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General discussion@GOG: I just learned that It is your fault if games are not up to date. Change your update policy!(55 posts)(55 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted December 06, 2020
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immi101: And none of your links offers any additional evidence to that.
Might this prove more substance?
Posted December 06, 2020
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Mugiwarah: ... but personaly i prefer a safe game than an update version that might be release with crap software in it by malicious developer.
I understand but again I ask, how GOG looking at the files personally prevents this from happen more than a firewall with integrated malware software? I am pretty sure that all GOG can do is to run several malware checkers over the files - they won't deconstruct the files to look exactly what's in them, - that's too much time. Also keep in mind that devs eventually will get the possibility to update their games without validation first ... who is guaranteeing you that those won't turn malicious someday?
Post edited December 06, 2020 by MarkoH01
Posted December 06, 2020
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immi101: personally i am still not sold on the premise that the lack of an automated upload process gives developers a valid excuse not to update their games here. Didn't agree with that before galaxy existed, don't agree with it now.
I don't think game developers deserve that the blame is getting shifted entirely to GOG.
You misunderstood. The problem is that you won't get the update as a paying customer as long as GOG hasn't validated it and since we all know that they are slow you'll have to wait. In times of an epidemic even longer. In other words: the devs DID update his game but you still won't receive the update before they validated it. That is the whole problem. And the idea of using the Galaxy Backend was to give devs the possibility to care for their games themselves without even having GOG involved. That obviously does at least not always (to pick up your question if I can go from one dev to all devs) happen and therefore in such cases it is GOGs fault if we have to wait for updates. GOG however also is constantly blaming the devs for missing updates.

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immi101: you want GOG to notice you and you post on the forums ? you must be new here :p
(sorry, couldn't resist that) ;)
No, not new at all - as you probably know - but unfortunalety I don't have any people left at GOG that I could talk to directly and that are involved with the process in question. Believe me if I had I would have contacted them. Once again, I miss the time when Judas was helping me out but unfortunately I was unable to contact him since over a year now :( Anyway, since "creating a support ticket" also would not help at all (I did it once in a similar case and instead of help or feedback I got just told to stop keeping support doing important work) the forum post was my last idea ... maybe not the best but imo it was better than nothing.
Post edited December 06, 2020 by MarkoH01
Posted December 06, 2020
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MarkoH01: GOG however also is constantly blaming the devs for missing updates.
Is that actually the case? I've mostly seen just radio silence from GOG.

GOG users on the other hand.. yeah many of them immediately blame the devs even if they have no clue what's going on behind the scenes.
Posted December 06, 2020
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immi101: But what the OP is claiming is that GOG does not _allow_ some developers (at least one) to use the galaxy infrastructure at all. And the OP is quite right that this would be quite illogical and nonsensical, given all the decisions that GOG made in the past 4 years or so. What I haven't seen is any evidence that there actually is a policy behind this where GOG separates devs into the cool guys (allowed to use galaxy) and the uncool guys (not allowed to use galaxy).
To make this a bit more clear. My complaint is about the idea of not giving devs the possibility to update games immediately because GOG first will have to check them before eventually giving the dev the possibility to update without any validation. So even if the dev has access to the Backend what's the point if it still has to get validated first? Apparently the validation happens a few times before letting devs update without validation. I never talked about some devs getting previleges to upload unvalidated updates and some not - that's why I talked about a policy - a rule. The rule being first updates still have to be validated and I don't see any reason why.
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MarkoH01: GOG however also is constantly blaming the devs for missing updates.
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clarry: Is that actually the case? I've mostly seen just radio silence from GOG.

GOG users on the other hand.. yeah many of them immediately blame the devs even if they have no clue what's going on behind the scenes.
It's been ages ago since I even contacted them because of missing updates (why even bother, right?) and when I did I often got replies in the way that they don't have the update yet. Yes, todays policy (and that one is pretty much proven, I'd say) is radio silence ... there were different times ... long ago.
Post edited December 06, 2020 by MarkoH01
Posted December 06, 2020
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MarkoH01: [...]the idea of using the Galaxy Backend was to give devs the possibility to care for their games themselves without even having GOG involved.
The idea of Galaxy imo is to have a proprietary DRM system. Benefits to the customer like "your game will be updated faster" are not as much a priority, as your topic has indicated. The only things I would expect to get updated and fixed frequently are the social media features and other aspects of data collection, i.e. things that don't directly benefit the customer or that benefit the customer in some sort of symbiotic way that also benefits the corporation (e.g. online achievements). If my opinion is correct, it's no wonder we have to wait so long for offline installers...they are way, way back in the order of operations.
Posted December 06, 2020
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MarkoH01: To make this a bit more clear. My complaint is about the idea of not giving devs the possibility to update games immediately because GOG first will have to check them before eventually giving the dev the possibility to update without any validation. So even if the dev has access to the Backend what's the point if it still has to get validated first? Apparently the validation happens a few times before letting devs update without validation.
oh ok, so it's not even about GOG preventing games from getting updates, just that in case of developers new here on GOG it takes a little while before the update becomes visible to users because it has to go through GOG's infamous QA department, even when using the galaxy backend.
And you argue that the delay could easily be eliminated. Fair point I guess.
I still think your OP is overshooting the target a little bit, with the whole "it's all GOG's fault if games are not up to date".
Or maybe i'm just too easily triggered by clickbait thread titles *shrug*
anyways, apologies for apparently totally misreading what this complaint was about and derailing the thread :)
Posted December 06, 2020
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immi101: I still think your OP is overshooting the target a little bit, with the whole "it's all GOG's fault if games are not up to date".
Or maybe i'm just too easily triggered by clickbait thread titles *shrug*
anyways, apologies for apparently totally misreading what this complaint was about and derailing the thread :)
Maybe I did overstep a little (even though I never said "all") but like I said, my goal was for GOG to read it and see that we have troubles enough with missing updates that they really should not make it any harder as necessary to those who really intend to update their games. Apologies accepted /though none are necessary imo ) but maybe it was my fault as well in not explaining the problem good enough.
Post edited December 06, 2020 by MarkoH01
Posted December 06, 2020
I agree, GOG should change this policy or make the updates go up faster, it's unbelievable that some patches are years behind after seeing the GOG second-class citizen games thread.
Posted December 06, 2020
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MarkoH01: They will get this access eventually but not immediately that is the problem. Obviously GOG wants to be really sure that they can trust the dev.
That doesn't seem to be the case, though, since the Streets of Rogue dev posted here shortly after the game appeared on GOG, saying that whatever the case was in the past, the current update process was very easy.
Posted December 06, 2020
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MarkoH01: They will get this access eventually but not immediately that is the problem. Obviously GOG wants to be really sure that they can trust the dev.
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eric5h5: That doesn't seem to be the case, though, since the Streets of Rogue dev posted here shortly after the game appeared on GOG, saying that whatever the case was in the past, the current update process was very easy.
So he was allowed to ulpoad without verification immediately?
Posted December 07, 2020
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MarkoH01: We all know about the many missing updates on GOG (If not just take a look at the link below):
https://www.gog.com/forum/general/games_that_treat_gog_customers_as_second_class_citizens_v2

and we all know how tiresome it is for the paying customer to hunt for updates because GOG unfortunately does not really help in such cases. In fact they are still selling outdated games without even mentioning this unimportant little fact.

Just recently I talked to a dev because the game was not up to date with the Steam release. I knew about the possibility to use the Galaxy Backend to let devs update their games the same as on Steam. This was one reason why Galaxy even was created years ago and it also was one of the big selling points of Galaxy. GOG promised us and the devs faster updates - nearly the same as on Steam. So I was wondering why the game from this dev was not up to date and the dev told me that he did not get access to the possibility to update the game by himself yet. He would have to upload the files to GOG and they would have to check them.

When I heard this I almost punched against a wall. We (the paying customers) are constantly begging GOG to bring their games up to date since years but GOG obviously is preventing devs to simply update their games by themselves? Newsflash GOG: You guys are good but extremely slow and everybody knows this - especially when it comes to updates. Also you are absolutely not without mistakes - in fact you are doing quite a lot of them and quite often games updated by GOG are faulty BECAUSE of GOG and not because of the dev. So you really should change your policy here and grant devs access as fast as possible so that they can update their games immediately. There's absolutely NO reason not to trust them. If they introduce a bug they can fix the bug as well ... devs are doing this on Steam since ages ... in fact they probably are the only one who can (I just have to think about the many support tickets I created which simply have been forwarded to product ... and never been fixed because according to GOG the dev has to do this ...).

All these years I thoght that the devs are guilty for all those missing updates here in GOG. It really hit me when I heard that obviously GOG is guilty as well. And yes @GOG staff feel free to give us some feedback. Stop "listening" to our feedback only and provide one as well - I am all ears. What you are doing here is all kinds of wrong so the very least we can get is a reasonable reply why you would prevent any dev to update their game as fast as possible. Especially in the time of a pandemic.
you know, i'm not not surprised. and this is just the tip of the iceberg.
Posted December 07, 2020
To play devil's advocate...

Wasn't there recently an issue involving games like No Man's Sky introducing "DRM'd" content in one of their updates?
Maybe this manual process is put in place to check if the devs aren't uploading "DRM'd" content?

It seems to me like GOG consists of a group of people that have good intentions but are a little too ambitious given their size.

They want to give refunds to all players who request them but have small Support Teams.
They want all their games to be DRM-free, but also want players to be able to play modern games online despite them relying on central servers.
They want to curate every game release but have too few people to play and examine game releases for curation purposes.
They want to cater to older customers who want to play without clients, but also want to cater to younger players who want their games to include social features.
They want their games to be up-to-date, but also want every update to be checked manually.
They want to make money, but most of their catalogue is made up of (what are now considered) niche titles.
They want their one client to serve as the one-stop shop for PC gaming, yet their competition consists of multiple multi-million (billion?) dollar companies.

Is that a fair assessment..?
This seems like another thing where the team has good intentions but can't really realize their ambitions.

... Either that, or they just don't care, like most companies in 2020.
Post edited December 07, 2020 by SomeGuy8504
Posted December 07, 2020
I kinda doubt GoG is here alone at fault... take a look at the Panzer Corps 2 forums.
Some guy promised to integrate achievements for Galaxy several patches and half
a year later... nothing. Or Deus Ex MD that still has the same day 1 bugs as the steam
version. (shooting range issues and DX12 bugging out for example)

also playing online does not equal DRM per see, i would claim. But yes the team is
too small at the moment, to keep up. I share that impression.

Also i like Galaxy and i am a "OLD customer" who like to OWN what he buys, which
is the reason i support GoG and only GoG and i always will as long as the games i
buy here work comletely standalone and without Galaxy and Internet. Having the
option is the key here. imo
Posted December 07, 2020
Three years (Windows version here since 11th of December 2017) waiting for GOG to give us the Linux version of X3TC & X3AP. If they lost the files, they could ask Egosoft to resend them. GOG should also package it better but that can be worked around.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussion@GOG: I just learned that It is your fault if games are not up to date. Change your update policy!(55 posts)(55 posts)
(55 posts)