Microfish_1: "arguing ... without any proof to try and kickstart something", and I tend to see this as neutral at best and scummy at worst.
I think that if a player does so while the game is in full swing, and everyone is contributing, it's indeed very likely to be scummy. However, ~36 hours after the start of the game, it felt completely stalled. No activity at all for
10 hours, and then a complete fluff post. Given those circumstances, I felt - and feel - justified in dragging the game away from RVS in any way necessary. I believe it has been successful. Yes, I'm in the strange position of not yet being universally town-read by the middle of D1, but we also have a lot of useful secondary interactions to look at and draw conclusions from, e.g. trent and blotunga probably aren't a team (modulo WIFOM). Worth it on balance for the game, even if slightly uncomfortable for me.
On the broader topic, though, I like how you've responded here and explained your reasoning. Slight town-lean for you. (Still defying the odds, eh?)
gogtrial34987: ...
okay, that ran entirely too long, and it's late again. Probably little from me tomorrow, but I should be back in full force on Friday.
(Hoping I didn't mess up any of my links - if I did, a bump would be welcome.)
Vitek: It seems you are very interested in what people think of trent's statement but I am still unsure of your position of it.
I think I even asked about it before?
As I just explained to Phaolo, trent's read and the reactions to that was just the clearest example to provide to Phaolo of something happening on D1 that he could react to.
As far as I'm aware, you haven't asked me to directly. Obliquely you posted:
Vitek: Trent's proclamation of gogtrial as town reads to me a bit too much as something he did when we were mafia together.
which I even responded to:
gogtrial34987: Specifically: I thought the same about trent's proclamation (though I strongly suspect he only does that as scum because he believes he'd also do it as town) - but do you believe he'd also do that if we were both scum?
But, since you asked, what I think of trent's statement is still percolating through my mind.
In sequence it's gone something like, "interesting that trent would townread me. He also did so in #67 (putting me in his "town core") to then promptly NK me", but after mulling that over for a bit, I still felt good about it, and thus about trent. Then blotunga's post pulled me out of that with the buddying angle (which I'm now doubting; trent is not really someone to deliberately buddy, afaik). I
liked the way he pointed out what could be a genuine scum-tell for me. (but - see realisation I just had in response to dedo's questioning - overlooked that that doesn't actually make since wrt his town-read in this current game!)
I think he's saying things that make sense and reflect my own thinking in
#149 and
#176. I *know* it's not alignment indicative for him to say these things, but it still made me want to not send him to lunch.
I'm very interested at this point in how he's going to square his explanation for the difference between town- and scum-me, with his town-read of me based on my actual actions.
Microfish_1: I'll turn your question around at you. What about you? If you are town, do you think this read is coming from scum trent or town trent?
See above.
Microfish_1: I didn't play 55, nor have I read it. Could you please summarize how you knew Scene was scum? Gut? Concrete knowledge or abstract knowledge based off of assumptions?
Concrete knowledge. I was tragic lovers with Joe, who was nominally on the mafia team (with the team having a power structure to try and make certain Joe wasn't in charge of NKs), so could inform me about team composition (and then ZFR shortcircuited that by just giving me read access to mafia-chat, which was seen as tilting the balance too far in our favour).
Microfish_1: I am voting Joe but think the concensus (no doubt with at least one scum helping the narrative, so i have to be cautious here) is we have enough people questioning gogtrial to actually achieve a non-last minute lunch, and so am willing to switch to him
You've semi-retracted several things after our back-and-forth discussions. Could you sum up what's left at this point which makes you believe me to be a worthy lunch target?
I'm particularly interested in this willingness, given earlier statements like:
Microfish_1: I really like his analysis as presented to Phaolo and what a mafia player ought to be doing.
What changed?
Microfish_1: I...don't know. I've only played one game (stanley hotel) with him previously, that I recall
We also played together in
#67 - Mamlakat al Shams, where yes, I was nightkilled early on, but we had quite some interactions on D1, and in
#59 - Previously on Mafia..., where we both played together for the entire game until Pooka and dedo trounced us.
