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jodaniel3: Here's a question somebody could answer for me. Why don't they use the humble store? They do the hosting for the game and DLC (Trine 2: goblin menace), and humble only takes a 5% cut compared to steam's 30%.
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Antimateria: Steam is much more visible, doesn't really matter if they take more it still sells better in steam. I wouldn't heard even any humble stuff if I wouldn't read this forum and if it is released on a steam it seems like more like a normal game, not like some cheap ass indie. =P

I just watched some alpha footage of the game. Didn't look half bad.

Edit: like, like.. I own the vocabulary.. NOT.
I have no problem with them having a steam version. In fact, they would be idiots not to do it. My issue, however, is that they're saying that they don't want to have to host the content. Humble store fixes that issue for them.


EDIT: Also, they're are very few cheap indies on the humble store.
Post edited April 11, 2013 by jodaniel3
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jodaniel3: I have no problem with them having a steam version. In fact, they would be idiots not to do it. My issue, however, is that they're saying that they don't want to have to host the content. Humble store fixes that issue for them.

EDIT: Also, they're are very few cheap indies on the humble store.
Does it have multiplayer or something? If it is just distributing the game, I see why not they shouldn't sell it everywhere where possible.
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Antimateria:
This game does not have multiplayer as far as I know. The main reason they're saying this is for 2 reasons:

1. The game will have, and ONLY have, mods on the steam workshop.
2. They don't want to have to deal with hosting the game and DLC themselves.

I've already stated why 2 isn't a good excuse.

As for 1, it's so shallow. There are a ton of sites that host mods. What makes this game so special?
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Antimateria:
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jodaniel3: This game does not have multiplayer as far as I know. The main reason they're saying this is for 2 reasons:

1. The game will have, and ONLY have, mods on the steam workshop.
2. They don't want to have to deal with hosting the game and DLC themselves.

I've already stated why 2 isn't a good excuse.

As for 1, it's so shallow. There are a ton of sites that host mods. What makes this game so special?
Not sure how humble store does things, but one thing comes to mind why Steamworks is considered beneficial in regards to one stop hosting, is because it means they can sell their games on all the different digital sales portals as well as their own website or even retail, and all they have to do for that is to supply them with Steam keys.

Would the Humble store hosting allow them to use that hosting to sell on other retailers as well?
Post edited April 11, 2013 by Pheace
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jodaniel3: This game does not have multiplayer as far as I know. The main reason they're saying this is for 2 reasons:

1. The game will have, and ONLY have, mods on the steam workshop.
2. They don't want to have to deal with hosting the game and DLC themselves.

I've already stated why 2 isn't a good excuse.

As for 1, it's so shallow. There are a ton of sites that host mods. What makes this game so special?
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Pheace: Not sure how humble store does things, but one thing comes to mind why Steamworks is considered beneficial in regards to one stop hosting, is because it means they can sell their games on all the different sales portals including their own website and all they have to supply them are Steam keys.

Would the Humble store hosting allow them to use that hosting to sell on other retailers as well?
The humble store isn't a webpage storefront. The humble bundle company (that's their real name) has a widget that a developer can put on their website and people can purchase it using amazon, google, or paypal to process their payment. From there they are emailed a unique URL that supplies them with a download link for the game and the devs can give a steam key with the game. It's a very simple and cheap way to host their game on their site. If you want an example of this go to FTL's or Anodyne's website.

http://www.ftlgame.com/
Post edited April 11, 2013 by jodaniel3
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jodaniel3: The humble store isn't a webpage storefront. The humble bundle company (that's their real name) has a widget that a developer can put on their website and people can purchase it using amazon, google, or paypal to process their payment. From there they are emailed a unique URL that supplies them with a download link for the game and the devs can give a steam key with the game. It's a very simple and cheap way to host their game on their site. If you want an example of this go to FTL's or Anodyne's website.

http://www.ftlgame.com/
My point was, if they use the Humble Store hosting, do they have a way of going to other stores like Greenmangaming or Amazon or even Steam and say 'Here, sell our game, it's hosted @Humble Store'. If not then just using that hosting is severely limiting their exposure, which will hurt sales.
Well this game is released on Steam, by definition, this game will have drm.
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jodaniel3: The humble store isn't a webpage storefront. The humble bundle company (that's their real name) has a widget that a developer can put on their website and people can purchase it using amazon, google, or paypal to process their payment. From there they are emailed a unique URL that supplies them with a download link for the game and the devs can give a steam key with the game. It's a very simple and cheap way to host their game on their site. If you want an example of this go to FTL's or Anodyne's website.

http://www.ftlgame.com/
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Pheace: My point was, if they use the Humble Store hosting, do they have a way of going to other stores like Greenmangaming or Amazon or even Steam and say 'Here, sell our game, it's hosted @Humble Store'. If not then just using that hosting is severely limiting their exposure, which will hurt sales.
As I said earlier, I have no issue with them having a steam version. I take issue though at how they make having a DRM-free version such a hassle. The humble store is designed to be a hosting site for the dev's site, nothing more. Other sites (GMG, Gamersgate) can have the game hosted on their servers. Humble store is so the dev's can have a cheap way of selling the game on their site, which is what the devs are complaining about.
I don't know very much about mods and such, but can someone explain to me why Steam seems to be so essential? I understand it has a launcher, and its easy to make mods and patches accessable to everyone, etc, but the dev's say that the DRM free version "will be unable to browse and play community-created stories from within the game. Any future DLC will only be available through Steam".

I totally understand how steam can help browse community-created stories.

I don't understand why DLC can't just be in the form of an executable that you can download and modifies the program files (like some of the olden days expansions), and as an alternative to steam can be hosted on HIB.

I also don't understand why they can't just have a folder where people who have the DRM free version of the game (who download from whereever) can dump "community-created stories" and they can be loaded up from the game...

I think Torchlight 1 had something like that for mods, although I never used it.

If I am just super ignorant, don't hold back on telling me why...
Post edited April 11, 2013 by htown1980
high rated
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htown1980: I don't know very much about mods and such, but can someone explain to me why Steam seems to be so essential? I understand it has a launcher, and its easy to make mods and patches accessable to everyone, etc, but the dev's say that the DRM free version "will be unable to browse and play community-created stories from within the game. Any future DLC will only be available through Steam".

I totally understand how steam can help brown community-created stories.

I don't understand why DLC can't just be in the form of an executable that you can download and modifies the program files (like some of the olden days expansions), and as an alternative to steam can be hosted on HIB.

I also don't understand why they can't just have a folder where people who have the DRM free version of the game (who download from whereever) can dump "community-created stories" and they can be loaded up from the game...

I think Torchlight 1 had something like that for mods, although I never used it.

If I am just super ignorant, don't hold back on telling me why...
You're not being ignorant at all, sir. These are my exact same criticisms. It seems like it's laziness to me, since I sent an email asking them why don't they sell on GOG, to which they responded that they wanted to focus their energies elsewhere. Something is up if they don't want to sell their game on as many websites as possible.
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htown1980: I don't know very much about mods and such, but can someone explain to me why Steam seems to be so essential? I understand it has a launcher, and its easy to make mods and patches accessable to everyone, etc, but the dev's say that the DRM free version "will be unable to browse and play community-created stories from within the game. Any future DLC will only be available through Steam".

I totally understand how steam can help brown community-created stories.

I don't understand why DLC can't just be in the form of an executable that you can download and modifies the program files (like some of the olden days expansions), and as an alternative to steam can be hosted on HIB.

I also don't understand why they can't just have a folder where people who have the DRM free version of the game (who download from whereever) can dump "community-created stories" and they can be loaded up from the game...

I think Torchlight 1 had something like that for mods, although I never used it.

If I am just super ignorant, don't hold back on telling me why...
This is exactly what i thought too.
It has to be a way to disguise their DRM. DRM free is crippled, so people will have to buy the DRM ridden Steam version if they want the full experience.
Post edited April 11, 2013 by Point Man
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Pheace: Not sure how humble store does things, but one thing comes to mind why Steamworks is considered beneficial in regards to one stop hosting, is because it means they can sell their games on all the different digital sales portals as well as their own website or even retail, and all they have to do for that is to supply them with Steam keys.

Would the Humble store hosting allow them to use that hosting to sell on other retailers as well?
Considering that I haven't seen a single humble bundle sale that didn't include a Steam key, I'd say it would still work fine.

The Humble store is simply a front for providing indie groups an easy means of distributing DRM-free. Humble Bundle stores and distributes the install files themselves, no need to stress your servers. And unlike GoG, they support Mac, Windows, Android and Linux.


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Neobr10: They did say that an "account system" would be needed for the community features, but they didn't specify what kind of service they would use. Anyway it was predictable that they COULD use Steam, specially considering the popularity of the service and accessibility of Steam Workshop.
If they have the server resources to run two or three forums for the Shadowrun setting, I find it odd that they can't afford to support an "account system" that effectively runs a glorified download database for mods. I could understand if they wanted to run an aggregated multiplayer server, a la Diablo III or Sim City (snicker), but this talk about server load is befuddling otherwise.
Post edited April 11, 2013 by Decivre
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Pheace: Not sure how humble store does things, but one thing comes to mind why Steamworks is considered beneficial in regards to one stop hosting, is because it means they can sell their games on all the different digital sales portals as well as their own website or even retail, and all they have to do for that is to supply them with Steam keys.

Would the Humble store hosting allow them to use that hosting to sell on other retailers as well?
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Decivre: Considering that I haven't seen a single humble bundle sale that didn't include a Steam key, I'd say it would still work fine.
Yeah, my point wasn't about if they could add a Steam key or not, but rather whether it was viable to use the Humble Store as a sole point of hosting at the moment but it doesn't appear to be the case, which means they'd have to split their hosting between several sites at least and probably make different versions of their game. (granted, they're already doing that for their base game anyway)
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Pheace: Yeah, my point wasn't about if they could add a Steam key or not, but rather whether it was viable to use the Humble Store as a sole point of hosting at the moment but it doesn't appear to be the case, which means they'd have to split their hosting between several sites at least and probably make different versions of their game.
and that's when the problems start....
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Decivre: Considering that I haven't seen a single humble bundle sale that didn't include a Steam key, I'd say it would still work fine.
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Pheace: Yeah, my point wasn't about if they could add a Steam key or not, but rather whether it was viable to use the Humble Store as a sole point of hosting at the moment but it doesn't appear to be the case, which means they'd have to split their hosting between several sites at least and probably make different versions of their game. (granted, they're already doing that for their base game anyway)
Actually, they would only need to make 2 versions.. steam version and DRM-Free.