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Lifthrasil: ...
Your argument makes a lot of sense. If we were able to use an ability to protect a Town cop, CSPVG's claim will just confuse that, and possibly make us waste an ability on possibly Scum. As you said, if he is Scum, he does not have to worry about a night kill, and as we all seem set on RWarehall, now is the perfect chance for Scum to come forwards and try to confuse things further. They know we will probably stick with RWarehall to lynch, so they are free to look a little suspicious, while still not as suspicious as RWarehall, so they know they will be safe from getting lynched tonight.

I still think RWarehall is the right choice, but I agree with you that we should watch very closely to see what happens during the night and to what we can discover during day 2.
Another bomb?!?

Why did I let flub talk me into partaking in this game?
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Lifthrasil: snip
I disagree. While the scenario you portray is possible I don't see it being likely. The fact is yes we have a day 1 cop, but I would be surprised if scum didn't have a way to counter this (Strongman, Watcher) which will see yogs dead in a few days time. Why sacrifice one of the scum now? Someone was bound to have called CSPVG on his claim, so it would only be a matter of time before he got lynched or scanned or something.
Honestly scum have already lost RWarehall's potential NKs (which have a higher chance of hitting town than scum and speed up them outnumbering us and winning), I can't see them throwing one of their own under a bus for somewhat dubious benefits.

I still think CSPVG claiming now is stupid, but something told me we might have two cops in this game so I do believe his claim. The big question is whether either of them are accurate. Chances of them being random is highly unlikely, as that would mean both random results were correct. But CSPVG could be Naive and yogs could be Paranoid. Of course if both of them had just waited we might have a better idea what's going on...
We had a perfect scenario for first lynch, a self confirmed serial killer (and theres NO way we can keep him on a leash people, although I salute Rwarehall for trying to cut a deal), with definitive results from said lynch. Ideal for all.

Now - we have a second cop claim. It at once casts doubt on Yogs claim, and throws us all into a huge conundrum.

I cant believe we have two town Cops. So one of them is lying. We have to decide who. I pity whoever has a protect role tonight - one wrong move and we could lose our town cop. Or the scum could leave the 'other' cop alive just to continue to muddy the waters.

Possible scenarios for me :

1) Yog is scum. He has some sort of night action that gives faction, and gets Rwarehall as 'anti-town'.

Now - he knows his fellow scum, so is presented with a perfect way to present himself as Town and gain many many townie points. He claims, fingers Rwarehall, we lynch, and he gets a free pass for the rest of the game.
Why did Yog claim Cop, knowing there would probably be a counter claim? Well, he had to convince us about his read of Rwarehall, and obviously thought at least it would create confusion and sow discord. And, one thing about Yogs wording - i've never heard a cop 'scanning' anyone before.

2) CSPVG is scum. His only reason for the claim would be to try and draw the protect tonight, and create the very conundrum we have now got

What to do then? We lynch Rwarehall (sorry mate, but you were doomed as soon as you claimed). But then whoever is a protector has a massive decision to make - protect CSPVG, or protect Yog?

Now the scenarios painted above might be slightly different, but I still believe it comes down to one of CSPVG / Yogsloth lying.

If the protect roles make a wrong choice tonight, we lose the Town Cop. Or, scum take a risk and leave the cop alone, hoping his nights 'scan' (still don't like that wording) doesn't turn up scum, just to mess with our heads some more

Discuss. I will vote RWarehall when its closer to deadline, but no need to do so now and risk a chance discussion is cut short..
I had another idea. I think maybe I can reform. All you would have to do, (and those scum Mafia too) would be to give up on milk, I mean like forever. Seriously, you do not realize how tempting it is to harvest your calcium rich bones. If you gave up milk, my temptation would be over. See? We could have a happy symbiotic relationship. And better yet, if you became a milk-free town and some scum mafia milk peddlers came to town again, well, I could relapse and show them what it feels like to be carved up like a Turkey on Christmas Day! Holiday festivities!
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Lifthrasil: snip
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adaliabooks: I disagree. While the scenario you portray is possible I don't see it being likely. The fact is yes we have a day 1 cop, but I would be surprised if scum didn't have a way to counter this (Strongman, Watcher) which will see yogs dead in a few days time. Why sacrifice one of the scum now? Someone was bound to have called CSPVG on his claim, so it would only be a matter of time before he got lynched or scanned or something.
But that was anyhow the case. With Yog having expressed his unhappiness with CSPVGs lurking - and his doubts about CSPVGs towniness, there was a good chance that CSPVG would have been his scan target rather sooner than later - so what better way to deal with this than to question the sanity of the cop? Sow the idea that our cop might be paranoid, so now, when Yog scans CSPVG and gets a scum reading, CSPVG alwasy can say: "See, now we know he's a paranoid cop"
The effect of that statement would be much reduced if it came AFTER a scum-reading on him. So CSPVG, assuming that he would soon be scanned, may have claimed pre-emptively to lessen the effect of that reading result that is probable to come. Also scum has to avoid a 'follow the cop' scenario, if they want to have a chance at winning. So if CSPVG is scum, his claim makes sense for him and it helps the mafia in the long run. While if he is town, it just was stupid.


Something different: I'll be absent over the weekend until Sunday late evening/night. I'm anxious to see what other bombs have been dropped until than... ;-)
Have fun and a nice weekend!
And for all you questioning my integrity. My motivation is simple, you all should understand. Killing is fun! And living another day getting another chance to kill some mafia milk-dealing peddler. You do realize your entire town is the victim of propaganda from the milk lobby right? It really is vile stuff, do you have any idea what it is doing to you. I think it's really mind control, an offshoot of MK-Ultra. Add an "I" and a "L" and you get milk. See what I'm saying? You are all being controlled by the government through the preservatives and additives they put in your milk and feed to the dairy cows. I think if you can give up milk long enough, you can return to normal.
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adaliabooks: I disagree. While the scenario you portray is possible I don't see it being likely. The fact is yes we have a day 1 cop, but I would be surprised if scum didn't have a way to counter this (Strongman, Watcher) which will see yogs dead in a few days time. Why sacrifice one of the scum now? Someone was bound to have called CSPVG on his claim, so it would only be a matter of time before he got lynched or scanned or something.
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Lifthrasil: But that was anyhow the case. With Yog having expressed his unhappiness with CSPVGs lurking - and his doubts about CSPVGs towniness, there was a good chance that CSPVG would have been his scan target rather sooner than later - so what better way to deal with this than to question the sanity of the cop? Sow the idea that our cop might be paranoid, so now, when Yog scans CSPVG and gets a scum reading, CSPVG alwasy can say: "See, now we know he's a paranoid cop"
The effect of that statement would be much reduced if it came AFTER a scum-reading on him. So CSPVG, assuming that he would soon be scanned, may have claimed pre-emptively to lessen the effect of that reading result that is probable to come. Also scum has to avoid a 'follow the cop' scenario, if they want to have a chance at winning. So if CSPVG is scum, his claim makes sense for him and it helps the mafia in the long run. While if he is town, it just was stupid.

Something different: I'll be absent over the weekend until Sunday late evening/night. I'm anxious to see what other bombs have been dropped until than... ;-)
Have fun and a nice weekend!
Ok. I can buy this logic. I'm still not certain that it's correct, but I can see where you are coming from. I have you down as fairly strong town right now, so I can't really see you as scum actively seeking to have us lynch one of our cops.

I still believe CSPVGs claim, but the question is, how would we tell if one of them is insane / naive / paranoid etc?
They can both scan one player, but then if they got different results you wouldn't know which is right. We could leave RWarehall alive and have CSPVG scan (Robb, I think this wording may be a throw back to the last game, I presume investigate is the term you prefer?) him, but that could be very dangerous and a waste of an investigation.

I would volunteer to be scanned by both, knowing I'll be town, but if one of them is paranoid and shows me scum then me volunteering could easily be a ploy to give me town points in the event that was the case.

Whatever we do, I think it might just waste possible scans, and I think the scum will have some way to silence one or both of them eventually, so I'm at a lose.

I think another thing to consider, is if we were to have two cops, and by some miracle neither of them have a negative modifier, what does that mean for the make up of the scum team? What roles would they have to counter that?
See? Yog and CSPVG have more in common than they could have ever imagined. Premature claiming.
And with all this claiming you really might want my help...
Is the doctor the next one scheduled to claim? This is becoming interesting!
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RWarehall: And with all this claiming you really might want my help...
Is the doctor the next one scheduled to claim? This is becoming interesting!
I really bloody hope not. I would like to request that no one else claims before the end of the day unless:

A) You are scum, in which case claim away.
B) You have a list of all the players who are scum, in which case why the hell haven't you shared it already? :P
I have a list.
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flubbucket: I have a list.
:P
Why in the world did you thing now was a good time to claim CSPVG? If both your claim and yog's claim is true then all you are doing is handing the scum our two investigative roles on a silver platter. And out of 17 other people why did you investigate yog's on night 0?

The way RWarehall is acting I believe yog's and RW are telling the truth, but I'm not sure about CSPVG because his claim was done for no reason at all. No pressure to claim, just a random "hey I'm a cop too and I scanned your other cop on night 0". And if CSPVG is telling the truth I still don't understand why in the hell he would bring it up.

Whatever is going on people need to STOP WITHT THE ROLE CLAIMING!
Maybe you can stop the role claiming by promising to hand them to me on Night 3 and let me have fun with them!