts, etc.. then it would probably be a lot easier to have less "heated" and more "friendly" discussions.