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Seryuu: My good dude, Muramasa is a 50 hours long game. It only has like around 5 sex scenes, which is less than an hour of the total content. So calling it a porn game is a straight out false statement. If that makes it a porn game, then Witcher, GTA and Mass Effect would also be porn games.
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bombardier: There are 5 sex scenes where each one lasts over 10 minutes?
I don't remember that kind of a setup in Witcher, GTS or Mass Effect. Must be a Director's cut version. :)
Depends on your reading speed, I guess, but generally no. The JAST games currently available at GOG are either serious stories that just happen to have plot related sex scenes, or games with a complex gameplay system like Venus Blood. While some visual novels can definitely be classified as porn, that is not the case for most of the recent GOG releases. Honestly, I believe that you are not being very objective here, as many visual novels like our upcoming Kurokami-sama's Feast are all age and never had any sex scene to begin with. So calling them all "just porn" because they have anime art is not correct.

While I'm here, the claim about them being sexist or objectifying women is also wrong, in fact many of the best visual novel writers and artist themselves are women. Some of the darkest VNs like Maggot Baits or Euphoria were in fact made by women. As well as our localization staff, many of our translators and editors happen to be women.
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HappyPunkPotato: That's literally what you're doing.
Wow, the greatest "no, you" argument of all time is being used! I'm convinced! Oh, or no, because that statement is a lie. If I were a fanatic like you guys, I would say "sell any porn games, and send those who are unhappy with it to hell". But instead I say "Sell porn (and any other) games to those who want to buy them, and give those who don't want ability to hide them". Tell me, do you really not see the difference between "GoG, do as I want and forget about others" and "GoG, do not limit yourself and customers in the assortment without a good reason, but let everyone customize the store for themselves"?

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HappyPunkPotato: Wrong again, the vegan asks the supermarket to stop selling animal products for the sake of the animals, that's kind of the whole point of veganism.
I have to disappoint you - fictional characters do not need your care and concern. Well, except for the Tamagotchi. And there are no real people in these games. And it can't be. So for whose sake you all are trying to cancel the sale of these games?

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HappyPunkPotato: Hmm, here's a thought, you think you're so unselfish, why don't you quit moaning about other people not liking porn games and go do that?
Maybe because it's not me who, page after page, is pretending to be a knight in a white cloak who can't live in peace because of someone's suffering, including far-fetched ones?)

And stop lying. Did I ever say that at least one of you should treat AO-games well? I even turn a blind eye to the fact that you repeatedly call “porn games” games in which erotic content does not even reach 5% of the total content of the game On the contrary, I say over and over again that everyone has their own preferences, and this is normal. I am solely opposed to requests to remove or ban anything that does not violate the rules and laws.

Even in the very post you quoted part of, I said:
And what is "boring and lame" for you is quite interesting for another. How many times do I need to repeat the same thing so that people like you finally realize that all people are different and their tastes are also different? Someone plays hundreds of hours in a Farming Simulator, someone considers Dwarf Fortress a masterpiece, someone sticks out for half a day in "hidden objects" or "three-in-a-row". All these games are not suitable for everyone, but this does not make them bad

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HappyPunkPotato: I'll say it again: I. Don't. Think. Game. Characters. Need. Help. Did you understand it that time? If not, feel free to quote the post where you think I said I did.
As mentioned above, there are no real people in these games and can't be. Fictional people don't need help, and, as you said, you understand that. So why, then, are you poking into this topic over and over again instead of either simply ignoring the games that you personally don't like, or joining the demand for more filtering options?


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Seryuu: While I'm here, the claim about them being sexist or objectifying women is also wrong, in fact many of the best visual novel writers and artist themselves are women. Some of the darkest VNs like Maggot Baits or Euphoria were in fact made by women. As well as our localization staff, many of our translators and editors happen to be women.
It's impossible! Only vile white cisgender oppressors and rapists can come up with this!!!111

But seriously, you're trying in vain. Rather, the heavens will fall to the ground than these people will hear arguments that do not fit into their "I see it this way and I want it that way"
Post edited January 17, 2022 by JuWalk
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LootHunter: It always amuses me, how people like you can claim opposite things in the span of single comment or single sentence.
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HappyPunkPotato: What, animals don't exist? Or did you think I was saying a hypothetical vegan needed help?
Animals exist. And if you use them as an analogy to fictional characters, you mean that you opposing anime porn for fictional characters' sake. Otherwise, your analogy doesn't make sense.
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JuWalk: But seriously, you're trying in vain. Rather, the heavens will fall to the ground than these people will hear arguments that do not fit into their "I see it this way and I want it that way"
I disagree. The goal isn't to convince hardliners like Orkpaj and Bombardier, rather it is to influence people who are currently neutral. The more ordinary people who are convinced that egalitarianism is the way to go, the better the world will become. The refutations of Seryuu is but one brick in that process.
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bombardier: There are 5 sex scenes where each one lasts over 10 minutes?
I don't remember that kind of a setup in Witcher, GTS or Mass Effect. Must be a Director's cut version. :)
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Seryuu: Depends on your reading speed, I guess, but generally no. The JAST games currently available at GOG are either serious stories that just happen to have plot related sex scenes, or games with a complex gameplay system like Venus Blood. While some visual novels can definitely be classified as porn, that is not the case for most of the recent GOG releases. Honestly, I believe that you are not being very objective here, as many visual novels like our upcoming Kurokami-sama's Feast are all age and never had any sex scene to begin with. So calling them all "just porn" because they have anime art is not correct.
If this is the case with JAST games, than there is an easy way to tell if the game is porn or not...
Is there a menu option to replay the sex scenes?

Being a Dik, that is prominently using a lot of space on GoG store page, is being uploaded on pornhub. So I don't think that any extra test is necessary here.

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Seryuu: While I'm here, the claim about them being sexist or objectifying women is also wrong, in fact many of the best visual novel writers and artist themselves are women. Some of the darkest VNs like Maggot Baits or Euphoria were in fact made by women. As well as our localization staff, many of our translators and editors happen to be women.
I don't think that being a female author makes you immediately immune to objectification claim.
Belladonna is a woman, yet you sure as hell can't say that her movies don't objectify woman.
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JuWalk: ...
Don't view HappyPunkPotato too harshly. He's triggered today because I keep pointing out that he's a fake boycotter as he's stated that he is still buying games from GoG despite claiming that he's boycotted GoG.
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I don't see why this is even being discussed.
It's not that I don't get your frustration since I share it, I don't even like sexy times in games when they are done tastefully, to be completely honest, so porn games are a complete no-go for me.

Like you said though, the games sell, so why wouldn't GOG - a store for games that makes money off of game sales - sell them? GOG never advertised itself as 100% nudity-free or anything like that. I'd throw a fit if they sell DRM content since that'd mean they blatantly lied to me, but porn games? I don't like them but I wasn't promised NOT to see porn games, you know?

The only thing we COULD discuss here that I can think of is to add some sort of maturity filter in case children visit the site. If I had a kid I'd love for them to be interested in games and I'd definitely go to GOG to buy them games, so I could totally get behind that argument.

But yeah... Respect your opinion, just don't see why you're mad, you haven't been lied to or anything.
Post edited January 17, 2022 by Karterii1
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bombardier: Belladonna is a woman, yet you sure as hell can't say that her movies don't objectify woman.
First of all, I (and I think Seryuu too) totally can say that.
Second, if "objectification" is such a universally bad thing, why would a woman make such films that "objectify" her?
And third - I actually failed to find that Belladonna. Are her movies some obscure porn? And if they are, how do you know about them if you are such an anti-porn guy?
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Women can't do stuff that objectify their gender? That could be even insulting to women's intelect/capabilities if you would go deep into that, regardless of any morals and decency talk.

Who was the most famous sex trafficking lady now?

And what about feminists? Lots of them tend to do the opposite of what they want to look like they stand for.
What about gay people? They do tend to objectify their genders. Don't forget about gay people! There is also lots of feminist gay people. It usually ends up with women running around naked on the public...

Just throwing that out there. :D
Those arguments.
Oh.. I really forgot I shouldn't say facts or even opinions of mine here because it somehow upsets people because they threw theirs and feel bad about it... It's just so hard to ignore this one. :D
Post edited January 17, 2022 by Ramor_
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Ramor_: I really forgot I shouldn't say facts
Don't worry, so far you haven't told a single fact. Or even a statement that makes sense.

Also, didn't you say earlier that you are out of this discussion?

UPD. Oh, wait.
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Ramor_: And what about feminists? Lots of them tend to do the opposite of what they want to look like they stand for.
Ok, this checks out.
Post edited January 17, 2022 by LootHunter
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I like your selective skills and understanding. :D
Post edited January 17, 2022 by Ramor_
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bombardier: Belladonna is a woman, yet you sure as hell can't say that her movies don't objectify woman.
I have no idea who "Belladonna" is or what content her films have.

But when it comes to video games, or any other media, the claims of "objectifying women" are almost always BS, and the ones in this thread certainly are.

Most people making that claim do so solely on the basis that the women characters are drawn to be pretty, sexy, feminine, and attractive. There is nothing at all wrong with a woman having those traits, nor with the viewers of that woman appreciating that she has those traits.

Those traits are actually an empowering celebration of women, not an 'objectification' of women.

Almost all people enjoy seeing a woman being drawn to have those traits. Even other women who are 100% straight like looking at attractive women.
Post edited January 17, 2022 by Ancient-Red-Dragon
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Ancient-Red-Dragon: I actually agree with you. I was just replying to their arguments. I am very careful with what I word. But there is also the fact that anime is not really surrounded by grown-up 'women' in it's content and the fact that quality of anime is just tearing down quality of GOG and of gaming overall. Noone here (as far as I noticed) was against it's existence per se. Same with pure nudity and sexuality.

And the fact that it's made by women doesn't mean it's good or better. That's actually sexist to say.

But people defending that are not able to get the whole picture and they must dissect it one by one so it's defendable and they can comprehend other people's ideas by a bit.
As I see. I understand it must confuse them. It tends them to contradict.
Post edited January 17, 2022 by Ramor_
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I don't see what y'all are up in arms about lmao.

If its a quality thing, lemme assure you, each of these VN are of much higher quality than cyberpunk2077.

Just some puritans with a bee in yer bonnets, whole bunch
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Ramor_: I am very careful with what I word.
I actually agree with that. You always choose to word your claims so they would be dubious. And when people call you out you just use the "that's not what I meant" card. And you never make straight answers.
What is "sexual objectification"?
Why is "sexual objectification" bad?
If it's so bad, why do women do that to themselves? Why when men do that to themselves, it doesn't count?
What's the difference between porn games that you are okay with (Witcher, Cyberpunk, The Last of Us Part 2) and those that you want off GOG (Being a DIK, anime VNs)?
You just continue to recite woke dogmas without actually making arguments with logic or facts.
Post edited January 17, 2022 by LootHunter