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General discussionGame dev has meltdown over negative reviews and takes his ball and goes home (145 posts)(145 posts)
(145 posts)
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This is my favourite topic
Posted June 16, 2015
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Psyringe: ...
I agree for the most part, and he could have been a man about it: take criticism, listen to ideas, update the game with better art, make a new better game and so on. But instead he acted like a manchild and went like "wah, wah, you're all immature poopieheads and you don't know how hard it is to make a game, you will never be as grown up as me" and placed a giant picture of a turd on the Steam store page. Not his blog, not his website, the Steam store page. And now the entire internet is pointing the finger at the (supposedly) 40-year old man who pissed his pants in public. In a week or two he will be forgotten again.
Posted June 16, 2015
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javihyuga: tl;dr Yes, Jim Sterling is a twat.
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htown1980: I reckon the character Jim Sterling plays is a twat, but I also reckon a lot of people don't pick up that he is playing a character.
Playing a character is just an excuse to get away with being a twat.
Posted June 16, 2015
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javihyuga: tl;dr Yes, Jim Sterling is a twat.
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htown1980: I reckon the character Jim Sterling plays is a twat, but I also reckon a lot of people don't pick up that he is playing a character.
Or it could be that people do pick it up, but find that it does not matter.

I'm seeing a person named Jim Sterling behaving like an arrogant prick, repeatedly, and so I arrive at the conclusion that Jim Sterling is an arrogant prick.

If Jim Sterling is just a character, and the person behind it has a different name and a different personality, then that's good for him, but it doesn't affect my assessment that Jim Sterling is a prick.

And of course, the person behind the Jim Sterling character would still receive my criticism for deliberately using such an intolerable character in the way he does.
Posted June 16, 2015
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Psyringe: I'm sorry, but this is not the case of customers being dissatisfied with a product they paid good money for. This is a case of a dev delivering a decent first effort, but overestimating the quality of his product, and then facing a wall of trolls who were happy to find a victim for yet another shitstorm. It doesn't help to blame only one party, imho.
No, no and no. In no free market do you get brownie points or get cut some slack just for "trying". If I commissioned a translator to translate a text for me, and that translation was full of translation, spelling and grammar errors (and there are plenty of them), under no circumstances would I call it a "decent first effort" or cut him slack for "trying".

It's a simple fact: He. Charged. Money. It is a commercial product. It was a business transaction. If individuals choose to "go easy" on him because it was his first attempt, that's a matter of goodwill - what we call in Germany "Kulanz". But it is the good right of any customer to complain and raise awareness of generally shoddy workmanship.

I'm a translator. If I make the odd comprehension mistake, or miss out a word, then I would hope that the client will extend to me a little latitude for such minor missteps. But if I chucked a translation into Google Translate, ironed out a few of the obvious creases and sent it off as is, then I needn't wonder if the client refused to pay or filed a lawsuit.
Post edited June 16, 2015 by jamyskis
Posted June 16, 2015
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javihyuga: tl;dr Yes, Jim Sterling is a twat.
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htown1980: I reckon the character Jim Sterling plays is a twat, but I also reckon a lot of people don't pick up that he is playing a character.
And I play mass murdering, yet police fails to catch the joke. Tough life :/
Posted June 16, 2015
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jamyskis: No, no and no. In no free market do you get brownie points or get cut some slack just for "trying".
I'm not sure why your text quoted mine, it does not seem to be related?

I explicitly said that the product was worth the money that people paid for it. So I'm not sure where your strong rejection of "brownie points for just trying" is coming from and why it appears to be addressed at me.

If you disagree, then feel free to point out why exactly the game would not be worth 9 cents (for the people who bought it from DIG), or a dollar.
Posted June 16, 2015
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markrichardb: Oh? Do tell. *Leans forward uncomfortably close*
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jefequeso: It's actually not too big a deal. He made a video about my game The Moon Sliver and didn't like it. I said he could have at least put a link to the game in his video description. You know, just as a common courtesy, in case a few out of his vitriol-laden viewers actually wanted to check it out. And he just fluffed me off. I believe his exact words were "Yeah. Didn't though."

Maybe "asshole" is a bit of a strong word, but it's a surprisingly sore spot for me. Yeah, it's all well and good to go on about "that's what comes from charging money for something" and "you need a thick skin to be a game developer," but at the end of the day, no matter how prepared you are it's incredibly disheartening for someone with that much power and clout to treat your hard work like a joke, and you like an inconsequential piece of garbage. And for thousands of that person's peons to all be trying to out-hyperbole each other about what sort of horrible diseases your game inflicted upon them. Especially since that most draining, frustrating part of being an indie developer is already trying to convince people that you're more than an inconsequential piece of garbage.

The store page is extremely clear about what the game is, precisely because I didn't want to deal with people who hate "walking simulators" purchasing it and hating it simply because they aren't in tune with the sort of experience it's supposed to provide. You know, live and let live.
Thanks for sharing, and sorry to hear that. It's clear Jim isn't the plucky underdog any longer, being sixth on the Steam top curators list well above sites like Kotaku and IGN. It must be much more personal for a one-man developer to be criticized by a single independent critic than a games site where the writers tend to blur with the brand. Still…
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jefequeso: "that's what comes from charging money for something"
This will always be the bottom line. Being a creator is really tough.

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jamyskis: Journalists get dozens of games shipped to them each week by aspiring indie developers, and most of them just get tossed by the wayside and never even reviewed.
You ain't wrong. There’s just too many. Even if sites quadrupled their teams, they couldn't keep up.
Post edited June 16, 2015 by markrichardb
Posted June 16, 2015
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jefequeso: I haven't really watched any of his videos, but it seems like the only time I hear of him is when he's dragging some indie dev into the spotlight and going "look, everyone, let's point and laugh at the idiot." Take this instance. You've got some unknown guy who just had their creation smashed apart by Steam reviews, and made the unfortunate decision to lash out in an immature way. And you have Jim Sterling, one of the biggest players in new games media, jeering at them in front of his hundreds of thousands of fans, and making money off of it. That's bullying, pure and simple. That's picking on the mentally retarded kid in elementary school.
Jim Sterling is a bully who tries to dress his bullying in 'Protection of consumer and PC gaming' - which doesn't make him any less of a bully. Hell, I hate when TotalBiscuit lashes out on an indie game, which only ever happened a few times in his history, and even then he had a tendency of not actually attacking the devs and instead composing seemingly reasonable arguments - Jim Sterling is not even trying to do that. All he does is to cash as much money as humanly possible by being an arsehole.

I really wish SuperBunnyHop made more videos, I like him more and more with every piece of content he releases.
Posted June 16, 2015
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Impaler26: And if anyone wants to find out if DarkBase 01 is really as bad as most people think - I have a Desura Key for it to give away. Just reply if you want it.
Do you still have the Desura key? After the whole drama I'm really curious about the quality of the game. And it seems it was in on of the few Groupees Greenlight bundles that I don't own.
Posted June 16, 2015
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Fenixp: All he does is to cash as much money as humanly possible by being an arsehole.
For 10.000$ per month (cf. his patreon) a lot of people would gladly act like an asshole. It's nearly the salary of some of our ministers (without the advantages though)
Posted June 16, 2015
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Impaler26: And if anyone wants to find out if DarkBase 01 is really as bad as most people think - I have a Desura Key for it to give away. Just reply if you want it.
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PaterAlf: Do you still have the Desura key? After the whole drama I'm really curious about the quality of the game. And it seems it was in on of the few Groupees Greenlight bundles that I don't own.
PM sent. Enjoy! :)
Posted June 16, 2015
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Cyraxpt: Well, he has a point about the Steam Community! :)
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Elenarie: Same goes for a lot of people here.
Certainly but you shouldn't throw stones when you are sitting in a glasshouse...

Edit:
Seems like the forum has a hickup again...
Post edited June 16, 2015 by viperfdl
Posted June 16, 2015
Double Post. O.o
Post edited June 16, 2015 by Impaler26
Posted June 16, 2015
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Impaler26: PM sent. Enjoy! :)
Thank you!
Posted June 16, 2015
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gamesfreak64: same here.... i did read that every game has to have greenlight again....it was posted by an alawar dev.
alawar been around a while, i have a number of games of them (the drm free versions ofcourse)on retail cd/dvd or online.

i already posted that you cant prevent users buying possible crapgamesy buy having the devs to get a greenlight for every game they want to release on steam, once a while even the big gaming devs and /or distributors create/release a bunch of crappygames, its inevitable.
People should be smart enough to make sure they dont buy shittygames.
You can only protect younger customers by adding labels like contains violence, 16plus and more like that same goes for tvshows and movies, other then that its up to the parents to make sure their little kids (>16 or 18) dont buy crappy movies or games or play/watch crappy movies.

Same goes for kids health and change of getting to 'fat', governent cant and should not make laws that forces kids that might grow to fat , need extra excersises, that is up to the parents/caretakers of those minors :D
Its theire kids and they are the ones responsible for them aslong as they are under age.
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jefequeso: The thing about Greenlight, though, is that it's just a popularity contest, not a "quality contest." That's why you see stuff like Grass Simulator reaching #1 on Greenlight, getting through, and then getting butchered in reviews. The problem here isn't that devs can bypass Greenlight, the problem is the nature of Greenlight itself. If you force devs to go through Greenlight every time, you're just going to have that many more games tailored to be "Greenlight fodder" (ironic simulators, one-joke ideas, etc).

Really, despite my (thankfully starting to be disproven) misgivings with the refund system, it's really the best way to improve the quality of games on Steam. Being successful on Greenlight means having good marketing, it doesn't mean actually having a good product. Being successful with the new refund system means actually making a good game.
aha now i understand, thanks for the reply, so popularity of a product is what counts and not the quality of a product.
so basically you could have a 'crappy' game with lets say 4 squares bouncing around, no graphics no animations, but as long as the game manages to get popular, then it is okay ?

okay its perfectly clear now, thanks again for the reply it has been very helpful, i voted it up.
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This is my favourite topic
Community
General discussionGame dev has meltdown over negative reviews and takes his ball and goes home (145 posts)(145 posts)
(145 posts)